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Uberti 1873 Cattleman Hammer Replacement Problem


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I'm having trouble installing a new hammer/trigger assembly from Taylor's Firearms for my Uberti 1873 Cattleman II. I disassembled and reassembled it the exact same way but encountered a problem when cocking. The hammer will click 4 times and move to half-cock. Only when I pull back on the hammer very hard and hear a 5th click will it stay back in full cock position. Also, it sometimes releases with minimal pressure on the trigger once fully cocked. Is there something I installed incorrectly that's causing this or is there something wrong with the hammer?

 

Thanks in advance!

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First off, please list your SASS # as guest (we all know you’re not #8).  Without seeing what you did or what it’s doing now it’s going to be a guess.  There shouldn’t be 5 clicks.  I’d check: the hand to seer connection, the seer itself, the hand spring and plunger and the transfer bar, make sure that you assembled all the parts correctly.  When a SAA is fully cocked the trigger pull is very minimal compared to a semi automatic. Here is a link to the Taylor’s manual with parts breakdown: SAA Manual

 

  

 

Edited by Tequila Shooter
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Jonyaple, you've discovered that Colt style S.A. parts aren't "drop in" parts!  Some folks may get lucky and have a "functioning" revolver, others may have a better experience.  I'm sure you'll get some good ideas /suggestions here. (By the way, you CAN adjust the trigger pull to your liking .  .  .  you don't have to settle for "that's the way it is" l  Be careful!!!  Safety isn't just for you .  .  .  

 

Mike

Edited by 45 Dragoon
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I noticed that the hammer works normally with the 4 clicks and stays cocked when the cylinder is removed but once I replace the cylinder, it requires more force and requires a "5th click" before staying in the cocked position. Does this mean the bolt may be interfering with it?

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7 minutes ago, WOLFY said:

Hi, Did it require less force with the old trigger and hammer?

 

Hello,

The old hammer requires about the same amount of force as the new hammer with the cylinder removed. But once I insert the cylinder, the new hammer will have an extra 5th click before full cock and requires much more force.

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Um, the hammer itself  is different,  the hole for the hand is in a different place .  .  . again, these aren't drop in parts so .  .   .  call one of the  gunsmiths posted on a list in this forum and they can talk you through it. 

 

Mike 

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That 5th click isn’t supposed to be there.  If the pivot hole is not in the same place, you’re going to have to adjust your timing.

Edited by WOLFY
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My guess is that the OP wants 4 clicks rather that the new 3 click Uberti safety firing pin gadget that the new revolvers come with.  
 

I am not a gunsmith, nor do I play one on television, but my guess would be that replacing the hammer has changed the geometry of the hand, bolt, trigger & now the timing is off. 

 

My internet guess would be that the clicks with the new hammer and cylinder installed are 1 click-“safety” notch, 2 click-half cock, 3 click-bolt drop, 4 click-cylinder lock, 5 click-force the hammer back far enough to engage the full cock sear. Just a guess though, this is a job for a real gunsmith. 

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I am nowhere near an expert on the subject, but.....

How surprised were you by the screw, spring and plunger for the hand? When you put them back in, did you get them in the correct order? How far in did you tighten the screw?

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I was just going to mention what Hendo did.  That could make some weird issues that wouldn't be there with the cylinder removed.  If that is not it, then...as mentioned, the hand pivot hole is probably not in the exact same place (which I don't think is common on Uberti hammers. ) So  the hand is probably being pushed higher at full cock, and is straining against the already-locked cylinder to get to full cock.  When the bolt head dropped into the locking notch, that was the fourth click and the hammer reaching full cock should happen simultaneously, but if it comes later then that is a 5th click.   And because it barely made it to full cock, the trigger sear is probably barely in the notch.  This is not a problem with the cylinder removed for obvious reasons.  If everything else is timed right, I'm thinking you will need to take a little off the lower tooth of the hand.   I'd buy a spare hand and fit that one.   And no, I am not a gunsmith.  But I have Kuhnhausen's book (except it is 90 miles away).  Anywya, that's my unseen internet guess.

 

I have two sets of the 4-click parts from Taylors.  But I am just saving them for potential future guns.

Edited by Abilene, SASS # 27489
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20 hours ago, portugeejn said:

My guess is that the OP wants 4 clicks rather that the new 3 click Uberti safety firing pin gadget that the new revolvers come with.  
 

I am not a gunsmith, nor do I play one on television, but my guess would be that replacing the hammer has changed the geometry of the hand, bolt, trigger & now the timing is off. 

 

My internet guess would be that the clicks with the new hammer and cylinder installed are 1 click-“safety” notch, 2 click-half cock, 3 click-bolt drop, 4 click-cylinder lock, 5 click-force the hammer back far enough to engage the full cock sear. Just a guess though, this is a job for a real gunsmith. 

That's exactly why I changed it. Didn't like the new safety firing pin because I had multiple light primer strikes and wanted the 4 clicks as well.

 

19 hours ago, Hendo said:

I am nowhere near an expert on the subject, but.....

How surprised were you by the screw, spring and plunger for the hand? When you put them back in, did you get them in the correct order? How far in did you tighten the screw?

Yea, that thing was tiny.. I put it back the same way with the plunger first then spring and screw. Screw is flush with back.

 

19 hours ago, Abilene, SASS # 27489 said:

I was just going to mention what Hendo did.  That could make some weird issues that wouldn't be there with the cylinder removed.  If that is not it, then...as mentioned, the hand pivot hole is probably not in the exact same place (which I don't think is common on Uberti hammers. ) So  the hand is probably being pushed higher at full cock, and is straining against the already-locked cylinder to get to full cock.  When the bolt head dropped into the locking notch, that was the fourth click and the hammer reaching full cock should happen simultaneously, but if it comes later then that is a 5th click.   And because it barely made it to full cock, the trigger sear is probably barely in the notch.  This is not a problem with the cylinder removed for obvious reasons.  If everything else is timed right, I'm thinking you will need to take a little off the lower tooth of the hand.   I'd buy a spare hand and fit that one.   And no, I am not a gunsmith.  But I have Kuhnhausen's book (except it is 90 miles away).  Anywya, that's my unseen internet guess.

 

I have two sets of the 4-click parts from Taylors.  But I am just saving them for potential future guns.

 

I'll try and see what I can do with the hand. Thanks for all your help

 

 

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Just FYI from the ask me how I know department. 

I changed my "3 click" to a "4 click" and it was a drop in that worked perfect after I did some minor polishing to the hammer and sear. It was a feel thing, timing and everything else was fine.

I started having problems with the firing pin in my older Model P being a bit worn out by lots of use.

I couldn't find just the pin, so I just ordered the whole hammer. Ya know, been there, done that. I'm just changing out a four click for a four click, what could go wrong?

 

Well, it function checked on the bench fine, but went out time after the second round downrange at the match. I swapped the firing pins and put my old hammer back in and it works dandy now.

 

I guess the moral of this story is,

I ain't as smart as I think I am and I have no idea what might be wrong.

I would suggest having a good cowboy smith look at it before any damage is done.

 

I'll also add that if not for the generosity of Not So Dead Eye Maverick, Alamo Frank and Calamity Janey, I wouldn't have been able to finish that match where things went wrong.

Thank y'all so much.

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Wouldn’t defeating the “floating” firing pin and cutting a notch in the original hammer get the 4th click?  

 

Edited by WOLFY
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38 minutes ago, WOLFY said:

Wouldn’t defeating the “floating” firing pin and cutting a notch in the original hammer get the 4th click?  

 

In essence, yes, but there is a couple of "feel" differences. The trigger is farther forward and the half cock is slightly different on the 3 click setup. Not a big deal, I never had a light strike problem with mine, it was just throwing off my concentration at the tables. I honestly didn't notice it at the beep.

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Have you compared the new hammer to the old hammer yet?  Is the hole for the hand in the same place on the new hammer?  Be very careful with any adjustments you might want to make to the seer, a little too much off and you’ll be in a world of hurt.  I hope you’re a patient person because what your doing will require small adjustments then re-assembly, take apart and repeat. Let us know how you’re doing.

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Is the bolt dropping before the cylinder is in the correct position? If the bolt drops early locking up the cylinder, and the tooth on the hand is a little too long, it would be hard to bring into battery with the cylinder in place, but would appear to work fine with it out. Just a thought. The bolts are rarely a drop it part. Both it and the hand are expected to require fitting for each installation in order to get the timing correct. The 73 Colt is one of the simplest and most difficult guns to work on because it relies on so few parts to do so much. Every part must be fitted for use with every other part.

 

Snakebite  

Edited by Snakebite
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