Your not going to like this rumor ...

[John Boy]

Remington didn't just discontinue primers, Remington discontinued Remington.  Vista (Federal, Speer, CCI) bought the ammunition and component division, and we'll probably start producing products under that name sometime next year.  Rumor is it will be fall, at the soonest.

Note the we’ll .... From a fella that lives near the Remington plant in Marysville, MO .. wasn’t stated name change or production 

 

Tim’s reply .... John, I can't find anything on when all the furloughed employees are returning to work.  Lots of articles about it, but no dates.

[John Kloehr]

The Remington name has value (goodwill), and that was certainly part of the price Vista paid. The Remington name will be on the shelves again.

 

Several hundred employees have been working during the ownership transition, and a few hundred more are supposedly going to be called back "soon."

 

I don't think it will take a year to see production running again, but I see nothing in the pipeline at this time. I could see 9mm UMC (another company "name" Remington bought years ago) showing up in a few months.

 

Steel-cased Wolf is showing up at retail around here sporadically.

[Singin' Sue 71615]

[J-BAR #18287]

I fear for percussion caps.  Remington #10s are the most popular among CAS Frontiersman shooters.  We are a very small niche in the shooting community.  Hope we can survive.

[John Kloehr]

Percussion caps were the only primers I saw on AmmoSeek the last time I looked. Even all the 209s are gone and all the CCI from last month is also gone.

[twelve mile REB]

Who purchased the Rifle and shotgun line?

[Captain Clark]

3 minutes ago, twelve mile REB said:

Who purchased the Rifle and shotgun line?

Round hill group, which is a bit of an unknown from what I’ve read. Conjecture is that the firearms will be still be branded as Remington. The trademark name will be licensed much like Winchester is used by Olin.

[Sedalia Dave]

Personally I don't care what name they put on the package as long as they start making and selling primers again.

[Cholla]

Comments made by Vista Outdoor CEO and Director Christopher Metz during the company’s quarterly earnings call last month indicate ammunition will continue to be scare well into 2021.

“We currently have over a year’s worth of orders for ammunition in excess of $1 billion,” he said in his opening remarks. “This is unprecedented for our company. With demand far outstripping supply and inventory levels in the channel at all-time lows, we see strong demand continuing…”

He cautioned there are notable differences between today’s low-cartridge inventories and that of 2016, which may indicate the current situation may be longer lasting. Metz explained the volume of new shooters is one driving factor.

“According to data from the NSSF, there are 6.2 million new shooters in 2020. This rate is more than twice the number of new shooters in the former surge. Anecdotally, there is no shortage of reports of sold out shooting ranges and backlogged firearm safety classes around the country.”

In addition, the broader demographic of enthusiasts, “…has led to an increase in participation as they learn and enjoy their new purchases,” he said. “Data from the NSSF indicates these shooters are more diverse, with large increases in both women and people of color entering the sport.”

“We have cleaned inventory in all retail and wholesale locations,” Metz said. “Despite us producing flat out for 6 months, there is no buildup of inventory at any of our customers. In fact, every one of them would like significantly more. Simply put, consumer demand continues to outpace our ability to supply.”

The good news is that Vista Outdoor has purchased the ammunition factory in Lonoke, AR—formerly owned by Remington Outdoor—and churning it back toward production at or near full capacity. The Northwest Arkansas Democrat Gazette reports 300 employees furloughed by the former owner of the plant will soon be recalled to join nearly 400 still working at the facility.

Regardless of manufacturer, demand is heavy and inventory low. The trend began early in 2020 and as early as August—during Olin’s quarterly report (parent company of Winchester Ammunition)—company CEO John Fischer warned investors that, “We expect this elevated level of demand to continue at least until the end of the year.”

[J. Frank Norfleet]

So how does a company go bankrupt with a billion in backorders? That takes some serious mis-management.

JFN

[Kid Rich]

15 minutes ago, J. Frank Norfleet said:

So how does a company go bankrupt with a billion in backorders? That takes some serious mis-management.

JFN

I think it is Vista with the billion in backorders not Remington.

kR

[J. Frank Norfleet]

18 minutes ago, Kid Rich said:

I think it is Vista with the billion in backorders not Remington.

kR

You're probably right, I still think there has been some serious mis-management.

JFN

[Kid Rich]

2 minutes ago, J. Frank Norfleet said:

You're probably right, I still think there has been some serious mis-management.

JFN

Probably? I just read the quote, it is from Vista. No question there was mismanagement from Remington.

kR

[Dantankerous]

Hope is all not lost!

 

I just hope Santa gets my letter soon!

 

[Chickamauga Slim]

1 hour ago, J. Frank Norfleet said:

So how does a company go bankrupt with a billion in backorders? That takes some serious mis-management.

JFN

Simple math:

If your outgo exceeds your income, then your upkeep will be your downfall.

Works for lemonade stands, households, small businesses & huge corporations equally.

[Swiss Kid, SASS #54030]

14 minutes ago, Chickamauga Slim said:

Simple math:

If your outgo exceeds your income, then your upkeep will be your downfall.

Works for lemonade stands, households, small businesses & huge corporations equally.

Except for the government spending.

 

[Badlands Bob #61228]

I hope somebody in management is looking at the lost opportunity numbers.  Ammo is a consumable.  If they could produce it, they could sell it and somebody would shoot it up, then buy more.  This ammo shortage seems like it's repeating every 4 years with the election cycle.  If they can't produce it, they can't sell it.  You don't make any money off of backorders.   Doesn't take a genius to figure out that you could buy a lot of equipment with the profit off of a billion dollars in sales.

[Blackwater 53393]

Of course there was mismanagement at Remington!!  Any time a profit taking organization acquires a large company with the intent to turn a quick buck, there will be intentional mismanagement!!  That's how it's done!!  The owners were NOT interested in building a solid, profitable, long term business operation.  They are simply trying to accumulate assets that can be sold at a profit!!  Don't think for a minute that the individuals who sold off all the parts of Remington under this bankruptcy lost money!!!  

 

The mismanagement was intentional and systematic!!  It happens in the business arena year after year as stock trading pirates raid solid business ventures and cash in on the sale of and dissolution of operations, facilities, raw materials, and tooling.

 

[Marshal TKD, Sass # 36984L]

2 hours ago, J. Frank Norfleet said:

So how does a company go bankrupt with a billion in backorders? That takes some serious mis-management.

JFN

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/05/01/magazine/remington-guns-jobs-huntsville.html

Part of the article from The NY Times 

 

“In April 2012, Cerberus did something fateful, which probably seemed smart at the time. It had Remington borrow hundreds of millions of dollars and use it to buy the holding company’s debt, effectively transferring responsibility for the principal and the interest payments onto Remington. America’s oldest gun company now owed the money that Cerberus had used to pay itself back for having bought the company in the first place. There were plenty of sensible reasons to do this. Gun sales were high, and the debt that Remington took out was cheaper to service than the paid-in-kind debt.

But there was a catch. Because the operating company borrowed the money with a normal loan — and not with PIK notes — interest payments were required in cash. Suddenly Remington was carrying hundreds of millions of dollars in debt that, if it could not be paid, would cause the business to go bankrupt.

By the time the factory opened in Huntsville, the various players stood in vastly different positions. The private-equity firm had made back its initial investment and was playing with house money. Remington owed hundreds of millions that it hadn’t borrowed. And its workers, urgently, had to make a lot of guns.”

 

 

 

[Sedalia Dave]

It wasn't mis-management it was intentional. It was all about fast cash and the short game.  Too bad the SEC cannot step in and put a stop to this. All it does is make a few people filthy rich while destroying the lives of the worker bees.

[Abilene Slim SASS 81783]

10 hours ago, J. Frank Norfleet said:

Deleted. Others have responded better than me. 

[Trailrider #896]

E. Remington & Sons was sold and became Remington Arms, which became Remington-UMC, which became... etc, etc.   The name will probably survive.

Stay well and safe, Pards!

Happy Holidays! (8th night of Hanukah!)

[Yusta B.]

8 hours ago, Blackwater 53393 said:

Of course there was mismanagement at Remington!!  Any time a profit taking organization acquires a large company with the intent to turn a quick buck, there will be intentional mismanagement!!  That's how it's done!!  The owners were NOT interested in building a solid, profitable, long term business operation.  They are simply trying to accumulate assets that can be sold at a profit!!  Don't think for a minute that the individuals who sold off all the parts of Remington under this bankruptcy lost money!!!  

 

The mismanagement was intentional and systematic!!  It happens in the business arena year after year as stock trading pirates raid solid business ventures and cash in on the sale of and dissolution of operations, facilities, raw materials, and tooling.

 

 

"The farging bastages" (Johnny Dangerously)

[Ripsaw]

I thought Remington was a victim of lawsuits after the Sandy Hook shooting? No? 

[Sedalia Dave]

12 minutes ago, Ripsaw said:

I thought Remington was a victim of lawsuits after the Sandy Hook shooting? No? 

 

They were sued. However AFAIK all of the law suits were tossed out. 

[Ripsaw]

7 minutes ago, Sedalia Dave said:

 

They were sued. However AFAIK all of the law suits were tossed out. 

OK, after a search, I read from multiple sources that SCOTUS allowed the families to sue Remington. I think their ploy was to go bankrupt to avoid the lawsuits. Not real clear exactly how that all played out but we saw the result this year. 

[Scarlett]

On 12/16/2020 at 7:54 PM, J-BAR #18287 said:

I fear for percussion caps.  Remington #10s are the most popular among CAS Frontiersman shooters.  We are a very small niche in the shooting community.  Hope we can survive.

Our suppliers had a lot of caps (not sure if they were #10s) the last time I looked - last couple of weeks. We have never ordered them but I could.... if I might help email me at bulletsbyscarlett@gmail.com

 

Merry Christmas Hugs!

Scarlett