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Rye Miles #13621

Congrats Tampa Bay

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The thing I'm most glad about is they beat the CHEATING Astros!

 

Go Tampa Bay!!

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Charlie Morton was tossing laser beams last night, the best I've seen him pitch since coming to the Rays. I thought that Cash's starting lineup in games 5 and 6 was questionable at best but he had a good lineup last night. Until a couple of weeks ago, I had never heard of Randy Arozarena, now all baseball fans know who he is. What a speedster who can hit!

 

Glad the beat the cheaters and hope they can win the World Series.

 

GO RAYS

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19 minutes ago, Cypress Sun said:

Charlie Morton was tossing laser beams last night, the best I've seen him pitch since coming to the Rays. I thought that Cash's starting lineup in games 5 and 6 was questionable at best but he had a good lineup last night. Until a couple of weeks ago, I had never heard of Randy Arozarena, now all baseball fans know who he is. What a speedster who can hit!

 

Glad the beat the cheaters and hope they can win the World Series.

 

GO RAYS

I always back the American league team in the World Series (Cleveland is in the AL) but NOT the Astros!

GO TAMPA!!:)

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Both ALCS and NLCS have shown us some excellent playing.  

 

I'm rooting for the Dodgers just because they are the team from California.  

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No matter which team wins the World Series, there will probably be an asterisk next to the team name and people will say that the win doesn't count due to a shortened season. Truth is that every team played 60 games, had expanded playoffs and all of it was played under unusual, stressful circumstances. I congratulate all of the teams for the effort to provide the fans with a baseball season.....even if it was shortened.

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Did the Astros cheat this season too?????

 

Well.....did they???????????

Edited by Waxahachie Kid #17017 L

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First we got the Lightning up top, now we have the Rays, Bucs won tonight too and Rowdies are top of their division.

 

Wife and I were dodger fans when we lived in LA, so if they win tonight, it's gonna be a tough game to choose sides on.

 

the Tampa Bay area is like a slice of paradise and I'm glad to see it getting some attention

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Dodgers and Rays Tuesday night 8:00 est

 

Go Tampa!!;)

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Did the Astros cheat this season too???

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30 minutes ago, Waxahachie Kid #17017 L said:

Did the Astros cheat this season too???

 

No one knows but probably not. Regardless of what year it is, the Astros and Red Sox both cheated in past years......therefore they are known as cheaters. The cheater tag will be with both for quite some time.

 

There's an old saying, "Once a cheater, always a cheater". It mainly applies to marital fidelity but it applies here also. None of the players involved were fined or punished. They cheating players should have been banned for life with no chance of re-instatement.

 

Is it is hard on a fan of the cheating team/player? Of course it is because there is nothing that the fan can say or do to justify the cheating or cheater. I'll put it this way, if a dog attacks you without being provoked, do you ever trust that dog again? Of course not....but then again most dogs that do that don't get a second chance.

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So...that also means that there may not be any "statue of limitations", on being called/considered a cheater...which means the Chicago White Sox should not have won the World Series in 2005, since they cheated in the 1917 World Series.

(I have not heard of a Red Sox cheating scandal)

 

The White Sox cheating was wrong...only a lot of time has passed since it happened. Does the passing of a lot time mean the team finally can not be called/considered/labelled "cheaters?" So, to that way of thinking, 103 years from now, the Astros team may have a chance at not be labeled "cheaters" any longer?

Maybe the "statue of limitations" would be when all those, that hold a grudge, have passed away. Humm....interesting.

 

Individual players have, and do cheat. Too much pine tar on the bat. A small file in the pitchers pocket, to scrape the ball. Wetting the ball with spit/sweat. Players betting on games they are involved in. Stealing signs is not new. Perhaps the whole organization was not implicated, but players try to steal signs. The runner on second base, could. The first and third base coaches could. Anything to gain an edge.

Should the teams they play with, be labeled as "cheaters?"

 

Yet to win the Series, the Astros still had to bat, and get hits, and score runs, even if they knew what pitch was coming. Knowing what pitch is coming will give you a big edge, but it won't guarantee you'll get a hit, and/or get a base, or a run. Stealing signals doesn't mean the other team will lay down and forfeit the game! They still had to have their pitching staff strike out batters, and they still had to catch flies, and grounders, and put people out. I am not excusing their behavior, it was, and is wrong, and that team, and organization, deserved whatever punishment they received.

A label is one that should be affixed to the one's, at the time, that are cheating.

Do we imprison the children, as well as the adults who committed a crime?

 

Obviously the Astros made it into the playoffs, this year, and the powers-that-be did not, or have not yet, detected any cheating.

 

The Astros did cheat, and were caught. Who knows how many other teams, down through the years, have done things, and not gotten caught.

That team, at that point-in-time, cheated, and that team, at that point-in-time can legitimately be called "cheaters".

Today's team cannot legitimately be called that, since there is no proof, yet, they did that this time.

The White Sox team, in 1917, could be called "cheaters", but the subsequent team's could not....wouldn't you say?

 

I have no dog in this hunt. Sports, to me, is not anywhere near the top of my care list, right now, considering all the other things we are dealing with, at this time.

But to be fair, and consistent, we should look at today's teams, and place any blame, or labels, on the one's that were involved at that particular place and time. The guilty should be punished (not up to us, as to the severity, up to MLB), and can be labeled "cheaters".  Subsequent teams, with no proof of doing anything wrong...should they be? Really? 

 

 

John 8:7

 

   

 

 

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Yes, they should.

 

The same players cheated in previous years are still on the team. The players from the 1917 White Sox team are all dead. I think it's fair to call the Astros "cheaters" simply because the Astro's were punished (slapped on the hand) as an team and not on an individual basis. Same with the Red Sox. The real shame is that the Astros have/had some incredibly talented players and there really was no need to cheat to win.

 

 

 

 

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In the case of the White Sox, all the players involved went to trial, in 1921, and were found not guilty.

 

However, the baseball powers-that-be later decided to ban eight of the players, and later the Hall of Fame added their decision to prohibit their possible inclusion into the Hall.

 

The players involved played most of the 1920 season, but were suspended by Comiskey while in the playoff run, with the Indians. It was believed at the time that the suspension, at this point in the season, may have cost the White Sox the American League pennant.

 

So most of the same players were on the team, in 1920, that played in the 1919 World Series, as are some/most of the Astros still on the team, this year.

 

Both incidences seem to have similar traits.

1. The players that were on the 1919 team, played on the 1920 team....same as the Astros situation.

2. It seems the punishment was not as severe, for the White Sox, in a lot of people's minds back then. This is the same mindset concerning the punishment for the Astros.

 

A team's punishment is not up to the public to decide. It is not up to the team that is accused.

Whatever punishment, that is handed down, is what it is. No person, or team, will plead for a more harsh punishment.

Is it fair? Depends on your own beliefs. Some would say no, some would say yes, some would say maybe, some would say it did not go far enough.

Right, wrong, or sideways, that is/was the decision...like it or not....and everyone is stuck with the decision/results.

 

The White Sox are finally exonerated, since all who were on that team, and in the organization, and alive to witness the events, at that time, are dead as hammers.

I must presume the same exoneration will not happen for the Astros until all who were on that team, and in the organization, and alive to witness the events, at that time, are also dead as hammers. 

 

Then, the angst will be satisfied....maybe.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Waxahachie Kid #17017 L

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As long as professional athletes, who are looked up to by children and are payed obscene amounts of money to play a game, cheat and get away with it (The Astros still have their trophy, don't they) the angst will not subside.... nor should it.  The players involved and the members of the organization who took part in that dastardly plan to cheat at a basic game in front of the nation should forever bear the mark of that deed.

 

Instead, they are held up as heroes to the young of Houston, Texas, and young baseball fans everywhere....  Maybe the millennials have it right, quit keeping score and just give everyone a participation trophy, maybe that will keep these grown men from cheating at the same game that is played by children in schoolyards.

 

There is no room for cheating, or those who do it... anywhere.

 

 

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3 hours ago, Cypress Sun said:

Yes, they should.

 

The same players cheated in previous years are still on the team. The players from the 1917 White Sox team are all dead. I think it's fair to call the Astros "cheaters" simply because the Astro's were punished (slapped on the hand) as an team and not on an individual basis. Same with the Red Sox. The real shame is that the Astros have/had some incredibly talented players and there really was no need to cheat to win.

 

 

 

 

I think the only people that got fired was the manager and general manager.:o

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41 minutes ago, Rye Miles #13621 said:

I think the only people that got fired was the manager and general manager.:o

 

Quite correct. I meant that none of the players received disciplinary measures. 

 

BTW, the Rays were one of the teams that were probably affected by the Astro's cheating during last years playoffs. 

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In any event, Congrats to the Rays and the Dodgers for making it to the World Series!  As much as I would prefer to see the Dodgers blow out the Rays in four straight games, I know there is little chance of that.  I am hoping for exciting games.

 

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