SteamPunk.... Yes or No

[Texas Mac 3]

I (Texas Flower) have written several articles about Steampunk costumes for The Cowboy Chronicle.  In them, I have given a description of why/how steampunk is connected to the Victorian Era.  Steampunk costumes are based on what Victorians were wearing with the thought in mind of how they might envision themselves looking in the future.  Cat Ballou added the Steampunk COSTUME category at EOT 2018.  It is a costume category only.  Some clubs offer a "local" Steampunk shooting category, but it is NOT a shooting category for SASS.  Clubs that offer the shooting category would determine the "rules."  For information and pictures regarding Steampunk, please refer to my articles in The Chronicle...May 2016, September 2016, and January 2019.  Also, see Kathouse Kellie's article in the April 2018 edition and Cat Ballou's article in the October 2018 edition.   I do dress Steampunk for fun, and several lady shooters have told me they did not care much for the costuming until Steampunk came along.  BTY: The theme for Comin At Cha the end of this month is Steampunk!  We will be looking for and judging Steampunk Costumes!

[Rolan Kraps, SASS # 24084 Life 363]

On 9/2/2020 at 3:16 PM, Creeker, SASS #43022 said:

I like it.

Rocky Horror Hombre.

Frank-N-Furter Fishnet Frontier Cartridge.

 

Riff Raff Rawhide....

Hmm that might have some inappropriate innuendo

 

I actually wrote a match based on Rocky Horror.  I called it the "Rocky Western Picture Show"

 

 

 

[Rolan Kraps, SASS # 24084 Life 363]

My Halloween costume from work today.  

Steampunk Santa!

 

 

[watab kid 979]

On 9/1/2020 at 9:38 AM, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

If "they" want to make SP a costuming subset of BW, go for it.

 

But we don't need a costuming category...

im with phantom on this , that is what i would think the appropriate way to add it with its "movie connection" 

[Rafe Conager SASS #56958 409]

If it gets folks shooting why not! Now it's not my cup of tea.

Rafe 

[Ron "Ironhead" Smith 172]

On 9/1/2020 at 7:18 AM, Matthew Duncan said:

 

Excellent way to dilute SASS into something else.

 

Do you realize the first steampunk type novel was written in 1868? Many of the dime novels of the era were steampunk as was Jules Verne. Both the TV show to a degree and the movie "Wild Wild West" were steampunk as well. Here's the cover of the first steampunk novel.

 

Edited October 30, 2020 by Ron "Ironhead" Smith

[Griff 1,440]

On 9/2/2020 at 11:18 AM, Assassin said:

Why did they get rid of the Modern category? 

On 9/2/2020 at 2:48 PM, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

Because someone wanted a better chance at winning a Championship.

Actually, the "Traditional" category came about because those shooting "Colt" pattern pistols didn't have the "adjustable sights" advantage the "Modern" quasi replicas enjoyed.  Nearly 10 years of shooting were under the belt before someone shooting a fixed sighted "Colt" pattern revolver won overall.  Then, after MORE than 10 years of no one shooting a "Modern" adjustable sighted revolver winning the overall it became apparent that there wasn't really a stigma (disadvantage if you insist(), to using either.  Moving pistol targets in to distances where "Buntlines" were in danger of hitting the targets before the gun was fired, also contributed to the lack of any advantage going to adjustable sighted guns.

[H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619 1,045]

6 hours ago, Griff said:

Actually, the "Traditional" category came about because those shooting "Colt" pattern pistols didn't have the "adjustable sights" advantage the "Modern" quasi replicas enjoyed.  Nearly 10 years of shooting were under the belt before someone shooting a fixed sighted "Colt" pattern revolver won overall.  Then, after MORE than 10 years of no one shooting a "Modern" adjustable sighted revolver winning the overall it became apparent that there wasn't really a stigma (disadvantage if you insist(), to using either.  Moving pistol targets in to distances where "Buntlines" were in danger of hitting the targets before the gun was fired, also contributed to the lack of any advantage going to adjustable sighted guns.

 

Agreed.

 

But given this reality, why are adjustable sights not allowed in every category?   Not so much so for the Colt New Frontier that I don't have, but my antique S&W New Model 3 target model and other of the era guns that did have adjustables back in the day.

 

[Griff 1,440]

2 hours ago, H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619 said:

Agreed.

But given this reality, why are adjustable sights not allowed in every category?   Not so much so for the Colt New Frontier that I don't have, but my antique S&W New Model 3 target model and other of the era guns that did have adjustables back in the day.

There are other advantages the break-top S&W enjoys over the Colt pattern revolvers besides the adjustable sights.  Back in the day, (SASS days), when only one revolver was used, it was far more common to have revolver reloads.  Another reason they were assigned to the "modern" category.  Just like the Ruger "Old Army" wasn't allowed in the "Black Powder" category due to it's adjustable sights.  As categories changed, 1st the change of the cap and ball only "black powder" to "frontier cartridge" those same perceived advantages still existed, and the exclusions were carried forward.  And since a hue and cry has not been raised by the masses, these distinctions remain in place.

 

But... I believe you've heard this all before?

[H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619 1,045]

2 hours ago, Griff said:

There are other advantages the break-top S&W enjoys over the Colt pattern revolvers besides the adjustable sights.  Back in the day, (SASS days), when only one revolver was used, it was far more common to have revolver reloads.  Another reason they were assigned to the "modern" category.  Just like the Ruger "Old Army" wasn't allowed in the "Black Powder" category due to it's adjustable sights.  As categories changed, 1st the change of the cap and ball only "black powder" to "frontier cartridge" those same perceived advantages still existed, and the exclusions were carried forward.  And since a hue and cry has not been raised by the masses, these distinctions remain in place.

 

But... I believe you've heard this all before?

 

For the most part, yes.

I just admit to not understanding why there are still restrictions on adjustable sights. 

I will also admit there are a LIMITED number of other prohibitions that don't make sense to me.   I do understand the idea that "because those are the rules," and I therefore respect them as the rules.   I just don't get why they ARE the rules.

 

If that makes any sense...

 

[Jabez Cowboy,SASS # 50129 1,298]

No !!!

 

Jabez Cowboy

[Buckshot Bob 1,000]

On 9/1/2020 at 9:03 AM, bgavin said:

And no storm troopers... 

Solo was kinda cowboy. That b western blaster holster 

[Matthew Duncan 1,250]

On 10/30/2020 at 6:45 PM, Ron "Ironhead" Smith said:

 

Do you realize the first steampunk type novel was written in 1868? Many of the dime novels of the era were steampunk as was Jules Verne. Both the TV show to a degree and the movie "Wild Wild West" were steampunk as well. Here's the cover of the first steampunk novel.

 

 

Do you realize Jules Verne wrote "Earth to Moon" in 1865?  Does that mean we need an "astronaut" category too?

[Sedalia Dave 12,002]

Yes to Steam Punk.

 

If we don't grow our membership we are going to die a slow death.

[DeaconKC 1,312]

3 hours ago, Buckshot Bob said:

Solo was kinda cowboy. That b western blaster holster 

And he did let out a fine whoop when he blasted the TIE Fighter in the trench!

[Revolvgang 53]

NO!

Enough is enough.

[Captain Bill Burt 2,999]

I could see Classic Cowboy shooters having a problem with Steampunk, but it's a bit surprising that B-Western shooters would. 

 

They're both essentially costume categories, yeah I know there is a gun and leather requirement for B-Western, but nothing major.  There's support for Steampunk western TV shows, just as there's support for B-Western TV shows.  There weren't many Steampunk westerns, but there were some. 

[Major BS Walker Regulator 602]

Have no problem if someone wants to dress that way. Shot with several last week at the Southeast Regional and I returned home with no visible after effects.

[Chert Rock Chuck 130]

Sad that some folks feel that the choice of category others choose to shoot in are ”silly” or “to place somewhere from 1-3”.

Very elitist attitude that belongs anywhere other than Cowboy in my opinion.

B Western is not my choice, but not what I would call  “silly” or an effort to win a participation trophy.

Classic Cowboy is likely the most realistic of category requirements, (other than costume rules) again my opinion. The combination of guns and shooting style requirements are a level of difficulty not imposed on other categories.

Chert Rock

Edited November 2, 2020 by Chert Rock Chuck
Grammar weren’t up to snuff!

[Ron "Ironhead" Smith 172]

11 hours ago, Matthew Duncan said:

 

Do you realize Jules Verne wrote "Earth to Moon" in 1865?  Does that mean we need an "astronaut" category too?

Yes and unlike the dime novels mentioned above it was not a western theme. The root of steampunk is western and you'll just have to suck it up buttercup.
 

8 hours ago, Captain Bill Burt said:

I could see Classic Cowboy shooters having a problem with Steampunk, but it's a bit surprising that B-Western shooters would. 

 

They're both essentially costume categories, yeah I know there is a gun and leather requirement for B-Western, but nothing major.  There's support for Steampunk western TV shows, just as there's support for B-Western TV shows.  There weren't many Steampunk westerns, but there were some. 

Yep but there were many period dime novels that were what what became steampunk. If you think about it steampunk has a better claim to being period than B Western does. That said if folks want to get to anal there is always NCOWS.

[ShadowCatcher 222]

Responding to the OP.

 

Steampunk is a subset of the science fiction genre that poses an alternative history where 20th century technology operates in the 19th century Victorian age, portraying a world of modern machines in an age of steam power. The word “steampunk” was originally coined in 1987 by fiction writer K.W. Jeter but the term has gained wide appeal not only to describe literature and film but to denote a retro-future design sensibility.

 

The definition of Steampunk has broadened to include a style of clothing with “retro-tech accessories” such as brass goggles and clockwork gears. This sensibility has extended to conventions, paintings, computer keyboards and monitors, as well as film, examples of which would include "The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen," "Van Helsing," and "The Golden Compass."

 

Steampunk works are often set in an alternative history of the Victorian era or the American Wild West, where steam power remains in mainstream use, or in a fantasy world that similarly employs steam power.

 

 FWIW I like it and would dress accordingly, it no more detracts from the game than those who wear absolutely the least amount of western garb and are all about speed only.

 

YMMV

 

SC

[Creeker, SASS #43022 2,479]

2 hours ago, ShadowCatcher said:

FWIW I like it and would dress accordingly, it no more detracts from the game than those who wear absolutely the least amount of western garb and are all about speed only.

 

The debate is NOT about allowing the garb, the regalia or the concept (those are all completely legal RIGHT NOW).

 

The ONLY three valid points of debate of are: 

WHAT costuming/ equipment would be required/ denied by a codified Steampunk category?

DOES the addition of these costuming/ equipment aspects change the level of difficulty to the point that these proponents CANNOT equally or fairly compete with others that are not taking part in the same costuming/ equipment aspect?

AND

IF SO; does a shooters voluntary choice to increase their personal difficulty entitle them to a protected category so they have only have to compete with others making the same VOLUNTARY choice? 

 

 

[Captain Bill Burt 2,999]

41 minutes ago, Creeker, SASS #43022 said:

 

The debate is NOT about allowing the garb, the regalia or the concept (those are all completely legal RIGHT NOW).

 

The ONLY three valid points of debate of are: 

WHAT costuming/ equipment would be required/ denied by a codified Steampunk category?

DOES the addition of these costuming/ equipment aspects change the level of difficulty to the point that these proponents CANNOT equally or fairly compete with others that are not taking part in the same costuming/ equipment aspect?

AND

IF SO; does a shooters voluntary choice to increase their personal difficulty entitle them to a protected category so they have only have to compete with others making the same VOLUNTARY choice? 

 

 

You mean like Black Powder, Classic Cowboy, etc?

[ShadowCatcher 222]

On 8/31/2020 at 7:30 PM, Sheriff Sam said:

Does SASS allow any type of costuming for a steam punk category at all? If so where can I find more information on it please

 

Yes it's allowed, and Rolan Kraps has provided a lot of useful information on it somewhere around the third or fourth response.

There isn't a recognized steampunk category though, and frankly there are so many it's crazy (IMNSHO).

You can also search on Youtube and find some videos of folks doing their part.

Folks do it in many places.  There are a lot of opinions about it, just like about everything else. 

 

SC

Edited November 2, 2020 by ShadowCatcher

[Creeker, SASS #43022 2,479]

23 minutes ago, Captain Bill Burt said:

You mean like Black Powder, Classic Cowboy, etc?

Absolutely.  Those three points should be the only criteria under which categories are added.

But you must use all three - not cherry pick to approve or deny.

[Captain Bill Burt 2,999]

20 minutes ago, Creeker, SASS #43022 said:

Absolutely.  Those three points should be the only criteria under which categories are added.

But you must use all three - not cherry pick to approve or deny.

Seems reasonable to me.

[Creeker, SASS #43022 2,479]

AND as a point within the three points of debate...

WILL a given category, if offered, have a broad enough participation base to   recognize it as a viable competitive category?

 

I also believe that ALL categories/ excluding childrens (and womens outside the base categories) should have a review by SASS every two years - utilizing the shooter numbers from the 10 largest annual shoots to determine viable competitive categories and those that are perpetually under represented.  And use this information to either collapse categories where needed or explore opportunities to add others. 

[Marshal Chance Morgun 1,006]

On 9/1/2020 at 7:44 AM, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

 

Like what?....

Then what's your solution to rebuild membership?

OLG

OLG, Not looking you argue with you, but I don't see Steam Punk as a recruiting tool. People post that when they try to get new shooters, a common response is a complaint about costuming. I'm sure that there are some current shooters that would give it a try, but I don't see people coming in because of it. 

 

Edited November 3, 2020 by Marshal Chance Morgun

[Marshal Chance Morgun 1,006]

On 11/1/2020 at 11:14 AM, Major BS Walker Regulator said:

Have no problem if someone wants to dress that way. Shot with several last week at the Southeast Regional and I returned home with no visible after effects.

You do know that the quarantine period is two weeks, right?

[Major BS Walker Regulator 602]

I have always enjoyed the creativeness of the Steampunk mindset. With that in mind and the passing of Sean Connery this weekend, last night I watched The League of Extradentary Gentlemen in his honor.  

[MizPete 1,259]

I've always thought that "our" era is more Edwardian than Victorian (late 19th century).  Other than that I have no objection to Steampunk as a shooting category.  Though I think we have way too many categories.  I know - make up yer mind.  Sigh.

[The Original Lumpy Gritz 7,203]

4 hours ago, Marshal Chance Morgun said:

OLG, Not looking you argue with you, but I don't see Steam Punk as a recruiting tool. People post that when they try to get new shooters, a common response is a complaint about costuming. I'm sure that there are some current shooters that would give it a try, but I don't see people coming in because of it. 

 

Doesn't hurt to give it a go.

Does opens up more choices in outfits.

OLG 

[watab kid 979]

 

ive never had an issue with the look , ive been attending the renessance festival for years just to watch people , oh and drink a pint or two and eat a bit , we need a bit of levity and acceptance [strange from a staunch conservative huh] to keep things interesting , ive always found those into the steampunk very interesting folks that were quite aimiable at the campfire as well as fun to shoot with , we need to keep it traditional western - not going star wars past a certain point of an individual match , has to be fun but has to retain its traditions , 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Palmetto Jack 4]

On 9/1/2020 at 8:18 AM, Matthew Duncan said:

 

Excellent way to dilute SASS into something else.

Sure - Circus clowns with double rigs.  Might just bring in more folks.....

[watab kid 979]

"...Actually, the "Traditional" category came about because those shooting "Colt" pattern pistols didn't have the "adjustable sights" advantage the "Modern" quasi replicas enjoyed. ..."

 

i did not think adjustaable sights were allowed - ive always shot traditional revolvers and the adjustables just seem wrong for this game but then im old and miss a lot of changes since i wont deviate from traditional guns , im in it for the shooting and traditional aspects of the times but i might just be becoming an exception to the rules - wont be the first time , wont be the last , how did this thread get so sidwize  ? - not that im complaining , im good with the discussions