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Tom Bullweed

Problem with John Wayne??!!

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SASS handbook in B-Western requirements states the details of costumes: shirts, Jean's, etc and then states 'John Wayne, spaghetti westerns, and townspeople are not acceptable.'

 

The Duke made dozens of B-Westerns as Singing Sandy and other characters where he exactly matched SASS B-Western rules: fancy boots, rolled up Jean's, no suspenders, fancy shorts, scarf, big felt hat, fancy leather.

 

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I think the rule book says no horse....He is out....

 

Texas Lizard

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Come on, it is what it is. The folks decided that the typical JW dress wasn't in line with what they envisioned for the BW category. 

 

Wanna dress like JW? Go for!

 

Just not in BW.

 

Cheers!

Phantom

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Posted (edited)

There's A grade star JW, and B movie JW.   I'd bet that some of the B movie John Wayne characters would fit the category just fine.  Just don't tell the JUDGES that you are dressed as a JW character.   :lol:  Might have to go more fancy than almost all of JW's shirts, though.

 

Good luck, GJ

Edited by Garrison Joe, SASS #60708
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John Wayne could shoot any category he wanted to.  JMO.

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4 minutes ago, MizPete said:

John Wayne could shoot any category he wanted to.  JMO.

Except BW

 

:rolleyes:

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PLUS ONE too Phantom (Both)

 

"B" Western isn't an individual.  It's the entire mystique.  Figure it out.

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6 minutes ago, Colorado Coffinmaker said:

 

PLUS ONE too Phantom (Both)

 

"B" Western isn't an individual.  It's the entire mystique.  Figure it out.

The SASS handbook specifically identifies John Wayne (with no other details) as 'not acceptable' for BW.

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Be real.  The typical JW attire in western B-movies meets bare SASS requirements for anything BUT a costume category.  Seriously, look at the basic costume requirements... then look at a typically dressed JW character in any of his " B" movies.  While many of his characters played cowboys, would you say they meet the requirements of SASS' "Classic Cowboy"?  It would be the very rare "cowboy" John Wayne that would meet the requirements for CC.  Just as it would not be very common for a John Wayne character to meet the requirements for "B-Western".  Fancy buscadero holster, belt and neckerchief do not make for a complete "B-Western" costume.

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1 hour ago, Tom Bullweed said:

The SASS handbook specifically identifies John Wayne (with no other details) as 'not acceptable' for BW.

Well that's because folks will "Think" that JW is BW...and argue about it.

 

Hmmmmm...nooooo, that wouldn't happen...

 

<_<

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3 hours ago, Griff said:

Seriously, look at the basic costume requirements... then look at a typically dressed JW character in any of his " B" movies.

 

I second that!

 

But when I read the SHB for the first time I thought this rule is to prevent every B-Western posse to look like that:

Flashes.jpg.fa26b90490ddcffdff8f01530226151e.jpg

Well, not "Flashs" but JWs.... :D

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B Western is more typical of Roy Rogers, Gene Autry, Tom Mix etc. 

 

It is what it is, so follow the rules of BW or shoot one of the other half million categories!:P

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As a young man I thought John Wayne personified the real image of a cowboy.  As young ones we saw what we wanted to see in our cowboy heroes, for a spell it was Paladin who looked the part for me (cowboys were not supposed to be pretty)!  Based on a coupe of my recent posts I would say that the clothing that impresses me most has become those of a working Vaquero, think John Wayne again BUT this time think of the Vaquero he had the shootout with early in the movie 'Red River'.

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Singing Sandy dress is an acceptable BW persona.

 

SB 

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15 hours ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

Except BW

 

:rolleyes:

If John Wayne shows up at Wartrace & wants to shoot B Western, he will get my vote to let him do it. If an impostor attempts it, well, we have a tall tree & a short rope.....

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40 minutes ago, Chickamauga Slim said:

If John Wayne shows up at Wartrace & wants to shoot B Western, he will get my vote to let him do it. If an impostor attempts it, well, we have a tall tree & a short rope.....

 If John Wayne showed he'd be the first one to go by the rules!;)

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"The Duke made dozens of B-Westerns as Singing Sandy and other characters where he exactly matched SASS B-Western rules: fancy boots, rolled up Jean's, no suspenders, fancy shorts, scarf, big felt hat, fancy leather."  

 

fancy shorts?:o

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when i started reading this thread i was in agreement with the OP - not sure im still not - what about clint eastwoods spaghetti B westerns ? do those characters fit the category ? im guessing not , im guessing none of the 60s type , only the 40-50s singing cowboys ? [they had horses ] 

is it grand old opry spangles and glitter that qualifies ?  just trying to wrap my head around the thread - not really interested in ever being in that category 

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Posted (edited)
11 minutes ago, watab kid said:

when i started reading this thread i was in agreement with the OP - not sure im still not - what about clint eastwoods spaghetti B westerns ? do those characters fit the category ? im guessing not , im guessing none of the 60s type , only the 40-50s singing cowboys ? [they had horses ] 

is it grand old opry spangles and glitter that qualifies ?  just trying to wrap my head around the thread - not really interested in ever being in that category 

"...John Wayne, spaghetti westerns, and townspeople are not acceptable."

 

Or you can reference the handbook: Clickie Here

Phantom

Edited by Phantom, SASS #54973

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thanks , i guess i was confused as to what the word "is" means when what "is" B western if not a B western movie ? im not arguing with the rules at all , i just thought it a nice opportunity to discuss what 'seemed common sense' did not apply 

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Really? I mean western garb is classic no matter the genre as long as it's western. The look is obvious so let's chill on the criticism and embrace the way it was with a loose handle! :rolleyes:

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3 minutes ago, watab kid said:

thanks , i guess i was confused as to what the word "is" means when what "is" B western if not a B western movie ? im not arguing with the rules at all , i just thought it a nice opportunity to discuss what 'seemed common sense' did not apply 

Well in the context of SASS and the SASS WIRE, B-Western has a specific meaning. Now if we were specifically discussing B-Western Movies, then the context would be quite different and so would the meaning.

 

Phantom

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yes , thanks again , that is becoming obvious to me now , i just kinda always thought a literal  line of thinking , i do get the interest of those that go that direction , never had the fashion sense to carry it off myself , 

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Lucas McCain wore Wranglers, but nothing fancy.
I reckon he was "C" Western.

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3 hours ago, Flint N. Steele said:

Lucas McCain wore Wranglers, but nothing fancy.
I reckon he was "C" Western.

TV Western... another thing altogether. 

 

When you think "B-Western" category, think of the "Electric Horseman".  Needn't have the lights, but gaudy just the same.  BTW, the "Electric Horseman" already made an appearance @ EOT for the costume contest... and stole the show!

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funny - john wayne  is first on the list on this site 

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So with all the other changes/amendments to the SASS handbook over the last 25 years, we can’t “amend” B-Western category to accept additional characters like John Wayne in other movies?  All sorts of modifications have been accepted for equipment, why not B-Western clothes?  Each of the categories were created for various groups who wanted a specific set of qualifications. In the environment of dwindling shooters and membership, why do we turn someone away that may represent a growing segment that may add not detract from the participation. 

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6 minutes ago, Nimble Fingers SASS# 25439 said:

So with all the other changes/amendments to the SASS handbook over the last 25 years, we can’t “amend” B-Western category to accept additional characters like John Wayne in other movies?  All sorts of modifications have been accepted for equipment, why not B-Western clothes?  Each of the categories were created for various groups who wanted a specific set of qualifications. In the environment of dwindling shooters and membership, why do we turn someone away that may represent a growing segment that may add not detract from the participation. 

What's to stop them from playing the game under the current rules? 

 

And do you really think that there are a bunch of folks out there that are just dying to play John Wayne in the B-Western category?

 

What about changing Classic Cowboy rules too since there are many interpretations of what a "Classic Cowboy" would look like.

 

Curious...

 

Phantom

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Posted (edited)

What’s wrong with change?  You have been a member long enough to see a lot of changes to the rules since they came out. Where were you when people wanted short stroke rifles?  That certainly wasn’t part of the original rules, and had to be added. Why are you so afraid of change?  So yes, if there are enough people that favor the change, or one clarification over another, bring it up for a vote by the territorial governors. Isn’t that how the games grows and stays relevant?  Don’t know how many people are out there who would join, but you don’t either and what’s the harm?  Be open to change Phantom it really doesn’t hurt anyone to consider changes. Just saying. 

Edited by Nimble Fingers SASS# 25439

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Why does B-Western or Classic Cowboy need changing? There are literally 70 more categories where someone can dress like John Wayne if they want.

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38 minutes ago, Nimble Fingers SASS# 25439 said:

What’s wrong with change?  You have been a member long enough to see a lot of changes to the rules since they came out. Where were you when people wanted short stroke rifles?  That certainly wasn’t part of the original rules, and had to be added. Why are you so afraid of change?  So yes, if there are enough people that favor the change, or one clarification over another, bring it up for a vote by the territorial governors. Isn’t that how the games grows and stays relevant?  Don’t know how many people are out there who would join, but you don’t either and what’s the harm?  Be open to change Phantom it really doesn’t hurt anyone to consider changes. Just saying. 

I don't think change is inherently bad.  However, B-Western's very nature is based on "Flashy". Eliminating that would be more than a simple change and in essence would be a paradigm shift.

 

Phantom

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No one said to eliminate it, add to it. You have your “flashy” the original poster has John Wayne   What was being eliminated?  And when I think of B-westerns I don’t know of flashy, I think of Hopalong Cassidy, Roy Rogers, and yes John Wayne movies in both the 30’s and 40’s. But that is my interpretation and if I didn’t like the club’s rules I would try to change as long as it would affect anyone else. And since adding additional clothing would not negatively affect people already in that category again what is the issue?  

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There's a difference between the "B" Western film genre and the SASS B-Western CATEGORY.

This statement is at the very heart of why the category was established in the first place:

 

Quote

All costumes are expected to be fancy and flashy..

SHB p.9

 

I would wager that the majority of B-Western competitors would vote for NO CHANGE in that regard. 

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And if they did then it would be decided. But part of the growth of the way this game has evolved and been people being able to ask why are the rules written the way they are and can we consider change. I have seen a lot of it since I started, some I liked, some I didn’t but it was brought up for discussion and then if enough interest voted on. Seriously where did all the categories come from in the first place?  Right?

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