Pietta 1858 Remington - 45LC conversion loading

[scot_th_rock]

Hi all. I recently picked up a Pietta 1858 Remington and Kisrt 45LC conversion cylinder. I was under the impression I need to keep the FPS around 830-840 with my hand loads. I will be firing 180gn round nose lead slugs. 

 

My question is about recommended powder and a safe medium load. I heard pyrodex has a more of a 'pop' sound and not much kick whereas black powder give the more satisfying 'BOOM' and a little more kick. I'm not looking to shoot hot loads. Just make some noise, smoke and plink some cans. However, like any firearm, I would prefer it to actually fire a round with the needed energy and stopping power. 

 

Additionally, I have an RCBS loading RAM. I've not loaded 45LC before and with this 'Frankenstein' firearm I'm not entirely clear if there are special considerations when making rounds for this thing.

 

Thanks!

[Boomstick Bruce]

If you're using black or black subs, don't worry about the fps. They list the fps warning because of the pressure smokeless makes to get certain bullets to go certain velocities. 

 

I'm told 1000fps with smokeless is like running +p in a gun not designed for +p... It won't go kaboom but it will die an early death.

 

I use 6gn of TB and 200gn rnfp in my kirst 58's (seen in my avatar) that I use as my main match guns.

 

I have loaded full cases of 45 Colt with triple 7 and the same 200gn bullets and likely got way past the 850 fps mark, probably over 1000fps with the "weaker" r&d drop in cylinders and had no problems...

 

Personally I like the smoke, boom and flames given off by pyrodex p... But remember, pyrodex is a corrosive that also explodes... CLEAN THE GUN IMMEDIATELY!!!

[Trooper Ozzy]

12 minutes ago, Boomstick Bruce said:

Personally I like the smoke, boom and flames given off by pyrodex p... But remember, pyrodex is a corrosive that also explodes... CLEAN THE GUN IMMEDIATELY!!!

Edited 7 minutes ago by Boomstick Bruce

Pyrodex....Pyrodoesn't...  Just load 2.2 cc Goex 2F under that 200 gr bullet for real fire, smoke, and a manly boom. And no running around with your skirts up panicking about corrosion. 

[scot_th_rock]

Some background; I've done quite a bit of reloading with modern firearms. I'm familiar with powders for those particular calibers. IMR, Hogdon, etc. But know nothing about loading black powder for 45LC with this modified firearm. I've read posts about 'compressing' the loads and or using a filler like cream of wheat or other stuff. All new to me and really don't know what that means, why, etc. 

 

Long and short, I'd like to get a nice 'kaboom' out of this thing with stopping power but not have to worry about blowing it up. Also some of these nuances regarding hand loads for this particular firearm are new to me. I am quite comfortable with my modern firearms load because I did the research. That being said, any help on particular brands of powder, loads and pyrodex vs black powder would be really helpful.

 

Thanks in advance for any and all advice.

[Turkey Flats Jack]

I run reduced loads in my 45 cartridges. want a full case with no airspace. either full of bp or a combination of bp and filler. In my 45's I run 20 grains of 2f, a dry wad, a grease cookie, and then a little bit of lizard litter (crushed walnut) to fill the case to the bottom of the bullet. I use a cleaning rod to seat the dry wad and get a little compression on the powder. There's tons of ways to get the same results. I will say that if you're going to run 45 bp rounds through a rifle you'll benefit greatly from annealing your brass. 

Here's a link that'll put you on the right path and probably answer any questions you'll ever have for bp

https://www.curtrich.com/bpsubsdummies.html

 

[Trooper Ozzy]

On 6/14/2020 at 7:56 PM, scot_th_rock said:

I will be firing 180gn round nose lead slugs.

 

If you already have non BP lubed bullets, you should run APP.  That is a substitute compatible with smokeless lube bullets; no flame but boom and smoke.

If you want to purchase and use Black powder, purchase Missouri bullet Company BP lubed bullets for your revolver.  Shooting in a rifle? Purchase big lube bullets.

 

 

[scot_th_rock]

I wound up buying GOEX 3F Black Powder. Not sure about the load in grains or what was it, Lizard gravel? What is that and why would I want a filler? As for the rounds being pre-lubed, they are not. Again, I can only tell this group that I know loading for smokeless modern firearms. The nuances for loading black powder and their compliment of propellant are new to me. Things such as 'lube', lizard gravel (whatever it's called), wad fillers.......I really don't know what you are speaking to. This is my own ignorance.

 

Quite simply, I wish to reload .45LC for a new Pietta 1858 Remington with a Kisrt Converter cylinder. My hope it to have a functional 45LC revolver that will perform but not blow up in my hands.

[Buckshot Dobbs]

http://curtrich.com/bpsubsdummies.html
 

Read this excellent article I consumed years ago when I started loading black powder cartridges for my 1858 NMA Remingtons. Now I ended up going with APP instead of Goex, used both but got lazy and enjoyed shooting non lubed bullets, my load was 1cc of 3f APP (American pioneer powder) and a 1/4” piece of backer rod....read that article and you will see what I mean, shot that in rifle and pistol for several years, got even lazier and went back to that demon smokeless lol.

BD

 

[Turkey Flats Jack]

9 hours ago, scot_th_rock said:

I wound up buying GOEX 3F Black Powder. Not sure about the load in grains or what was it, Lizard gravel? What is that and why would I want a filler? As for the rounds being pre-lubed, they are not. Again, I can only tell this group that I know loading for smokeless modern firearms. The nuances for loading black powder and their compliment of propellant are new to me. Things such as 'lube', lizard gravel (whatever it's called), wad fillers.......I really don't know what you are speaking to. This is my own ignorance.

 

Quite simply, I wish to reload .45LC for a new Pietta 1858 Remington with a Kisrt Converter cylinder. My hope it to have a functional 45LC revolver that will perform but not blow up in my hands.

Lizard litter is crushed walnut shell. You can find it as crushed walnut but it's cheaper at pet stores advertised as lizard litter. You dont need to use it or any filler but you can. If you want to have a reduced load you have to have something to take up the airspace in the case. Black powder is an explosive it has to have some compression and no airspace in the case to work correctly. You absolutely can fill the case up with powder to the bottom of the projectile and seat it. A 45 case will not hold enough powder to damage the gun in anyway. The article that has been shared will give you most of the knowledge you're wanting. if your bullets are not pre lubed you'll need some sort of lube in the lube grove. most of us use a beeswax/lard combination. Generally 50/50 mix is the most common but there's over the counter lubes out there that you can buy if you dont want to make your own. Just make sure it's geared towards black powder. Most lubes for modern powder will not keep the black powder fouling soft and it will be a bear to clean out at the end of the day. That's if you make it to the end of the day without the guns locking up or getting difficult to function from the fouling. YMMV

 

Jack

[Tequila Shooter]

10 hours ago, Buckshot Dobbs said:

http://curtrich.com/bpsubsdummies.html
 

Read this excellent article I consumed years ago when I started loading black powder cartridges for my 1858 NMA Remingtons. Now I ended up going with APP instead of Goex, used both but got lazy and enjoyed shooting non lubed bullets, my load was 1cc of 3f APP (American pioneer powder) and a 1/4” piece of backer rod....read that article and you will see what I mean, shot that in rifle and pistol for several years, got even lazier and went back to that demon smokeless lol.

BD

 

 

Heathen  

[Jackson Haller]

PM sent Scot!

 

[Colorado Coffinmaker]

 

I'd first like to reinforce .... Pyrodex is a 'RUSTING' agent that just happens to burn.  Pyrodex just isn't worth the trouble it causes.  I shoot APP.  Probably the best of the best for BP Substitute.  You can reduce loads with it, but you will need a filler to the bullet base.  I like Cream-0-Wheat for filler.  Doesn't compress.  A nice middle of the road load for your bullet would be 15 - 16Gr 3F APP topped with Cream-0-Wheat.

[Slowhand Bob, 24229]

I used to be partial to the insulation filler rods, as sold at the building supply stores, in my loads.  I was recently told that it was simply luck that my guns did not suffer a catastrophic explosion due to the burn rate of the foam being instantaneous and thus creating air space.  Does anyone know if this is fact or fiction??  I used it for years and was really happy with it.