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La Mesa American Legion Post Guns


Subdeacon Joe

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I'm fairly sure that many of you heard about the incident at the La Mesa American Legion Post 2 weeks ago and the guy who climbed the pole to replace the flag. https://www.legion.org/flag/249242/civilian-climbs-60-foot-pole-replace-burned-flag-california-post

 

In one of the photos there is what I think may be an 8 inch howitzer from WWI.

 

I emailed the Post Commander asking about it.   He said he had no clue about it but would send me photos,  maybe I  could give him some information about the guns they have.   He sent me 4 pictures. 

 

I'll,  of course,  do some research on my own,  but I thought I would also ask here since a fair number of people are familiar with such things. 

 

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Interesting pictures.  The top gun resembles a Japanese Type 99 Heavy Machine gun.  The howitzer looks to be a 10 cm mountain howitzer, an Austria Hungary weapon.  However, there were so many variations in barrel length and carriage that it's difficult to tell.  Any marks on the barrel?

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Looks like a 20mm  Bofors or Oerlikon AA gun to me. Missing parts.
Field pieces ain’t my thing but as far as vintage I’d go with WW1 give or take a few years for sure. Hard to gauge the bore. A breech pic would help too.

And shame on the Post Commander!

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5 minutes ago, Tex Jones, SASS 2263 said:

Any marks on the barrel?

 

The entire email he sent me was the photos and: "Here are the pictures of the two guns.  Cannot find serial # or other information. "

5 minutes ago, Utah Bob #35998 said:

Looks like a 20mm  Bofors or Oerlikon AA gun to me. Missing parts.

 

That's my gut feeling.  Without something for scale it is hard to tell.

I wouldn't be too hard on the Post Commander, likely there is nothing in their archives about either piece.  

When I was in Lake Co. CA the county courthouse in Lakeport had a pair of Japanese Type 92 Battalion Guns that they got to replace the two bronze Dahlgren 12 pound Boat Guns they had given up in the metal drives of early WWII.  Took me a couple of days in the back room of the Lake County Museum to find details on that.
The American Legion Post in Clearlake had the tube of a 3" Ordnance Rifle that had been converted to a breach loading salute gun.  The Post Commander had no information about it.  He did allow me to scrape some of the paint off the muzzle face to read the number.  #334, 1863, Phoenix Iron Works, inspector TTSL (
Theodore Thaddeus Sobieski Laidley )

image.thumb.png.7437dce859771c9b5aa166b0c917ada2.png

When I went to check the Registry of Surviving Civil War Artillery it wasn't listed.  Took me about two weeks to find out about the conversion from muzzle loader to breach loader.  Never was able to track it down more than that.

 

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25 minutes ago, Subdeacon Joe said:

On another forum someone suggested the archie may be a Japanese Type 96 25mm Hotchkiss.
Seems to be too large.  There was also a Type 93 machine gun in 13 mm, roughly 50 cal, but hard to tell without scale.  The Bofors has recoil springs on the barrel and the one pictured appears to have cooling fins.  Ian McCollum at Forgotten Weapons.com might be able to identify them.
Japanese 25mm dual mount anti-aircraft gun - Guam.jpg

 

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OK.  Had someone say:

"

The stubbly little howitzer is the German "15cm. schwere Feldhaubitze Model 1893" made by Krupp.  (15cm. s.F.H. 1893).   
Somewhere I have a list of cannons on display, prepared by a volunteer associated with the Army's Rock Island Arsenal Museum which may include serial number and possibly origin.   Almost certainly a WW1 souvenir donated by the Army to Legion/VFW post.

For more info on these (or many other types of mainly WW1 German artillery see the incredible private collection of Leon and Ralph Lovett, of Artillery, Anti-Tank Guns, Naval Guns, and Mortars.
https://www.lovettartillery.com/index.html

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16 hours ago, Subdeacon Joe said:

 

You may have nailed it.

 

https://images.app.goo.gl/H5erLhdmMKguZ2918

 

I don’t think that’s it. Cooling fins don’t look quite right.

 

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