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Trapped on an Expressway


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For instance.  Protestors have you hemmed in and no way out .  Some are beating on cars at random but others seem intent on knocking the driver window or windshield out with a club. Where does Stand  Your Ground kick in?  Some of the drivers seem to be tolerating a lot of damage to property and potential harm to themselves.

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SYG (Stand Your Ground aka No Duty to Retreat) depends on the state, but is not something that "kicks in" at some point other than at the beginnings of threat.

 

However, CD (Castle Doctrine) will kick in -- for those states that have it -- the moment there is an unlawful and forcible entry into one's castle.

 

Tennessee not only has SYG and CD, CD also applies to "conveyances of any kind."

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Hemmed in and unable to move is a bad situation. You need plenty of ammo. Personally I’d move to the middle of the vehicle (tricky these days with bucket seats) and display my firearm. I wouldn’t shoot until a widow was broken to the extent that they began to reach in. At the first shot they will probably scatter. Probably. But some may be armed and return fire. Unless there’s a police line Very close, getting out of the car would probably result in you being chased down with a very bad result.

I was in Miami during the McDuffie riots. People were dragged from their cars and killed. Best thing you can do during civil unrest is monitor the hot zones and try to avoid them.  If I had to be on the road I’d have a handgun and a short barreled sg like a Mossberg Shockwave, and maybe some bear spray.

D2D9B664-19EB-4613-B3DB-CAC7CB6425B6.jpeg

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That is a no win situation that I hope nobody ever gets stuck in.  Freeway is stopped, so you can't go anywhere.  A huge mob of people swarming attacking cars and breaking out windows.  You cant drive your way out.  You dont have enough ammo to stop all of them.  You can hope that brandishing will hold them off... but mobs are stupid masses.  While you are holding somebody back from your driverside window, somebody will smash in your rear or side window.  You can't even guarantee that shooting one of them will hold the rest back.  NO win situation that will go badly for everybody.  Best is to avoid areas that are having active riots...

 

 

*** looks like UB had similar thoughts, but he was on the trigger a bit faster than me***

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This is not something I like to think about, but have been stressing about over the last several days.

 

My brother, my son and my daughter are over the road truck drivers.

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2 minutes ago, Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 said:

I will stay around Jackson. Only fools would come here. BTW there is a Serbian bakery two doors down on the left.

 

 

My daughter is outside of Phoenix right now and picking up a load headed towards Sacramento.  She's supposed to turn it over to another truck in Ontario and not knowing where she's headed after that.

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23 minutes ago, Utah Bob #35998 said:

Hemmed in and unable to move is a bad situation. You need plenty of ammo. Personally I’d move to the middle of the vehicle (tricky these days with bucket seats) and display my firearm. I wouldn’t shoot until a widow was broken to the extent that they began to reach in. At the first shot they will probably scatter. Probably. But some may be armed and return fire. Unless there’s a police line Very close, getting out of the car would probably result in you being chased down with a very bad result.

I was in Miami during the McDuffie riots. People were dragged from their cars and killed. Best thing you can do during civil unrest is monitor the hot zones and try to avoid them.  If I had to be on the road I’d have a handgun and a short barreled sg like a Mossberg Shockwave, and maybe some bear spray.

 

20 minutes ago, Crazy Gun Barney, SASS #2428 said:

That is a no win situation that I hope nobody ever gets stuck in.  Freeway is stopped, so you can't go anywhere.  A huge mob of people swarming attacking cars and breaking out windows.  You cant drive your way out.  You dont have enough ammo to stop all of them.  You can hope that brandishing will hold them off... but mobs are stupid masses.  While you are holding somebody back from your driverside window, somebody will smash in your rear or side window.  You can't even guarantee that shooting one of them will hold the rest back.  NO win situation that will go badly for everybody.  Best is to avoid areas that are having active riots...

 

 

*** looks like UB had similar thoughts, but he was on the trigger a bit faster than me***

 

This was what I was thinking. I wouldn't shoot unless there was no other option and I was being pulled from my vehicle. By the way, Pepper Spray would be my first defense.

 

 

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Quote

A typical pepper spray used for self defense will have an oleoresin capsicum (OC) concentration of about 10% or higher. A typical bear spray has a oleoresin concentration of about 1 – 2 %.

 

That said, I've read a variety of reasons for the differences, ranging from "Bear spray is formulated to be particularly offensive to BEARS!" to "Bear spray is designed to only be a deterrent; it's not supposed to actually harm the bear."

 

Who knows.  I'd go for the stronger stuff.  Hm.  I wonder if aerosol Sriracha might be available!   ^_^

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3 hours ago, Pat Riot, SASS #13748 said:

 

 

This was what I was thinking. I wouldn't shoot unless there was no other option and I was being pulled from my vehicle. By the way, Pepper Spray would be my first defense.

 

 

If you wait until you’re being pulled from your vehicle you’re a deadman. Watching the riot videos from the last few nights pretty much assures that.

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Just now, Yul Lose said:

If you wait until you’re being pulled from your vehicle you’re a deadman. Watching the riot videos from the last few nights pretty much assures that.

It would all depend on the situation, obviously. 

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29 minutes ago, Hardpan Curmudgeon SASS #8967 said:

 

 

That said, I've read a variety of reasons for the differences, ranging from "Bear spray is formulated to be particularly offensive to BEARS!" to "Bear spray is designed to only be a deterrent; it's not supposed to actually harm the bear."

 

Who knows.  I'd go for the stronger stuff.  Hm.  I wonder if aerosol Sriracha might be available!   ^_^

True. Bears, like most animals, have more sensitive olfactory organs than people.

But bear spray can be had in a very large size, at least 7.9 ounces, and has a longer range than your typical self defense oc . OC spray is good for a one one one confrontation and shoots a pretty narrow stream. Bear spray shoots a much broader amount a longer distance and would be more effective on a large crowd. And some jurisdictions regulate or prohibit the defensive oc spray and not bear spray. The big cloud from the bear spray could be more effective in dispersing a bunch of 2 legged animals.
OC for muggers

Bear Spray for mobs

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9 minutes ago, Yul Lose said:

If you wait until you’re being pulled from your vehicle you’re a deadman. Watching the riot videos from the last few nights pretty much assures that.

 

Does the name Reginald Denny ring a bell? If it doesn't, it should. 

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4 hours ago, Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 said:

I will stay around Jackson. Only fools would come here. BTW there is a Serbian bakery two doors down on the left.

 

Shots Heard Around Jackson Marking Serbian Christmas | Local News ...

 

Jackson has a very nice Serbian Orthodox church.  https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Sava_Serbian_Orthodox_Church_(Jackson,_California)

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I've  been told by professional big game guides that wasp spray makes a pretty good bear repellent. I'm thinkin' it would work pretty well on people,too.Usually has good range, a tight, confined stream,easy to find, and affordable.

Not ready to experiment on myself just yet ,and I haven't  found any volunteers.

Choctaw Jack 

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1 hour ago, Cypress Sun said:

 

Does the name Reginald Denny ring a bell? If it doesn't, it should. 

I remember. I watched it live in TV. 

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5 hours ago, Chief Rick said:

My daughter is outside of Phoenix right now and picking up a load headed towards Sacramento.  She's supposed to turn it over to another truck in Ontario and not knowing where she's headed after that.

And if I am right truckers are not allowed any weapons...A bat might be about all they can have....Leagally...

 

Texas Lizard

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it just happened  in oakland  20 protester blocked  freeway on ramp 

but seem 6 members of Black bike club wanted to get on the freeway

they roared up to line of punks and said if we get off our bike your asses are ours 

dam white punks with dork knot can run 

 

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Matthew it depends on  where you are and what time of day it is! In TX after dark you can use deadly force

as NO ONE belongs on your property but you and yours, trespassers don't fair well here!

Bear spray is  pepper spray about 5X stronger than the self defense variety. It can kill a human

if they have other health issues. Most cans warn against using on humans.

 

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1 hour ago, Texas Lizard said:

And if I am right truckers are not allowed any weapons...A bat might be about all they can have....Leagally...

 

Texas Lizard

A common misconception about truckers not being allowed to have firearms. The only prohibition would be from the trucking company, not the Federal govt.

 

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50 minutes ago, Dutch Nichols, SASS #6461 said:

Matthew it depends on  where you are and what time of day it is! In TX after dark you can use deadly force

as NO ONE belongs on your property but you and yours, trespassers don't fair well here!

Bear spray is  pepper spray about 5X stronger than the self defense variety. It can kill a human

if they have other health issues. Most cans warn against using on humans.

 

Bear spray is actually weaker than SD oc spray. See the posts above.
 

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14 minutes ago, Utah Bob #35998 said:

A common misconception about truckers not being allowed to have firearms. The only prohibition would be from the trucking company, not the Federal govt.

 

Any legal problem will be from what ever state you're in. In Arizona you would be fine. In Illinois you'd be screwed.

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4 hours ago, Yul Lose said:

If you wait until you’re being pulled from your vehicle you’re a deadman. Watching the riot videos from the last few nights pretty much assures that.

If I'm going to die anyway I'm going to keep firing as fast and as long as I can.

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2 hours ago, Matthew Duncan said:

Illegal to use deadly force to protect property.  

True, but in Iowa it is allowed if someone is attacking you in a vehicle or trying to remove you by force.   Was just posted by a local gun shop with the actual statute. 

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A boyhood friend just wrote this in a forum elsewhere and I felt at ease copy/pasting here.   He was a multi tour combat Marine in Nam. Currently lives in Texas.

 

"

I’m seeing that these rioters have been shutting down highways and attacking cars. Lets make this clear.... if you shut down the highway and start causing or attempting to cause harm to my property or the lives of my family it will be met with lethal force, no questions asked. If you want to protest, that’s your right and I’m not going to stop you, but there is a difference between peaceful protest and the stunts you are pulling. I consider attacking innocent civilians on the highway that are not in a uniform or government officials a cowardly act of terrorism..... if anyone thinks this post is out of line that’s fine but in case you did not know here is the definition:

ter·ror·ism
/ˈterəˌrizəm/
noun
the unlawful use of violence and intimidation, especially against civilians, in the pursuit of political aims.

I, like so many others in this country took an oath to defend this country against all enemies foreign and domestic... protest all you want but don’t be attacking innocent civilians. You may just find me or someone like me and that will be the last mistake you make.

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By the way Pards, hypothetically it’s a very bad idea to post on forums what you would do in a serious situation like what is being discussed here. 
 

(to my attorney: please reference what I said above...above this post...)

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3 hours ago, Pat Riot, SASS #13748 said:
4 hours ago, Cypress Sun said:

 

Does the name Reginald Denny ring a bell? If it doesn't, it should. 

I remember. I watched it live in TV. 

 

When I see a post on social media with people expressing outrage that someone dared try to, or did, drive through the people blocking roads my usual response is, "Reginald Denny stopped."

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1 hour ago, Sgt. C.J. Sabre, SASS #46770 said:

Any legal problem will be from what ever state you're in. In Arizona you would be fine. In Illinois you'd be screwed.

 

In Illinois a guy breaks into your house and you shoot him, you will go to jail. Seems as you look thru the laws in Illinois, the ones with rights are the criminals.

 

Our governor stated Trump can not use Federal troops to stop the violence and he does not want troops in the state. I am not sure where he is hiding right now, but the riots are tearing Chicago, Joliet and some of the suburbs as we speak. I got called by a friend and the riots are about a 1/4 miles from her place today. I called my son today and he said there was a protest the other day 2 blocks from his house, but it was peaceful. he said they were tearing up Joliet mall about 2 miles from him as we were talking. I told him to stay home with his mom and it would be best in both on them stayed home until this ended.

 

He was with me in Southern Illinois on Sunday and drove back to Chicago on Sunday and had to take a detour to get home to avoid the riots. My sister met him just north of Kankakee and they took back roads to get to her house and then on to his place. I wish he was down here. The most violent thing I have seen here this week was one of the barn cats stalking a rabbit and the rabbit out ran the cat.

 

Richard Daily, (the first one), Mayor of Chicago in 1968 during the Democratic convention, ordered the rioters to be shot. 

He had the power and it would have happened except the riot broke up on hearing his orders. They knew he meant it.

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Ok, I am a civilian In a vehicle suddenly and unexpectedly surrounded by a hostile rioting mob.  The most important thing is survival.  Not punishing criminals, not doing the policemen’s job; just surviving.
 

I’m gonna wave at the nearest rioter and say “Sorry I’m late for the party!  Give me a brick and which way are we going?”

 

And I will work my way to the edge of the mob and escape as quickly as possible.

 

Bret Maverick is my mentor.  Live to fight when the odds are in your favor.

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