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jasper stone

Never loaded bp

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We will be using app fffg black powder. 125gn rnfp bullet with lee alux lube. For sg we have aa hulls and #8shot 7/8oz. What is a good powder measurement for 38spl and 12ga loads. Thanks J.s

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You will be loading BP subs like APP by the volume you want to fill, rather than to a specific weight.

 

I'd suggest you read over the good Capt Baylor's BP and Subs for Dummies.   It's a treasure trove of info.

 

https://www.curtrich.com/bpsubsdummies.html

 

That will generate a few more specific questions, I'm sure. 

Good luck, GJ

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Posted (edited)

APP cartridge loading instructions

 

I'll let others give their SG recipes.

 

I recommend storing loaded rounds in a dry place.  I put mine in a dry box with a desiccant pack.

 

Wash your cases soon after firing.  I'd toss the AAs after one reloading.

 

Welcome to the Darkside!

Edited by Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971
encouragement
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Can't help with the 38 other than fill the case until it touches the bullet when it is seated.

 

12 ga is 60-65 grs by volume, Claybuster 1138 red wad, 7/8-1 oz shot to get height correct for a good crimp.

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1 hour ago, jasper stone said:

We will be using app fffg black powder. 125gn rnfp bullet with lee alux lube. For sg we have aa hulls and #8shot 7/8oz. What is a good powder measurement for 38spl and 12ga loads. Thanks J.s

 

APP is NOT, BP.

It's a wanna-be......

OLG 

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2 hours ago, Jailhouse Jim, SASS #13104 said:

Can't help with the 38 other than fill the case until it touches the bullet when it is seated.

 

12 ga is 60-65 grs by volume, Claybuster 1138 red wad, 7/8-1 oz shot to get height correct for a good crimp.

 Just about what I use but with 2F Goex.    Should work just fine.   A rolled crimp makes getting the right wad height a non issue as interior space does vary with different brand of shotgun shells.   This will affect your crimp height.  You almost need to stick with one brand of SG cases to get a good star crimp. 

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Posted (edited)

38 gets 1.3 c.c Lee dippers about 18 grns. Shotgun gets about 50-55 grns 

Rafe

Edited by Rafe Conager SASS #56958

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With SG be prepared, BP and APP burn hotter than smokeless.  I started loading APP for SG with plastic hulls and wads, they work but keep in mind a couple of things. (1)  The hulls won't last very long, I would get 1 or 2 reloads before I had to toss them using Remington STS hulls.  

(2) The plastic wads will melt in the barrel, not a huge deal but you need to get it all out when cleaning.  I had used a pink wad and there was nothing like seeing a pink ribbon coming out when cleaning B) :D.

 

Those things combined led me to load brass SG shells. 

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Remington gun clubs should be plentiful at your local trap range. One and done. After you use up your APP you will migrate to BP. APP different sound, plenty of smoke, no flame. It’s a good intro. 48668539061_7ee90675f7_o.thumb.jpg.5cd725744e2b6edff709d701bd49f9de.jpg

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I just noticed another benefit.  6’ social distance in that photo!

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1 hour ago, Tequila Shooter said:

With SG be prepared, BP and APP burn hotter than smokeless.  I started loading APP for SG with plastic hulls and wads, they work but keep in mind a couple of things. (1)  The hulls won't last very long, I would get 1 or 2 reloads before I had to toss them using Remington STS hulls.  

(2) The plastic wads will melt in the barrel, not a huge deal but you need to get it all out when cleaning.  I had used a pink wad and there was nothing like seeing a pink ribbon coming out when cleaning B) :D.

 

Those things combined led me to load brass SG shells. 

 

Never found a pink snake but plenty of black ones when cleaning.  Must be doing something wrong on this end  ^_^

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Posted (edited)

I like Alox for smokeless powder loads.  I doubt you will need any lube with APP as it is supposed to "make it's own" when fired.  If you try a different BP or substitute, I would not use Alox.  I have been using 50/50 beeswax and Crisco for 20 years and have no reason to switch.  There are lots of recipes for blackpowder lubes out there, the key being using natural, organic fats and oils rather than petroleum based lubes.

 

So, if you find that your guns are gumming up or that fouling is hard to remove, you might look for a different bullet lube.  Ballistol works well for the gun's actions.

Edited by J-BAR #18287
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28 minutes ago, Cusz M. Dutch SASS Life 55326 said:

 

Never found a pink snake but plenty of black ones when cleaning.  Must be doing something wrong on this end  ^_^

 

I can give you some pink wads so you can get it right  :P :lol: :FlagAm:

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When you get done playing with APP ,,,, You might want to try loading Black Powder !!!

 

Jabez Cowboy

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I'm not a fan of BP subs. I prefer the real thing.  With 2f I fill the 38 case about 1/8" from the top and seat your bullet. someone mentioned the 1.3 cc dipper i'm not in my reloading room but i'm pretty sure that's the same one I used to set my powder throw for 38. As for the 12ga rounds I run all brass. there's a thread going on right now about that subject. I do load plastic hulls for the mrs and her pw87. either 43 grains of my homebrewed 2f or 50 grains of grafs reenactment bp, 1 1/8th oz wad filled with #7.5 or #8, over shot card, and trimmed for a roll crimp. I gave up trying to get a decent star crimp because I just grab whatever hulls look to be in good shape from the bin at the range. I spent a small fortune in different wads trying to get a perfect looking round. blah cut'em down and roll crimp. done. 

As mentioned by someone the alox lube is for smokeless powder. APP supposedly does not require additional lube. I cant testify to that as I've never used it. But I would highly recommend using a non petroleum based lube for BP or sub if youre going to use a lube. I run a 50/50 mix of beeswax/tallow or beeswax/crisco when i'm short on lambs tallow. YMMV

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I like APP.  In fact, I like APP a LOT.  No lube needed.  Just load.  

 

Load with no Air Space so simply load to the base of the bullet.  Or, if you reduce, I like Cream-0-Wheat as a filler.  

 

I don't load plastic shotgun hulls,  I load All Brass.  I like 40Gr APP.  Using plastic wads over the over-powder wad is not a problem.  The wad residue will clean out very easy.  You have to clean anyway so don't worry about the "snake skin."  

 

Most of the "Poo Poo" stuff you hear and read about APP is just CRAP.  Ignore it.

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9 hours ago, Tequila Shooter said:

 

I can give you some pink wads so you can get it right  :P :lol: :FlagAm:

Going to hold you on that one.   Really does get your attention the first time if you are not expecting that snake.

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Just now, Cusz M. Dutch SASS Life 55326 said:

Going to hold you on that one.   Really does get your attention the first time if you are not expecting that snake.

 

Just PM me your address and they'll be on the stage.

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6 hours ago, Colorado Coffinmaker said:

 

I like APP.  In fact, I like APP a LOT.  No lube needed.  Just load.  

 

Load with no Air Space so simply load to the base of the bullet.  Or, if you reduce, I like Cream-0-Wheat as a filler.  

 

I don't load plastic shotgun hulls,  I load All Brass.  I like 40Gr APP.  Using plastic wads over the over-powder wad is not a problem.  The wad residue will clean out very easy.  You have to clean anyway so don't worry about the "snake skin."  

 

Most of the "Poo Poo" stuff you hear and read about APP is just CRAP.  Ignore it.

I put a little Alox lube on bullets to run thru the size die, should I use those for others loads? (Thought you had to lube to size bullets) 

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Hi Jasper  :)

 

Nah.  Here be the skinny.  APP requires NO lube.  None, Nada.  Don't "need" any.  You can run bullets "bare," with Crayon Smokeless lube, or with BP lube.  You just don't have too.  The form of fouling left by APP is NOT cumulative.  Each round fired, cleans the previous fouling out of the bore.  The only fouling that is a problem is that left in an oversize chamber such as a 45 or 44 where nothing cleans the fouling out.  For large caliber straight wall cases, I seriously recommend annealing your cases.  45 and 44 cases will NOT expand sufficiently to seal loose chambers.  Uberti chambers are loose.  Very very loose.  I don't recommend annealing for strictly handgun cases.

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Posted (edited)

Not All Uberti Chambers Are Loose ,,, I own 3 that are at SAMMI  Minimum Spec... in Rifles 

And Two Minimum spec. Cattlemen Revolvers ...

That would be over 50% of my Uberti Cartridge Cowboy guns with Tight Chambers ...

And only One of My rifles has what I would Consider a Loose Chamber, my Short Rifle in .45 Colt .... It Still seals up pretty good With heavy bullets and Full case loads of Goex 3F ....

 

Jabez Cowboy 

 

Edited by Jabez Cowboy,SASS # 50129
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If all your bullets are lubed go ahead and use them. If you cast more you don't need to lube them to use APP. DO NOT use Alox if you try real black.

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