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Mountain Man Gramps

Shooting Category Question

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On 5/4/2020 at 5:59 PM, Marshal Hangtree said:

That's true, but you can't shoot "Frontiersman" category and shoot gunfighter style.  I believe that was what T-Square was talking about.  Could be wrong, though.

 

You can shoot frontiersman gunfighter at a SASS BP championship match.

 

You can also shoot frontiersman in the traditional style, as well during a SASS BP championship match.

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1 hour ago, Branchwater Jack SASS #88854 said:

 

You can shoot frontiersman gunfighter at a SASS BP championship match.

 

You can also shoot frontiersman in the traditional style, as well during a SASS BP championship match.

That's interesting.  Why would SASS change the rules (from the Shooter's Handbook) for a BP championship match?

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46 minutes ago, Marshal Hangtree said:

That's interesting.  Why would SASS change the rules (from the Shooter's Handbook) for a BP championship match?

There is a different category metrics for BP Championship matches.

 

https://www.sassnet.com/Downloads/2020StateBPagreementFINAL.pdf

 

 

 

 

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Thanks, Jack.  According to the form:

 

"SASS State Blackpowder Shootouts are required to offer a variety of shooting categories. Categories are divided into two main divisions, Frontier Cartridge and Frontiersman (Cap and Ball). Each division can offer Wrangler, Cowboy, Duelist, Gunfighter, Cowgirl, Lady Wrangler, Lady Duelist, Lady Gunfighter, Seniors, Elder Statesman, Lady Senior, Grande Dame, Young Guns, Buckaroo, Classic Cowboy, Classic Cowgirl, and Plainsman"

 

It is indeed odd that SASS would allow Gunfighter style within the Frontiersman category.  A few years ago when I started shooting Frontiersman, I asked the question here on the Wire "why is Gunfighter style not allowed in Frontiersman category?"  The only replies that I got were something along the order of  "it's a safety issue of having two C&B revolvers in hand at the same time if one chain-fires".    So, if it's a safety issue for regular or monthly matches, why does the fact that the match is "BP only" negate the safety issue?  I guess we'll never get an answer to that question.

 

Thanks again for the document, Jack.

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I’m all in favor of promoting the use of blackpowder in SASS matches.  But SASS contractual requirements for a Blackpowder Championship match tremendously increases the number of categories, which increases the number of awards and decreases the number of competitors in each category.  Some folks enjoy being the only one in a category, others don’t.  The discussion could last for several pages.

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8 hours ago, Marshal Hangtree said:

  A few years ago when I started shooting Frontiersman, I asked the question here on the Wire "why is Gunfighter style not allowed in Frontiersman category?"  The only replies that I got were something along the order of  "it's a safety issue of having two C&B revolvers in hand at the same time if one chain-fires".    So, if it's a safety issue for regular or monthly matches, why does the fact that the match is "BP only" negate the safety issue?  I guess we'll never get an answer to that question.

 

Whoever told you that is an ignorant fool.  There is nothing in the SASS rules the precludes someone from shooting cap guns in the gunfighter style in the frontier cartridge gunfighter, gunfighter, or B Western categories.

 

As a matter of fact, one of the frontier cartridge gunfighters that I've looked up to and admired for a long time is a master with cap guns. That is all he shoots.

 

The only reason why you're required to shoot in the duelist style in the frontiersman category is because the rules say so. 

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Forget everything you've read so far.  The only thing you need to know is that Duelist is coolest. :D

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2 hours ago, Branchwater Jack SASS #88854 said:

 

The only reason why you're required to shoot in the duelist style in the frontiersman category is because the rules say so. 

 

Precisely my point.  Whenever I question the logic of that rule, that is exactly what the discussion boils down to in the end.  "Because that's what the rule book says."

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Here's the latest version of my category matrix. 

SASS Category Matrix v2.5.pdf

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The new age based category that SASS promulgated this year is El Rey for over 85 is not listed in the matrix.  :angry:

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1 hour ago, Mud Marine,SASS#54686 Life said:

The new age based category that SASS promulgated this year is El Rey for over 85 is not listed in the matrix.  :angry:

B Western is also not on the matrix (I don't shoot that category, just noticed it)

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New category for B western 

 

978F8BFA-D023-454B-B16B-7AE0920A63AB.jpeg

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5 hours ago, StirrupTrouble said:

B Western is also not on the matrix (I don't shoot that category, just noticed it)

Might want to look again:o

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1 minute ago, Jailhouse Jim, SASS #13104 said:

Might want to look again:o

I'm blind I guess. Didn't see it before

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Never thought my question would spark so much discussion!  I do agree the rule book reads like a book written by a committee.

 

My problem is I tend to be too literal.  For example, at the last match, one of the stage directions said using both pistols and your rifle, put three shots on the square targets and two shots on the round target in any order.  The stage had 4 square targets, 2 rectangular targets and one round target.  I couldn’t figure out how to use 20 rounds!  Stupid me - the rectangular target is a square!

 

Off topic... except for the confusion!

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The rules were originally written during in era of gun conrol. The Wild Bunch did not understand Gunfighter, did not personally use it so left it out of the original rules.

 

There are no instances of safety hazards with Gunfighter. The rules are like a farmer's kids shirts and jeans, covered all over with sewn on patches. The entire rule book needs to be made into a logical whole instead of the current patchwork.

 

I have used Gunfighter since I was a boy. I would like to use it in El Rey at EOT next year. It appears to be illegal for no logical reason. This entire thread is a reaction to senseless rules written decades in the past. It just points to the  need for modernization deep into the 21st Century.

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