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Kid Rodelo

Baikal 12 guage????

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A local gun store has a great deal on a Baikal coach shotgun. My question is are these shotguns all the type with true external hammers? Reason I ask is there is the same shotgun posted on here and it was stated that it's possible that the hammers don't actually engage/contact the firing pins they just cock the firing pin mechanism. Thanks

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All of them I have ever seen have actual working hammers; the one I owned certainly did and the one Rooster Ron is selling does. 

 

Some folks get confused because the hammers rebound slightly and don't rest against the firing pins after firing. If you cock the hammer and put a piece of paper behind the firing pin; pull the trigger and you'll see the impact on the paper.

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Just now, Tyrel Cody said:

All of them I have ever seen have actual working hammers; the one I owned certainly did and the one Rooster Ron is selling does. 

 

Some folks get confused because the hammers rebound slightly and don't rest against the firing pins after firing. If you cock the hammer and put a piece of paper behind the firing pin; pull the trigger and you'll see the impact on the paper.

 

+10

 

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Thank you for the clarification!

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They do not all have working hammers.

 

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Posted (edited)
47 minutes ago, Johnny Meadows,SASS#28485L said:

They do not all have working hammers.

 

 

The one I owned the hammers cocked internally making it illegal for CC. I'm no expert, but Johnny's statement is correct.

 

Tully 

 

Edited by Tully Mars
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How would one know which is which?

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1 hour ago, mku140 said:

How would one know which is which?

 

Open and close the shotgun. The hammers should not self cock. Close the gun and pull the triggers You shouldn't hear the click of the hammers falling..

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44 minutes ago, Sedalia Dave said:

 

Open and close the shotgun. The hammers should not self cock. Close the gun and pull the triggers You shouldn't hear the click of the hammers falling..

 

I have never handled one with the "fake" hammers.  But I was under the impression that those hammers cocked internal pins, so the gun doesn't cock itself when opened like a hammerless.  The one with the "real" hammers can be seen visually as Prof. Bullspit mentioned.  Rooster Ron added some pics to his classified posting which show this.

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5 hours ago, Johnny Meadows,SASS#28485L said:

They do not all have working hammers.

 

That is Incorrect information. 

I just sold the one hear on the wire with real working hammers.

If them are not real working hammers I dont know what you are calling real working hammers. 

Just Sayin. 

Rooster 

 

20200501_202254.jpg

20200501_202249.jpg

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14 minutes ago, Rooster Ron Wayne said:

That is Incorrect information. 

I just sold the one hear on the wire with real working hammers.

If them are not real working hammers I dont know what you are calling real working hammers. 

Just Sayin. 

Rooster 

 

 

Rooster, Johnny is correct.  There were two types of Baikal hammer guns.  One type had real hammers that hit firing pins, like yours.  On the other, the external hammers did not strike firing pins.  Those hammers, when pulled back, cock internal strikers.

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As long as you have to cock the external hammers to fire the gun, what difference does it make if they are "real" or not? There is no advantage.

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45 minutes ago, Rooster Ron Wayne said:

That is Incorrect information. 

I just sold the one hear on the wire with real working hammers.

If them are not real working hammers I dont know what you are calling real working hammers. 

Just Sayin. 

Rooster 

 

20200501_202254.jpg

20200501_202249.jpg

 

 

Rooster,

Your gun and you are not in question. Actually I didn't  know Baikal made true hammered shotguns. However there are Baikal hammered shotguns with internally cocking hammers, those shotguns are illegal for CC.

I've owned the internal cocking one and sold it cheap to my good friend Johnny Meadows, who I hope made money on the deal. He knew what he was buying. 

Tully

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10 minutes ago, Tully Mars said:

 

 

Rooster,

Your gun and you are not in question. Actually I didn't  know Baikal made true hammered shotguns. However there are Baikal hammered shotguns with internally cocking hammers, those shotguns are illegal for CC.

I've owned the internal cocking one and sold it cheap to my good friend Johnny Meadows, who I hope made money on the deal. He knew what he was buying. 

Tully

I am aware that they did .

But people painting with such a wide brush are  saying things that are untrue. 

Not all Baikals are Fake Hammered shotguns .

Thay made real Hammered shotguns before they made fake Hammered shotguns .

So my point is even a gunsmith should  not paint with so big of a brush to give people bad information. 

Rooster 

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57 minutes ago, Rooster Ron Wayne said:

I am aware that they did .

But people painting with such a wide brush are  saying things that are untrue. 

Not all Baikals are Fake Hammered shotguns .

Thay made real Hammered shotguns before they made fake Hammered shotguns .

So my point is even a gunsmith should  not paint with so big of a brush to give people bad information. 

Rooster 

Johnny Meadows simply said, "they do not ALL have working hammers". Absolutely true.  You also pointed out that they made different functioning models. Meadowsis comment is not falsely painting with a broad brush. It shouldn't be this hard to understand.

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3 hours ago, Smokin Gator SASS #29736 said:

Johnny Meadows simply said, "they do not ALL have working hammers". Absolutely true.  You also pointed out that they made different functioning models. Meadowsis comment is not falsely painting with a broad brush. It shouldn't be this hard to understand.

My appolagys I missed the word ALL !

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Posted (edited)

I have three, two fake and one real, so to speak.

 

I bought a fake one from Johnny Meadows and he let me know, before the purchase, that it was not a true hammered model.

Edited by Lone Rider, SASS# 73063

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mku140,

So didja buy it??  Huh?  huh????

 

:)

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58 minutes ago, Abilene, SASS # 27489 said:

mku140,

So didja buy it??  Huh?  huh????

 

:)

Unfortunately he waited to long and missed it .

But I'm sure the buyer is going to be very happy. 

It's a super clean and nice true Hammered Shotgun 

Rooster 

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Shows my ignorance, I was told long ago the Baikal and Rossi’s both had cosmetic hammers....I’m sure I was told by with all honesty and sincerity in mind...... 

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The Rossi’s all have working hammers and are one of the best hammered doubles. J M

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2 hours ago, Johnny Meadows,SASS#28485L said:

The Rossi’s all have working hammers and are one of the best hammered doubles. J M

 

Howdy Johnny.  I have heard the Rossi hammer guns praised for years, but also questions about lack of parts.  Is that a concern?

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I believe the true hammered Baikal is the MP220F model.  Imported by EAA as Bounty Hunter.  

The fake hammer model is the IZH-43K - EAA's Bounty Hunter II.

If you have better info, please let me know.

 

Good luck, GJ

 

 

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Yes, the Rossi parts are scarce, luckily they do not break often. I have had to make parts occasionally to keep them running.

J.M.

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On 5/2/2020 at 3:49 PM, Springfield Slim SASS #24733 said:

As long as you have to cock the external hammers to fire the gun, what difference does it make if they are "real" or not? There is no advantage.

The difference being the ROC determined the cosmetic/faux hammers are not legal for classic cowboy. 

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