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doc roy l. pain

16 gauge black powder

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Picked up a 16 ga. Stoeger SxS in a trade. Still has full length barrels. I would like to turn it into a black powder small game gun. I’ve loaded plenty of 12 ga. black for cowboy but never 16 ga.  Which plastic wad would you recommend for a nice 1oz. load that will give me the room to load black powder behind and still get a good crimp. 

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You might want to PM Lefty Dude, he has extensive knowledge loading BP in the 16gauge and is very willing to share his information. I shoot 16 gauge also but haven’t delved into BP loading yet. 

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You might want to check out Ballistic Products at www.balisticproducts.com. They have a very good selection of 16 Ga. components for smokeless load. If you are thinking about black powder you can't beat Circle Fly Wads.

 

Lucky

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I’m looking for something similar in 16ga. to the Winchester red wad used in 12 ga. 

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Call Claybuster ??

 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, doc roy l. pain said:

I’m looking for something similar in 16ga. to the Winchester red wad used in 12 ga. 

 

You will want the shortest length cushion section and largest shot cup you can find in 16 gauge.   BPI will likely be your source - Claybuster does not have a real suitable BP wad for 16 gauge.

 

Use this link (the one posted above will not usually work)

https://www.ballisticproducts.com/

 

Good luck, GJ

Edited by Garrison Joe, SASS #60708

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+1 on Circle fly wads  Plastic shot cups, not so much.

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A "good game load" is one that kills humanely, which means it should generate a muzzle velocity of about 1200 fps, which is considered the magic number for shot penetration and breaking bones on small game.  I have never loaded 16 gauge shells but my thoughts:

 

I would go to a store that sells a variety of 16 gauge shells (good luck with that) and look at the boxes and find a brand that boasts a velocity of 1200 fps + with 1 ounce of shot.  The "dram equivalent" of powder should be on the box.  That is supposed to be the amount of black powder that would give the same ballistic performance as the smokeless charge in the shells.

 

A "dram" is 27 grains of blackpowder.  You are probably looking at loading about 2 or 2 1/drams (somewhere in the neighborhood of 50 to 60 grains) under your shot charge.  I'm thinking you are going to have to experiment, either using fiber wads or plastic shot cups to get the stack height right for the hulls you want to use.  The good news is you can tweak the powder charge up or down using black powder much more safely than you could with smokeless powders.  You can also trim the petals of the shot cup if you need to.  Also, if you are using these for hunting, you probably won't have to make thousands of them.  Unless you are going dove hunting in South America.

 

Please let us know what you wind up with.  And good luck.

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Doc, several have mentioned ballistic products wads. Specifically I would look at the SG16S, it has the shortest oal with a hollow cup design that would allow for the extra room you will need. Personally I would try 60gr. (Vol) of 3f and 1 oz of 7.5 shot as a starting point. I shoot a similar load (1 1/8 0z) in my 12ga that cleanly takes game. As you most likely know don't be afraid to put some crunch on the wad, black loves compression. Hope to shoot with you soon. Crazy

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Howdy :

I have been loading 16 Ga. for both the field and SASS for about Two Decades , ClayBuster CBO100 - 16  , Remington SP 16 and WAA16 - 16ga. Wads  ....

I use Mostly the Claybuster Wads as they are the Cheapest ,,, But I got a great deal on the Winchester wads ,,, and was given some Remington so I have been using the Winchester and Remington's Lately .... All work great With 1 oz. to 1 1/16 oz of shot over 3.4 CC of Goex 3F ...

And All pattern great out of my current 5, 16 ga. guns ,,, and also out of 3 others I sold to fellow shooters ...

I have taken Sharp-tail Grouse to to 45 + yards with no problem ... Using 7 1/2 hard Shot ...

 

Jabez Cowboy 

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My sincere thanks to all that have taken the time to offer me tips and advise.  Over the course of the next few months I will be gathering components, work up some loads and  test them for this falls hunts.  I’ll post what I come up with when completed. 

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2 hours ago, Jabez Cowboy,SASS # 50129 said:

 All work great With 1 oz. to 1 1/16 oz of shot over 3.4 CC of Goex 3F ...

 

3.4 CC of powder is approximately 51 grains.

 

(3.4 CC X 15 grains/CC = 51 grains)

 

Sounds good to me!!  :)

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10 hours ago, J-BAR #18287 said:

 

3.4 CC of powder is approximately 51 grains.

 

(3.4 CC X 15 grains/CC = 51 grains)

 

Sounds good to me!!  :)

I figured 50-60 grains would be where I ended up. I will experiment with different wads till I get the correct height and performance for the load

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Anything BP always seems to catch my attention, but I've yet to dabble in it with any seriousness.

 

http://home.insightbb.com/~bspen/shotgun.html

 

In all my research the bottom line seems to be fiber wads (hunting loads). CAS loads are not hunting loads as a rule. I'd also look into finding paper hulls, as they seal the chamber/forcing cone area a bit better than the thin plastic hulls. Brass hulls are even thinner, but they seal because they use oversize wads. 

 

https://circlefly.com/wad-sizing-chart

 

I fooled with using parchment paper for a shot cup, single layer and two layers. Pellets rubbing on the bore tend to fly off, exit the pattern. Some sort of shot cup would be a good idea. 

 

Have fun, let us know how it works, I'd like to strike that bucket list experience off my list. I already went 16 ga for a bit, until the cost of ammo, and scarcity killed that. I have an 870, an 1897 and a Cooey single shot in 16. The '97 has a 2 9/16 chamber, another curve that I didn't need. 

 

BB

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My SASS / Hunting Loads are One and the Same ....

And average 1,240 FPS out of my 28 inch guns and 1,255 out of all but one 30 inch gun ....

Patterns give classic performance as in Shoot patterns according as to choke percentages ...

 

Jabez Cowboy  

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I buy primed, low brass Cheddite  hulls from Graf's.  For cowboy, I get 2 or 3 uses out of the ones that don't get stepped on.  Using reclaimed hulls from store-bought smokeless 16 ga didn't work out very well for me.  Hulls are not very sturdy and the amount of time I spent fooling with the failed ones to take it apart for the components wasn't worth it to me.  Wads are Remington SP16 and I cut down the petals a little bit.  I also use an overshot card to aid in a nice crimp.  You are on the right track with some good suggestions for starting points to develop your load.  Lefty is Da Man when it comes to 16 ga for sure!  You do want to get compression on the powder, as with any BP load but it's easier to overdo it with plastic hulls than brass cases so either use a case checker or drop them in the shotgun and tip them out to make sure the load fits.  

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You can always go brass shell with a nitro card and fiber wad over your black powder.  Ballistic Products has all the shells, nitro cards, wads and overshot cards on their website.  When resized and roll crimped with the CH4D 16 gauge die set (available at Buffalo Arms), they will drop in and fall out of your gun as easily as plastic.

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