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Roger Rapid

Transporting CAS guns into California

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Posted (edited)
We have another SASSwire post going about our 5th Annual Lazy Arrow ShootOut and I didn’t want to hijack it with this content as I feel this is a very important separate topic.
 
I’ve received two emails from out-of-state shooters who would like to come to our Lazy Arrow ShootOut in May but are concerned about California gun laws. Although California has rather restrictive gun laws, they are very manageable for Cowboy Action Shooters™.  Here’s an outline as I see it (please note that this is my understanding of the pertinent laws. I’m not an attorney or gun-law specialist, so I urge that you take this at face value and do some extra research if you have any further concerns):
 
1) Out-of-state residents can bring (CAS caliber) ammo into California for matches or hunting as long as they do not leave the ammo here, or sell it here. They must leave with the ammo they did not use.
 
2) Out-of-state residents cannot purchase ammo in California unless they are either active military (with certain qualifications) or active peace officers who carry firearms in the course of their duties (and have certain qualifications). So, don't forget your ammo or expect to buy more when you're here.
 
3) It is legal to bring any of the cowboy action rifles and pistols (of CAS calibers) into California for matches, but you cannot sell them here or leave them here unless it is with and through an FFL. None of the cowboy action rifles and/or pistols (of CAS calibers) are on the “endangered species” or “Roster of Handguns” lists; they are legal to own, transport, and use in California. 
 
4) In California, all guns must be transported unloaded with no ammo in the magazine. Handguns must be in locked cases (not glove compartments.) Long guns can be in unlocked cases, and both should be in locked vehicle trunks. For those of you driving pickups, it is legal in California to transport your pistols (in locked cases) and rifles (in unlocked cases) on your back floor or passenger seat.  See this CA DOJ link: https://oag.ca.gov/firearms/travel
 
5) If you are stopped by a police officer for any traffic violation, it is a good idea to tell them you have unloaded guns in the vehicle, safely and properly locked up.
 
6) The border check points are agricultural and customs stops. Their concern is with who is coming into the U.S. on the northern and southern borders (Border Patrol / Customs), and whether someone is transporting firewood, fruits, vegetables, and similar agricultural goods into California. They ask “do you have any fruits and vegetables or firewood?” they do not ask “do you have firearms or ammunition?” (as they do when you enter Canada).
 
7) It is always a good idea that the guns you have with you are legally registered.
 
8) California is not an open carry state (without proper permits).
 
9) There are no California rules (yet) on the purchase or transportation of reloading components.
 
10) Many of us Californians regularly travel back and forth to out-of-state matches without problems either leaving or coming into California with our Cowboy guns and ammo.
 
Hope this puts your mind at ease a bit - Come enjoy the 5th Annual Lazy Arrow ShootOut with us!
 
RR
Edited by Roger Rapid
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39 minutes ago, Roger Rapid said:
7) It is always a good idea that the guns you have with you are legally registered

 

What means "legally registered"?

(just curious)

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If your state registers firearms, just have your paperwork. If not - it's not a problem here in CA. 

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I travel to other states for CAS matches and have never had any problems, issues or questions at the border regarding guns or ammo. I haven't been pulled over for any traffic violations in a very long time, so can't say if the LEO's are dragging folks out of their cars and strip searching them looking for guns and ammo, but I doubt it. IMO all of this is of little concern. I just get in the car and move on down the road. I don't drive down the road shooting out the window or waving a gun around. Unless you are breaking the traffic laws, there is VERY LITTLE chance that you would ever be pulled over. If I were to be pulled over for speeding, I personally would not say a word about firearms, unless ask, except.... if I had a gun in the glove box and was reaching for the car registration papers. In that case, you better have a California CCW.  Also.. if you don't have any illegal guns with you, I don't see any problem even in the unlikely event that a LEO were to check for guns. There are no guns used in CAS that are illegal in California. If you are truly concerned, just go to Harbor Freight and buy one of their boxes, put you handguns in it, throw a lock on it, and be DONE with it!  I would be more worried about entering some states with CBD oil in my travel bag, that could be a federal issue! IMO, all of this Hoopla is greatly exaggerated. 

 

Snakebite

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I've taken my cowboy guns and ammo to Ca. several times. I'm pretty sure there's a rule in their laws that says guns and ammo can't be stored in the same space when transporting. When I took the pickup the guns were in the back seat area and the ammo was in the pickup bed, when taking the SUV the guns were in the rear passenger space and ammo in the rear cargo area. It's not really that much of a hassle,  you just need to pay attention to and follow the rules just in case you were to be stopped and checked for any reason.

 

HRD 

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I think the law about guns and ammo being stored together applies to being in the same case.... such as a gun rug with a handgun in it, and also ammo. If the handguns are in a locked case, and the ammo is in an ammo can, they are not stored in the same place. At least that is my take on it. 

 

Snakebite

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From the CA CHP website:

 

California law does not recognize concealed weapon permits from other states; therefore, they would not be held valid. If you wish to transport a handgun during your California visit, it should be carried unloaded in a locked container. In the absence of a suitable container, you may secure the unloaded handgun in the locked trunk of a passenger car. Ammunition may be kept in the same container or trunk, but the handgun must remain unloaded with no rounds in the cylinder and no loaded magazines in the magazine well.

If you have additional questions, contact the California Department of Justice at (916) 227-3703.

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7 hours ago, PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L said:

 

What means "legally registered"?

(just curious)

Right? registered WTH?

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PWB… 

Thanks requesting clarification. Reference to guns that are “legally registered” is to guns that have clear title as a result of the owner filling out a 4473 form on purchase from an FFL dealer (some states don’t require 4473 for gunshows or yardsales). More specifically, I was referring to guns that are not stolen. California is one of about 12 states that require stolen guns to be reported to DOJ and are entered into a system known as CLETS (California Law Enforcement Telecommunications System) which I “think” is linked to the FBI's database. In California, "transporting a stolen firearm carries a maximum penaly of 10 years in prison.” (https://www.shouselaw.com). 
 
California DOJ urges residents to register firearms (while many folks do not,) especially when they move in from out of state. Being involved in an incident with a non-regtistered firearm is a very sticky mess. Being in involved in an incident with a stolen firearm is a felony.
 
Professor Rog… 
Actually, in California if your guns are registered in DROS (California’s gun registry) you don’t really need to carry any paperwork with you. All you need to be is in the DROS system; the back-up teams for LEOs have access to that info in a flash.
 
RR

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Posted (edited)

Folks from out of state can NOT buy ammo in CA.

Your non-LEO, CC permit is not recognized in CA.

Handguns must be in a locked case and ammo in separate container.

Loaded magazine in the car, in PRK = LOADED GUN.....

OLG 

Edited by The Original Lumpy Gritz

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Posted (edited)

Snakebite and Lumpy Gritz:

"There is no prohibition in California against carrying ammunition within the same motor vehicle or compartment in the vehicle, as long as the firearms are not loaded and ammunition is not attached in any manner to the firearm." (PC §12025, 12026 and 12031)  Basically, the specific issue is more about the firearms not being loaded than it is about where the ammo is transported. To which, “A firearm is deemed loaded when there is a live cartridge or shell in, or attached in any manner to, the firearm, including, but not limited to, the firing chamber, magazine, or clip thereof attached to the firearm.” (PC §16840)
RR
Edited by Roger Rapid
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SASS began in California. I was not concerned about shooting there. I did a lot of NRA bullseye competition while in the Marine Corps. Now, am not convinced that it's safe for me to bring my guns there. I am comfortable shooting in Canada with my PAL. It appears  that California has some grey areas. What is the "incident" may cause a problem with firearms. The California attitude toward guns is too adverse for me. Life is too short for me to go in harms way voluntarily.

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1 hour ago, Mud Marine,SASS#54686 Life said:

I am comfortable shooting in Canada with my PAL.


I see you are right across the street from Canada.
I've driven 95 from Reno to Boise a zillion times.. but never all the way up to the end of 95 at the border.

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3 hours ago, Mud Marine,SASS#54686 Life said:

SASS began in California. I was not concerned about shooting there. I did a lot of NRA bullseye competition while in the Marine Corps. Now, am not convinced that it's safe for me to bring my guns there. I am comfortable shooting in Canada with my PAL. It appears  that California has some grey areas. What is the "incident" may cause a problem with firearms. The California attitude toward guns is too adverse for me. Life is too short for me to go in harms way voluntarily.

We wouldn't want to Idahoficate California anyway :P :lol:

 

I just had to do it...:D

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4 hours ago, Roger Rapid said:

Snakebite and Lumpy Gritz:

"There is no prohibition in California against carrying ammunition within the same motor vehicle or compartment in the vehicle, as long as the firearms are not loaded and ammunition is not attached in any manner to the firearm." (PC §12025, 12026 and 12031)  Basically, the specific issue is more about the firearms not being loaded than it is about where the ammo is transported. To which, “A firearm is deemed loaded when there is a live cartridge or shell in, or attached in any manner to, the firearm, including, but not limited to, the firing chamber, magazine, or clip thereof attached to the firearm.” (PC §16840)
RR

If the loaded mag or speed loader is in the case with the weapon in a 'car'. In CA, that is considered a loaded.

That does NOT apply to the living area of a RV. 

YUP, pretty screwed up!

OLG 

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Boise is in another world. It's full of escaped Californians.  :angry:

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Yep.
Boise is my home town... left in 1967, never came back other than a visit for a few days.
Hardly know the place today...
Bums, traffic, crime, congestion, bad air quality, overpriced housing, and longest running Mayor in city history.. is a Democrat.
Just like California, but without the weather or the glitter.

It seems they follow the computer industry.

I just saw a 1200 sq.ft house in the Boise north end at $575,000...
 

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8 hours ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

Folks from out of state can NOT buy ammo in CA.

Your non-LEO, CC permit is not recognized in CA.

Handguns must be in a locked case and ammo in separate container.

Loaded magazine in the car, in PRK = LOADED GUN.....

OLG 

 

Sounds exactly like Massachusetts.

 

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20 hours ago, Roger Rapid said:

5) If you are stopped by a police officer for any traffic violation, it is a good idea to tell them you have unloaded guns in the vehicle, safely and properly locked up.


 

I disagree with this. 

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4 hours ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

If the loaded mag or speed loader is in the case with the weapon in a 'car'. In CA, that is considered a loaded.

 

This is incorrect. Attached is the penal code defining “loaded”


12031. (a) (1) A person is guilty of carrying a loaded firearm when he or she carries a loaded firearm on his or her person or in a vehicle while in any public place or on any public street in an incorporated city or in any public place or on any public street in a prohibited area of unincorporated territory. 

[Since this post concentrates on loaded, other parts of 12031 are omitted, including the definitions of other terms in (a)(1).]

(g) A firearm shall be deemed to be loaded for the purposes of this section when there is an unexpended cartridge or shell, consisting of a case that holds a charge of powder and a bullet or shot, in, or attached in any manner to, the firearm, including, but not limited to, in the firing chamber, magazine, or clip thereof attached to the firearm; 

except that a muzzle-loader firearm shall be deemed to be loaded when it is capped or primed and has a powder charge and ball or shot in the barrel or cylinder.

 

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Kid Currey... 

You are right for disagreeing with my comment about advising LEOs about guns in the car (# 5 in my original post). My bad; I was wrong. I asked a Sergeant LEO friend of mine to look over this post and give me some input. He agreed with the content but pointed out that you are NOT required to advise a LEO that you have firearms in the vehicle on a routine traffic or similar stop UNLESS he has reason to ask to search you vehicle. If you agree that he can search it, it is very wise to first say that there are unloaded guns in vehicle or trunk.

RR

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5 hours ago, Mud Marine,SASS#54686 Life said:

Boise is in another world. It's full of escaped Californians.  :angry:

All 3 of them?

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3 hours ago, Kid Curry, SASS# 2924 said:

 

This is incorrect. Attached is the penal code defining “loaded”


12031. (a) (1) A person is guilty of carrying a loaded firearm when he or she carries a loaded firearm on his or her person or in a vehicle while in any public place or on any public street in an incorporated city or in any public place or on any public street in a prohibited area of unincorporated territory. 

[Since this post concentrates on loaded, other parts of 12031 are omitted, including the definitions of other terms in (a)(1).]

(g) A firearm shall be deemed to be loaded for the purposes of this section when there is an unexpended cartridge or shell, consisting of a case that holds a charge of powder and a bullet or shot, in, or attached in any manner to, the firearm, including, but not limited to, in the firing chamber, magazine, or clip thereof attached to the firearm; 

except that a muzzle-loader firearm shall be deemed to be loaded when it is capped or primed and has a powder charge and ball or shot in the barrel or cylinder.

 

 

:blink: You have a loaded mag with the gun in PRK. It's a loaded gun.

Call the CA DOJ.......

OLG 

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Folks, please call the DOJ for specific questions about transportation of firearms in CA.  The code sections cited in this thread are no longer valid.  For example, transportation of firearms has been moved to CAPC 25400-25850.

 

Much of the information contained here is correct but some is not.  In a nutshell to make it simple, you may carry SASS firearms in the following manner legally.  Please call the DOJ to verify.

 

All handguns are to be transported in a locked box and unloaded.  Car trunks are considered locked containers.  

 

Long guns can be transported in any manner but must be unloaded.

 

Ammunition should be transported in a separate container that is not attached to the firearms in any manner.  Loaded magazines for a 1911 can not be attached to or in the magazine well.  It's best to keep your magazines with the rest of your ammunition.

 

You will not be asked if you are carrying firearms at the border crossings, those are USDA inspection stations that are looking for plants, fruit, and wood.  

 

If you are stopped for a traffic violation or a call for service, do not volunteer any information about your legally transported firearms.  If the officer asks to search your vehicle (very unlikely unless you have something illegal in the open) for any reason, say no.  If he's asking, he doesn't have the PC to search.  If he has PC to search, let him find the firearms.  If they are carried legally, he will move on to the original PC issue.

 

Non LEO CCWs are no good in CA.  Lock your unloaded CC firearm up with your SASS handguns and you're good. 

 

Your firearms do not have to be listed in the AFS (automated firearms system) unless you are a CA resident and carrying it concealed with a CA CCW permit.

 

This is all common sense kind of stuff and none of it difficult to comply with.  Please come to California to enjoy the birthplace of SASS and so many of the fine clubs that operate here.

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Posted (edited)

I think the intent of the OP was to emphasize that it's not a problem for folks to come shoot with us in California with their CAS guns. As Jailhouse Jim said "Please come to California to enjoy the birthplace of SASS and so many of the fine clubs that operate here." Like Pozo River Vigilance Committee, and our neighboring clubs: Chorro Valley Regulators,  King's River Regulators,  5 Dogs Creek, and many others.

 

We are well aware of the crazy politics and laws in our state, but there are a lot of good folks still here (by choice or necessity) that enjoy getting together with like-minded CAS folks at the many great matches we have here in California. Speaking of good folks, we were recently at Bordertown in Tombstone, AZ (great shoot!), and over half the folks in our posse were from California; someone said "I like shooting with you California people, you guys are a ton of fun!" to which there were many hoots of agreement.

 

As High Rock Drifter said "It's not really that much of a hassle", so please don't let our crazy laws keep you from enjoying the great clubs and folks here in California. We understand it makes you bristle to have to carry your firearms unloaded and locked up, but it means a lot to us that you'd endure the temporary indignity of it to come shoot with us!

 

I'm one of the many that Roger Rapid mentioned when he said "Many of us Californians regularly travel back and forth to out-of-state matches without problems either leaving or coming into California with our Cowboy guns and ammo" and we travel all over this big scenic state to visit other clubs here as well. I've yet to hear of anyone being harassed or having problems within the state either. From all I've seen and heard, most LEOs are firearms enthusiasts and appreciate our sport.

 

Living in California may not be your cup of tea, and many of us here share your sentiments, but please at least come visit us! There are some terrific folks in the CAS clubs here, and the weather and the amazing scenic beauty of our state are pretty nice too!

 

We at  the Pozo River Vigilance Committee especially encourage you to come join us at our 5th Annual Lazy Arrow Shootout! 

 

Edited by Bushy Blonco
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will not be trying to shoot in calif any time soon but this does raise so many questions doesn't it ? 

 

for having a second amendment right - it seems having guns is near as difficult as speaking with consideration of your first amendment right these days - funny these two were of primary importance when attached to our constitution and most assaulted these days , why isnt any other like that one about taxing us under the same ? it is not just California but ill bite my cheek at this point , 

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The Tenth is not getting much support from the Left. :wub:

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On 1/6/2020 at 9:13 PM, Roger Rapid said:
1) Out-of-state residents can bring (CAS caliber) ammo into California for matches or hunting as long as they do not leave the ammo here, or sell it here. They must leave with the ammo they did not use. Incorrect, Ammo can leave the state. 
 
2) Out-of-state residents cannot purchase ammo in California unless they are either active military (with certain qualifications) or active peace officers who carry firearms in the course of their duties (and have certain qualifications). So, don't forget your ammo or expect to buy more when you're here.
 
3) It is legal to bring any of the cowboy action rifles and pistols (of CAS calibers) into California for matches, but you cannot sell them here or leave them here unless it is with and through an FFL. None of the cowboy action rifles and/or pistols (of CAS calibers) are on the “endangered species” or “Roster of Handguns” lists; they are legal to own, transport, and use in California. 
 
4) In California, all guns must be transported unloaded with no ammo in the magazine. Handguns must be in locked cases (not glove compartments.) Long guns can be in unlocked cases, and both should be in locked vehicle trunks. For those of you driving pickups, it is legal in California to transport your pistols (in locked cases) and rifles (in unlocked cases) on your back floor or passenger seat.  See this CA DOJ link: https://oag.ca.gov/firearms/travel. Incorrect And OLG is dead wrong. I live here, I've been pulled over and Oh I have a younger brother in CHP so I can get code sited to me. As mentioned the laws on loaded guns have changed due to a court ruling about a shotgun and a stock mounted ammo carrier. the law now recognizes that a firearm is loaded when the ammunition is in a position that would normally be ready to fire. That mean a load magazine inserted in the weapon.  or a loaded cylinder. or a loaded muzzle loader or cap and ball pistol with charge and projectile and a caped nipple or priming charge in the pan. Yes the law even went so far as to site a muzzle loader
 
5) If you are stopped by a police officer for any traffic violation, it is a good idea to tell them you have unloaded guns in the vehicle, safely and properly locked up. Incorrect, It's never a good idea to forward any information to a LEO
 
6) The border check points are agricultural and customs stops. Their concern is with who is coming into the U.S. on the northern and southern borders (Border Patrol / Customs), and whether someone is transporting firewood, fruits, vegetables, and similar agricultural goods into California. They ask “do you have any fruits and vegetables or firewood?” they do not ask “do you have firearms or ammunition?” (as they do when you enter Canada).
 
7) It is always a good idea that the guns you have with you are legally registered. There is no Federal registration. And it is not against any law in California to be in possession of an unregistered firearm. Unless your firearm is on a stolen list you have nothing to worry about. 
 
8) California is not an open carry state (without proper permits).
 
9) There are no California rules (yet) on the purchase or transportation of reloading components.
 
10) Many of us Californians regularly travel back and forth to out-of-state matches without problems either leaving or coming into California with our Cowboy guns and ammo.

 

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11 hours ago, watab kid said:

will not be trying to shoot in calif any time soon but this does raise so many questions doesn't it ? 

 

for having a second amendment right - it seems having guns is near as difficult as speaking with consideration of your first amendment right these days - funny these two were of primary importance when attached to our constitution and most assaulted these days , why isnt any other like that one about taxing us under the same ? it is not just California but ill bite my cheek at this point , 

If you don't already know you should take a look at what Virginia is doing. California has some of the worst gun laws in the state but even our legislature stops at blatant violations of the 2A. Virginia seen what California has done and said "Hold my beer"

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On 1/7/2020 at 9:25 PM, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

 

:blink: You have a loaded mag with the gun in PRK. It's a loaded gun.

Call the CA DOJ.......

OLG 

Sorry OLG I live here and that is patently false. I read code, I have family and friends in law enforcement. You can have all the ammo you like in the same case as your firearm. in mags, speed loaders, enbloc clips, stripper clips, it don't matter. they just can not be in the firearm. as in mag well must be empty, cylinder must be empty. 

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39 minutes ago, Son of the Midnight Star said:

Sorry OLG I live here and that is patently false. I read code, I have family and friends in law enforcement. You can have all the ammo you like in the same case as your firearm. in mags, speed loaders, enbloc clips, stripper clips, it don't matter. they just can not be in the firearm. as in mag well must be empty, cylinder must be empty. 

I lived and worked in PRK for over 50 yrs.

Good part of that time as a LEO.

You really need to contact CA-DOJ before posting any more 'advice'.-_-

A loaded mag with the gun, is a 'loaded-gun' in PRK........

Carry on-

OLG 

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The grey area is in the word "attached."    PC § 16840 specifically states that "A firearm is deemed loaded when there is a live cartridge or shell in, or attached in any manner to, the firearm, including, but not limited to, the firing chamber, magazine, or clip thereof attached to the firearm." 

 

I have heard explanations from several different LEOs that a separate loaded magazine in the same rug as the handgun is considered "attached" to the handgun - as a loaded shotgun sleeve on a stock is to the shotgun. So, ditto to Lumpy Gritz description

 

So much of this is up to interpretation.

 

RR

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16 minutes ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

I lived and worked in PRK for over 50 yrs.

Good part of that time as a LEO.

You really need to contact CA-DOJ before posting any more 'advice'.-_-

A loaded mag with the gun, is a 'loaded-gun' in PRK........

Carry on-

OLG 

Problem #1 Cal DOJ is the largest source of misinformation. California's definition of a loaded firearm is listed in the code books. It's been cited in posts above, and there is a court ruling on the specifics of exactly what "loaded" means, and a loaded magazine in the same container is not among them. A loaded magazine in the mag well is loaded though.  The DOJ has a bad habit of underground regulations that are not laws. You usually find out about these that hard way. take a federal judge to tell them to knock it off. 
I've called the DOJ twice in my life and both times have been less then pleasant interactions. Very badge heavy people attempting to interrogate over the phone when you're just looking for a little clarity 

Please cite code or court cases that affirms your opinion. 

 

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40 minutes ago, Roger Rapid said:

The grey area is in the word "attached."    PC § 16840 specifically states that "A firearm is deemed loaded when there is a live cartridge or shell in, or attached in any manner to, the firearm, including, but not limited to, the firing chamber, magazine, or clip thereof attached to the firearm." 

 

I have heard explanations from several different LEOs that a separate loaded magazine in the same rug as the handgun is considered "attached" to the handgun - as a loaded shotgun sleeve on a stock is to the shotgun. So, ditto to Lumpy Gritz description

 

So much of this is up to interpretation.

 

RR

This seems easy enough to deal with.  Playing interpretation or hair-splitting games with a LEO seems like carrying stubbornness to the point of self torment.   Why not err on the side of caution and simply carry the loaded clips In a different place to the cased firearm.  Just put them in your ammo box. 

 

To my understanding, ammo doesn't have to be locked up.  But do keep in mind that some cities (Portland ORE or San Jose CA for example) have more stringent local codes that apply as you drive through them.   Having a run-in with a local LEO or judge in one of those cities will cost you delays, possibly a trip downtown in the back of a cruiser, lawyer fees and loss of your gun for a long time, even if you prevail in court.   To me, the risks just aren't worth it.   

 

If you aspire to be a high profile 2A activist, like Heller or McDonald, and you have boocoo $ backing you, then challenge LEOs and laws to your heart's content.  But if you just want to get to the matches and home again without stress or duress, then simply complying with the most stringent interpretations is much cleaner. 

Just saying. 

Your choice, as always.   

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45 minutes ago, Roger Rapid said:

The grey area is in the word "attached."    PC § 16840 specifically states that "A firearm is deemed loaded when there is a live cartridge or shell in, or attached in any manner to, the firearm, including, but not limited to, the firing chamber, magazine, or clip thereof attached to the firearm." 

 

I have heard explanations from several different LEOs that a separate loaded magazine in the same rug as the handgun is considered "attached" to the handgun - as a loaded shotgun sleeve on a stock is to the shotgun. So, ditto to Lumpy Gritz description

 

So much of this is up to interpretation.

 

RR

Incorrect. 

Please see court case below
https://law.justia.com/cases/california/court-of-appeal/4th/45/1147.html

a small quote from the case

The Legislature in Penal Code section 12031, subdivision (g), provided some examples of how a shell would be "attached" to a firearm so that the firearm is loaded, i.e., in the firing chamber, magazine or clip; situations in which the firearm would be "loaded" in the usual meaning of the word, i.e., the shell is placed in a position from which it can be fired. Significantly, the Legislature also provided that a muzzle-loader firearm must be capped or primed, have a powder charge and ball in the barrel or cylinder before it is deemed "loaded," again a definition which is consistent with the common meaning of the term "loaded," i.e., ready for firing.

So based on the case law. the ammunition must be attached to the firearm in a way that it is in a position to be fired. I.e. magazine loaded and inserted in the firearm. 
The only time ammo in possession constitutes a loaded firearm is when you have the intent to commit a felony  

 

PENAL CODE - PEN

PART 6. CONTROL OF DEADLY WEAPONS [16000 - 34370]

  ( Part 6 added by Stats. 2010, Ch. 711, Sec. 6. )

  

TITLE 1. PRELIMINARY PROVISIONS [16000 - 17360]

  ( Title 1 added by Stats. 2010, Ch. 711, Sec. 6. )
  

DIVISION 2. DEFINITIONS [16100 - 17360]

  ( Division 2 added by Stats. 2010, Ch. 711, Sec. 6. )
  
16840.  

(a) As used in Section 25800, a firearm shall be deemed to be “loaded” whenever both the firearm and the unexpended ammunition capable of being discharged from the firearm are in the immediate possession of the same person.

(b) As used in Chapter 2 (commencing with Section 25100) of Division 4 of Title 4, in subparagraph (A) of paragraph (6) of subdivision (c) of Section 25400, and in Sections 25850 to 26055, inclusive,

(1) A firearm shall be deemed to be “loaded” when there is an unexpended cartridge or shell, consisting of a case that holds a charge of powder and a bullet or shot, in, or attached in any manner to, the firearm, including, but not limited to, in the firing chamber, magazine, or clip thereof attached to the firearm.

(2) Notwithstanding paragraph (1), a muzzle-loader firearm shall be deemed to be loaded when it is capped or primed and has a powder charge and ball or shot in the barrel or cylinder.

(Added by Stats. 2010, Ch. 711, Sec. 6. (SB 1080) Effective January 1, 2011. Operative January 1, 2012, by Sec. 10 of Ch. 711.)
 

PENAL CODE - PEN

PART 6. CONTROL OF DEADLY WEAPONS [16000 - 34370]

  ( Part 6 added by Stats. 2010, Ch. 711, Sec. 6. )
  

TITLE 4. FIREARMS [23500 - 34370]

  ( Title 4 added by Stats. 2010, Ch. 711, Sec. 6. )
  

DIVISION 5. CARRYING FIREARMS [25300 - 26405]

  ( Division 5 added by Stats. 2010, Ch. 711, Sec. 6. )
  

CHAPTER 3. Carrying a Loaded Firearm [25800 - 26100]

  ( Chapter 3 added by Stats. 2010, Ch. 711, Sec. 6. )
  
 
ARTICLE 1. Armed Criminal Action [25800- 25800.]
  ( Article 1 added by Stats. 2010, Ch. 711, Sec. 6. )

  
25800.  

(a) Every person who carries a loaded firearm with the intent to commit a felony is guilty of armed criminal action.

(b) Armed criminal action is punishable by imprisonment in a county jail not exceeding one year, or in the state prison.

(Added by Stats. 2010, Ch. 711, Sec. 6. (SB 1080) Effective January 1, 2011. Operative January 1, 2012, by Sec. 10 of Ch. 711.)

 

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