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Powder?


Old Man Graybeard

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Can anyone tell me which discontinued powder it is that works very well in centerfire cast lead bullet loads? I have seen this information before...but of course I didn't write it down and can't remember.  Thanks   OMG

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I am currently finishing off the last Solo 1000 in the Middle Tenn area. Been discontinued for several years. I have found Clean Shot to work well and is available.

 

Imis 

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Not sure. Gun show here at home this weekend. One guy that I know has some powder for sale 

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9 minutes ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

FYI, you can use Unique to load everything in SASS.  ;)

OLG 


Have any idea what a Unique load would be for a 6.5 Arisaka?  I need to work up a long range load for WR.

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You are thinking of IMR 4759.   In cast bullet loads for medium sized cases (like 30-06) and large (like 45-70) it was the powder of choice for accuracy with cast bullets for over 50 years.   I've got a little left that goes into high-accuracy '06 loadings.    It's well worth $40 or more a pound to cast bullet shooters.

 

Why this powder was discontinued is beyond comprehension.  Although 5744 and a couple of other powders today can come close, 4759 was extremely accurate in so many cartridges and needed little "babying" to make a good load.

 

Good luck, GJ

 

PS - 4759 was called out many times in Ideal Handbook 36 loads, from 1949.  Le'see - that's about 70 years, huh?

 

It was reportedly was used in grenade launching cartridges by the US military for many of our recent excursions overseas, but has been edged out by other propellants.

 

 

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Have any idea what a Unique load would be for a 6.5 Arisaka?

Unique has a too fast burn rate for the 6.5 (32 RQ).  Need a slower burn rate powder such as IMR 4350 - burn rate 118

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The 6.5x50 is at its best with medium weight (120-140 grain) bullets and medium burning rate powders. H335, H380, H4895, IMR 4064, IMR 4320, IMR 4350, and IMR 4895 are suitable powders.  https://www.chuckhawks.com/6-5x50.htm

 

Desert Pete: Recommend you buy a reloading manual to keep the rifle in one piece ;)

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Reloader 7 and Reloader 10  Work well with cast bullets .... As does Varget , 4895 and 4350 ..

For Long range cast bullet loads...

 

Jabez Cowboy

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26 minutes ago, John Boy said:

Unique has a too fast burn rate for the 6.5 (32 RQ).  Need a slower burn rate powder such as IMR 4350 - burn rate 118

 

Desert Pete: Recommend you buy a reloading manual to keep the rifle in one piece ;)


There are some Unique loads for the Arisaka.  I prefer IMR 4350 with jacketed bullets.  Just trying to slow things down a bit for cast bullets.

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3 minutes ago, Snakebite said:

I didn't know that they had a Bolt Action category at WR. Interesting.

 

Two side matches, actually. 

 

Bolt Action Military Match - a side match for Wild Bunch shooters

 

And

 

Bucky O'Neill Long Range Match - one segment of which is for military repeaters made before about 1912. 

 

Both are cast bullet matches (predominately).

 

Good luck, GJ

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2 minutes ago, Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 said:

 

Two side matches, actually. 

 

Bolt Action Military Match - a side match for Wild Bunch shooters

 

And

 

Bucky O'Neill Long Range Match - one segment of which is for military repeaters made before about 1912. 

 

Both are cast bullet matches (predominately).

 

Good luck, GJ

Yes, I seen that. That is why I removed my query.

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Have any idea what a Unique load would be for a 6.5 Arisaka?

 

Pulled out some old Ideal cast bullet handbooks, specifically the Ideal Handbook # 38 from 1951.   The latest Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook does not cover this cartridge, so the loads are getting hard to find.

 

What you use depends upon how heavy a bullet you can find.   A 0.268" bullet size works best for many of these rifles. 

 

Unique only shows up in the book with a 100 grain slug:

10 grains Unique   100 grain cast bullet (like Lyman 266454)   about 1600 FPS

17 grains IMR 4198  100 grain bullet (Lyman 266469)  about 1700 FPS

 

And for a heavier bullet, 150 grains (Lyman 266469)

22 grains  IMR 4198   150 grain bullet    about 1700 FPS

(no Unique load suggested)

 

The 6.5 Jap rifles used a heavy, long bullet.   I'd bet you have better accuracy doing the same with your cast bullet loads.

 

These are just about the same powder charges I use with my 6.5x55 Swedish Mauser with cast bullets of these weights.  

If you have it, I find Reloder 7 works very well in the 6.5 Swede.  With a 150 grain bullet, about 17.5 grains of Reloder 7, or a 162 grain bullet, 18.0 grains Rx7.  These generate about 1600 FPS (which is a sweet spot due to the fast twist of Swede barrels).

 

Of course, your rifle will like different cast bullet  loads from mine, like they almost always do.

 

Good luck, GJ

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1 hour ago, Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 said:

 

Pulled out some old Ideal cast bullet handbooks, specifically the Ideal Handbook # 38 from 1951.   The latest Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook does not cover this cartridge, so the loads are getting hard to find.

 

What you use depends upon how heavy a bullet you can find.   A 0.268" bullet size works best for many of these rifles. 

 

Unique only shows up in the book with a 100 grain slug:

10 grains Unique   100 grain cast bullet (like Lyman 266454)   about 1600 FPS

17 grains IMR 4198  100 grain bullet (Lyman 266469)  about 1700 FPS

 

And for a heavier bullet, 150 grains (Lyman 266469)

22 grains  IMR 4198   150 grain bullet    about 1700 FPS

(no Unique load suggested)

 

The 6.5 Jap rifles used a heavy, long bullet.   I'd bet you have better accuracy doing the same with your cast bullet loads.

 

These are just about the same powder charges I use with my 6.5x55 Swedish Mauser with cast bullets of these weights.  

If you have it, I find Reloder 7 works very well in the 6.5 Swede.  With a 150 grain bullet, about 17.5 grains of Reloder 7, or a 162 grain bullet, 18.0 grains Rx7.  These generate about 1600 FPS (which is a sweet spot due to the fast twist of Swede barrels).

 

Of course, your rifle will like different cast bullet  loads from mine, like they almost always do.

 

Good luck, GJ

Thanks.  The Arisaka is very accurate with .264, 140 grain boat tail and IMR 4350.  Cast bullets are a whole new adventure.

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2 hours ago, Desert Pete SASS #42168 said:

Cast bullets are a whole new adventure.

 

Yep.  Before starting to use cast bullets, scrub bore EXTENSIVELY and THOROUGHLY until patches come out clean.  Get all the gilding metal from jackets out of the bore. Because it will make it hard to realize best possible accuracy with most cast bullet loads.   Even if you plan to use poly coated bullets, I would scrub bore.

 

Reserve some brass that can be used just with your cast bullet loads.   Resize just enough to get the loaded round to chamber freely.  Neck sizing is often enough.

 

Use an expander die that allows you good control, and expand the mouth to point where you can get a bullet started in the mouth just with hand pressure.  This minimizes damage to the cast bullet.

 

Good luck, GJ

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On ‎11‎/‎24‎/‎2019 at 9:33 AM, Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 said:

You are thinking of IMR 4759.   In cast bullet loads for medium sized cases (like 30-06) and large (like 45-70) it was the powder of choice for accuracy with cast bullets for over 50 years.   I've got a little left that goes into high-accuracy '06 loadings.    It's well worth $40 or more a pound to cast bullet shooters.

 

Why this powder was discontinued is beyond comprehension.  Although 5744 and a couple of other powders today can come close, 4759 was extremely accurate in so many cartridges and needed little "babying" to make a good load.

 

Good luck, GJ

 

 

GJ speaks the truth on 4759! I too used up my last remaining few ounces and have transitioned to 5744 as well in 45-70 cast bullet loads.

 

Whats next.... Alliant stopping BlackMZ production??:(

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