Dust Bowl Dick Posted October 29, 2019 Share Posted October 29, 2019 Has anyone had experience with running a steady diet of stout magnum loads through a newer Winchester/Miroku 73? I have a newer 73 24” full octagon barrel that until now has only had 38 special loads through it. I’ve been getting a itch to stretch its legs a bit and work up some 357 loads for distance just for the fun of it. In your opinion, do you think this rifle will handle these loads with no ill effects? Or, should I look for a Winchester 92 or 94 to play this game? I don’t really want to hurt my 73 since it’s my only CAS rifle. Thanks for your time and knowledge, Dust Bowl Dick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goody, SASS #26190 Posted October 29, 2019 Share Posted October 29, 2019 Your rifle should be fine as long as your loads do not exceed SAAMI specs. I wouldn't subject a toggle link rifle to that kind of stress myself, but it will not cause a catastrophic failure. It will accelerate wear though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caboose Posted October 29, 2019 Share Posted October 29, 2019 26 minutes ago, Dust Bowl Dick said: Has anyone had experience with running a steady diet of stout magnum loads through a newer Winchester/Miroku 73? I have a newer 73 24” full octagon barrel that until now has only had 38 special loads through it. I’ve been getting a itch to stretch its legs a bit and work up some 357 loads for distance just for the fun of it. In your opinion, do you think this rifle will handle these loads with no ill effects? Or, should I look for a Winchester 92 or 94 to play this game? I don’t really want to hurt my 73 since it’s my only CAS rifle. Thanks for your time and knowledge, Dust Bowl Dick I have zero experience with magnum loads in a 73 but I wouldn’t do it in my rifle. I believe the reason Winchester developed the heavier frame 76 was because they felt the 73 toggle link were too weak for higher loads. I would go to the 92 or 94 or Marlin for “stout magnum loads”. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dust Bowl Dick Posted October 29, 2019 Author Share Posted October 29, 2019 20 minutes ago, Goody, SASS #26190 said: Your rifle should be fine as long as your loads do not exceed SAAMI specs. I wouldn't subject a toggle link rifle to that kind of stress myself, but it will not cause a catastrophic failure. It will accelerate wear though. Thanks, kind of what I was thinking. This being my first and only 73 I have no experience toggle link rifles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dust Bowl Dick Posted October 29, 2019 Author Share Posted October 29, 2019 12 minutes ago, Caboose said: I have zero experience with magnum loads in a 73 but I wouldn’t do it in my rifle. I believe the reason Winchester developed the heavier frame 76 was because they felt the 73 toggle link were too weak for higher loads. I would go to the 92 or 94 or Marlin for “stout magnum loads”. Thanks, guess I’ll start checking around for a 92. I think it’ll be fun trying to push the distances a little. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colorado Coffinmaker Posted October 29, 2019 Share Posted October 29, 2019 Both the Uberti and Miroku '73 replicas are proofed for and will run 357 Magnum. Steady diet?? Don't know. Don't know anyone who has been doing it. 357 Magnum will exceed SASS allowable velocity so there is no point for what we do. Long Range?? There are better choices. Were it I, I'd opt for a '92. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tex Wilson Posted October 29, 2019 Share Posted October 29, 2019 My Henry Big Boy is chambered for .357 magnum and that's what I'm shooting at our matches. I don't reload, but I get my cartridges from Choice Ammunition in Montana, they are a SASS vendor. I'm shooting a 125 grain RNFP which has a velocity of 750 fps which is acceptable for SASS allowable velocity. I don't know how many grains of powder they use for the round I'm shooting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex M Rugers #6621 Posted October 29, 2019 Share Posted October 29, 2019 3 hours ago, Caboose said: I have zero experience with magnum loads in a 73 but I wouldn’t do it in my rifle. I believe the reason Winchester developed the heavier frame 76 was because they felt the 73 toggle link were too weak for higher loads. I would go to the 92 or 94 or Marlin for “stout magnum loads”. That isn't why at all. They developed the larger , longer frame to use longer , more powerful cartridges. It was still a toggle-link action. Rex P.S. Plus one on Colorado Coffinmaker's post above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evil dogooder Posted October 29, 2019 Share Posted October 29, 2019 There are 44 mag 73s modern steel has made huge improvements. A properly tuned toggle link is stronger than people think. As for pistol cal long range you don't need .357 mag . Most clubs don't even hit 100 yrds for pistol cal. I use my main match ammo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster Ron Wayne Posted October 29, 2019 Share Posted October 29, 2019 If you do want to load 357 loads . I would load full load Black Powder 357 loads for long range . Should be fun and give you a good bang with lots of smoke . I would Not subject my main match 73 to hot load rounds . Why put all that wear and tear on a beautiful toggle link rifle ? Just Sayin . Rooster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dust Bowl Dick Posted October 30, 2019 Author Share Posted October 30, 2019 Thanks for the info and your opinions everyone! I’ll be looking for a 92 to play this game. By the way, there is no competition involved here, just a couple of friends having some fun on a private property range. So other than safety, no rules will apply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cold Lake Kid, SASS # 51474 Posted October 30, 2019 Share Posted October 30, 2019 In regard to using more powerful loads: I shoot .45 Colt in my '66 and my '73 Using Trail Boss, loaded to a grain under Max, with a 250 grain lead bullet, I have taken a deer, from a blind, with each. Just a short run and a flop, no further than anything I've taken with my .30-06 or my .308 with the same bullet placement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusty Devil Dale Posted October 30, 2019 Share Posted October 30, 2019 On 10/29/2019 at 10:06 AM, Arizona Gunfighter said: My Henry Big Boy is chambered for .357 magnum and that's what I'm shooting at our matches. I don't reload, but I get my cartridges from Choice Ammunition in Montana, they are a SASS vendor. I'm shooting a 125 grain RNFP which has a velocity of 750 fps which is acceptable for SASS allowable velocity. I don't know how many grains of powder they use for the round I'm shooting. There's a big difference between a . 357 mag load, and a SASS load in a . 357 case. Most real . 357 mags run 130- 158gn bullets, at over 1200fps. They would substantially exceed SASS velocity limits. They would also produce chamber pressures near the top of the '73 limits. I would expect a steady diet of real mag cartridges to produce some distorted toggle pins, or worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkeyhen Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 I was told by the man that built my 18” short stroked Uberti that it would not handle it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desert Pete SASS #42168 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 Lyman groups the toggle link guns into a weaker action category and develops their loads accordingly. Take a look at their loading manual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
"Big Boston" Posted November 1, 2019 Share Posted November 1, 2019 I recently bought a new Winchester 1873 (Miroku), for shooting cowboy. I liked that it is chambered for 357 Magnum, and proofed for 357 Magnum, because if I stop shooting cowboy, I can shoot 357 loads in it. I think that a steady diet of full power will shorten it's life a bit, but perhaps not as much as I think. It's physics, pressure is one number, but force is pressure multiplied by area. Same toggles and steel as in a 45 LC or 44-40. Both of those have more area for the force to act against. I'm no engineer, but a quick calculation has a 357 Mag @ 35,000 psi putting just less than twice the force against the bolt as a 45 LC @ 14,000psi. You'd have to load a 357 Mag up to 19,000 psi to equal the force against the bolt of a 45LC. Or, if you were to load a 45 LC up to 26,000 psi, it would be the same as a 357 Mag. So, I suppose in theory, (if my theory and math are correct), if you were to run a '73 45 LC at max and a '73 357 Mag at max, the 357 Mag would be worn out with half the # of rounds. I can live with that. I'm sure if my math is in error, an engineering type will chime in. BB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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