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Black Angus McPherson

Springfield 1911's - What's the dif?

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I've just about talked myself into buying a 1911.  I've always wanted one, but never had a real need for one.  I don't shoot WB and don't need it for concealed carry, I just WANT one.

 

While looking at Springfield Armory 1911's I've noticed three (There are probably more) that seem to have the same description but are priced at about $80 increments.  Surely there must be a difference and I was wondering if anyone here could tell me what they are.

 

The pistols in question:

1911 Mil-Spec Defender #PBD9108L (cheapest)  The only thing I see different is a plain checkered grip instead of the Springfield logo grip.

1911 Range Mil-Spec #PB91082L  (+$80)  Has Springfield logo grips.

1911 Mil-Spec Parkerized #PB9108LP (+ another $80) Has Springfield logo grips and "Parkerized" in the name, but the finish on the other two is also listed as Parkerized.

 

They all appear to have the same sights, same finish and come with one magazine.  What am I missing?  Other than an extra $160 if I were to choose the "Parkerized"

 

It doesn't help that different websites list the different model numbers with different or interchanged names.

 

Angus

 

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I can't answer your specific question, but I have owned a couple Springfield 1911 model pistols:

V16 in .45 Super

TRP in 10mm

 

BOTH are excellent pistols.   The .45 Super was fired a few 100 times with ZERO issues.

 

The new TRP in 10mm has been fired about 200 times and so far, I've had ZERO issues with it also.

 

Normally, I'm not a 1911 buyer or shooter, but I've owned some nice Kimbers and those Springfields

mentioned above and I wouldn't hesitate buying another Springfield should I get the hankerin for 

another.

 

Best regards.

 

..........Widder

 

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I’ve had the basic government model for 15 years or so. Good enough for me. Accompanies me on any trip to the woods. I did eventually add some stag grips just for looks. ;)

 

SpringfeldStag.jpg

Edited by Utah Bob #35998
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Springfield makes decent 1911 pistols, but the angled cocking serrations have always bugged me. An honest-to John Browning 1911 needs vertical serrations! So I might suggest that you take a look at one of the new Colt O1911C Classic models or a Series 70.

 

EDIT: for awhile Springfield offered a basic GI 1911 with straight serrations like Bob above just posted. Inexplicably they discontinued it after just a couple of years.

 

As for the Springers you mentioned, they're just variants on the same theme. I suspect they're going through a model change and that one or more of those will be discontinued soon.

Edited by Sixgun Sheridan
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32 minutes ago, Sixgun Sheridan said:

As for the Springers you mentioned

Springers are dogs.

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I've shot 1911's in various types of competition since the late 70's. While I agree with Sixgun about the straight serrations, after handling one it's hard to beat the Springfield Mil-Spec Defender for the dollar.  My stable of 1911's are all a bit too modified for 1911 side matches. I've really been thinking of picking one up myself. I don't think you'd go too far wrong with one.

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I've been thinking about getting one as well,  and been considering the defender due to price.  I want a stainless due to looks.  I had a mil spec years ago and miss it.  

 

I really don't need one since I have a colt and kimber and others.  I just remember the one I had was great.  

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I have one of these-PB9108LMIL-SPEC .45ACP PARKERIZED

Very pleased and I have carried a Colt 1911 for many decades.

OLG

 

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I love 1911's but that is why I will never shoot wild bunch, as I couldn't bring myself to buy a mil-spec 1911. So many great and beautiful 1911's out there that a mil-spec would just seem so drab and plain and with poor sights to boot. Well maybe an original from WWI or WWII. Personally Springfield makes quality 1911's but I will never buy a Springfield again as they sold out gun dealers in Illinois with support for state licensing that put 1/2 of all gun dealers out of business here in Illinois. Later they got called on it and backtracked but they never the less got caught stabbing dealers in the back. 

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Only one 1911??? They are addicting. I only have 8 or 9 of them. But I keep looking at more

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The Defender comes with only one magazine, and only one set of grips.  These have a MSP of $549, and are selling for about $499-$529.

 

The Mil Spec parkerized comes with upgraded grips, holster, magazine pouch, and two magazines.  MSP is $780, and are selling for around $650-$675.

 

I'm not familiar with, nor can I find the middle model you referenced. 

 

I have an EMP-9mm, a 1911 Loaded 9mm, a 1911 MC Operator .45, a Mil Spec .45, a stainless TRP and a TRP 10mm.  I love every one of them, and am looking forward to buying a Professional model in .45 soon.

springfield trp 10mm operator.jpg

stainless trp.jpg

mc op magwell.jpg

Springfield Armory Loaded 9mm.jpg

emp_zpsx0lqx0wk.jpg

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Lawman Mark,

You are to be commended for showing those 1911's in their proper way..... Cocked and Locked.

 

Thank You.

 

..........Widder

 

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Remingtons are series 80 pistols .

I prefer series 70 pistols myself .

A couple less moving parts .

So the trigger pull and feel is a little better .

But I own both and they all will serve you well .

To be honest with you .

The best bang for the buck is The Armscor 1911's .

They are a series 70 design and Armscor have been building 1911'S since the 1940'S .

They are probably the largest builder of 1911'S in the world  .

Just sayin.

Rooster   

 

IMG_20191013_143646_751.jpg

Edited by Rooster Ron Wayne
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I'm going to say this about Springfield:  They make a heck of a gun, but they're never getting another penny out of me.

 

For an off-the-rack 1911, I don't think you can beat it (although I've become somewhat of a 1911 snob and prefer semi-custom or completely custom guns now).  Their problem is they have or had a contract with the FBI, and their "custom shop" is focused on the big paying customer.  I once sent a 1911 to them for the simple job of having the sights switched to another set I  provided.

 

6 months went by...then 7...then 8.  I started calling them, and they didn't know who I was or why I was asking.  They had no record of my gun.  It was not even in their queue to get any work done, despite having contracted them to do so.  I had to provide the shipping confirmation and the person's name who had signed for the gun.

 

After several weeks, they found my gun sitting on a shelf, untouched.  6 MORE months went by before they did anything.  When I got the gun back (after MORE THAN A YEAR of being there for a simple sight swap!) it was badly scratched.  Someone had put it in a vice and not used any form of protection whatsoever.  I was livid.  I called them and complained, and they told me to send it back to them for rebluing.  In the meantime, however, I took it to the range and discovered the rear sight was so loose it worked itself out of the dovetail under normal firing conditions.  I was even more livid, but they agreed to replace it with one a few thousandths larger.

 

I sent the gun back, and ANOTHER 6 months went by before I started calling them again.

 

Who are you? 

 

Once again, they had no idea what I was talking about, had no record of me, nor any record of my gun.  ONCE AGAIN I provided the shipping information and filled them in (AGAIN) on the story.  They still didn't find it (or likely didn't bother trying) until I threatened to report the gun stolen.  Nearly a month went by, and they finally found the gun sitting on a shelf, untouched.  I complained loudly to the manager about how I was being treated, and he told me under no uncertain terms that the FBI guns were a priority due to volume of sales.  I only owned one of their guns, and therefore was of no concern to them.

 

Another month or two went by and I got the gun back.  It was reblued, and they had replaced the rear sight with one slightly larger to alleviate the problem of it working loose (or so they claimed).  

 

I took it to the range, and after 50 rounds the rear sight had moved so far to one side that I could have pulled it out of the dovetail with my fingers.  Holy balls, I was seeing red.  It took a week of getting the run around before they agreed to let me ship the gun back to them.  I did, and, you guessed it, 6 MONTHS went by once again, and ONCE AGAIN they had lost my gun or any record of what was supposed to happen with it.  ONCE AGAIN it was another month-long delay before they found it, and another several months before they bothered to do the work (I was reminded again about the FBI contract).

 

When I got the gun back -- you're not going to believe this -- IT WAS SCRATCHED FROM A VICE AGAIN, *AND* THE REAR SIGHT WAS STILL LOOSE!!!  

 

"Custom shop" indeed.  After another week of getting the runaround, I finally spoke directly with the guy who supposedly builds Rob Leatham's competition guns.  I'm going to go out on a limb here (quite safely), and say the guy puts a lot more effort into Leatham's guns than he did mine.  

 

Keep in mind, by this time it had been over TWO YEARS that this gun was out of commission simply because I wanted a different set of sights installed.  

 

I sent the gun back AGAIN, and they didn't lose it this time.  It was returned to me in the lightning speed of 6 months (I called once a month to ensure it hadn't been lost again).  Upon first opening the box, I was aghast to see they had coated the gun with the black, bake-on finish that many people like these days, but I happen to hate.  I guess they figured it was stronger than the blueing they kept ruining. I absolutely hated it, and I couldn't have been angrier, but at this stage of the game as long as the sight stayed in place I was going to call it a win and move on.

 

The big moment came at the range...and after 50 rounds, the rear sight had MOVED AGAIN!!!!  

 

Oh.  My.  Goodness.  

 

Finally, I just told them to replace the entire slide AT MY EXPENSE.  That fixed the problem with the rear sight, but I'm stuck with a bake-on finish to this day.

 

I also have one of their M1A rifles, and it's a great gun out of the box.  Take a wild guess how much customizing I've had them do?  Exactly zero.  I won't give Springfield another penny as long as I live.

 

Edited by Cyrus Cassidy #45437
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19 hours ago, Alpo said:

Springers are dogs.

 

...and a Colt is a young horse. The point being.....?

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No wonder I'm a bit confused.  I looked at a website again today (RuralKing.com if you're interested), put my glasses on and started to look more closely at the photos of the "Range Mil-Spec" #PB9108L and the "Mil-Spec Parkerized" #PB9108LP to see if I could notice any difference.  Well, not only did I not see any difference, I noticed the serial numbers were the same.  :wacko:  So, I don't even know which model they had pictured for the two different ads.

 

Oh, and this was after I went to the local RK to see them in person.  They didn't have either model in stock.

 

Geez, things like this really take the fun out of buying, or trying to buy, a gun.

 

Angus

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On 10/21/2019 at 1:57 PM, Doc X said:

I've shot 1911's in various types of competition since the late 70's. While I agree with Sixgun about the straight serrations, after handling one it's hard to beat the Springfield Mil-Spec Defender for the dollar.  My stable of 1911's are all a bit too modified for 1911 side matches. I've really been thinking of picking one up myself. I don't think you'd go too far wrong with one.

Check out the RIA 1911.  It used to be a lot less money and RIA makes more 1911s than anyone else.  Lots of variations and  models, too.  Mine is as good as I have ever owned.

 

I swapped out the smooth grips for some SARCO double diamond ones and it's fussy with some after-market magazines.  Runs without a hitch for over six years now.

 

It had a butt-ugly "parkerized" finish, but I recently had it refinished to a glossy civilian blue.

Edited by Forty Rod SASS 3935
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26 minutes ago, Black Angus McPherson said:

No wonder I'm a bit confused.  I looked at a website again today (RuralKing.com if you're interested), put my glasses on and started to look more closely at the photos of the "Range Mil-Spec" #PB9108L and the "Mil-Spec Parkerized" #PB9108LP to see if I could notice any difference.  Well, not only did I not see any difference, I noticed the serial numbers were the same.  :wacko:  So, I don't even know which model they had pictured for the two different ads.

 

Oh, and this was after I went to the local RK to see them in person.  They didn't have either model in stock.

 

Geez, things like this really take the fun out of buying, or trying to buy, a gun.

 

Angus

If you really want a 1911 . 

Just buy what you can afford to buy .

If the builder sticks to John Brownings design it will work.

It is one of the easiest guns to work on yourself .

 

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I have to stop reading threads. First I wanted the double barrel 12 ga pistol. Now I want another 1911.

 

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16 minutes ago, Crooked River Pete, SASS 43485 said:

At one time the lower priced Springfields were made in Brazil ( I think ) and the more expensive ones were American made. I don't know if this is still true.

Armscor/RIA are made in the Philippines. They’re fine. Brazil makes the Springfield govt model 1911s

Edited by Utah Bob #35998
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14 hours ago, Rooster Ron Wayne said:

Remingtons are series 80 pistols .

I prefer series 70 pistols myself .

A couple less moving parts .

So the trigger pull and feel is a little better .

But I own both and they all will serve you well .

To be honest with you .

The best bang for the buck is The Armscor 1911's .

They are a series 70 design and Armscor have been building 1911'S since the 1940'S .

They are probably the largest builder of 1911'S in the world  .

Just sayin.

Rooster   

 

IMG_20191013_143646_751.jpg

AKA RIA or Rock Island.

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1 hour ago, Crooked River Pete, SASS 43485 said:

At one time the lower priced Springfields were made in Brazil ( I think ) and the more expensive ones were American made. I don't know if this is still true.

It's no longer true.  They're all US made now.

 

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4 hours ago, Utah Bob #35998 said:

I have to stop reading threads. First I wanted the double barrel 12 ga pistol. Now I want another 1911.

 

I have a lady friend who has two for sale.  (A Springfield with a green parkerized finish and an Auto Ordnance.  Both "mil spec") They belonged to her late husband and she can't shoot them .  She has a couple of Makarovs that fit her better.

 

I can put you in touch if you're interested.

 

Send me a message, email, or call me.

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8 hours ago, Forty Rod SASS 3935 said:

AKA RIA or Rock Island.

They are  two American made Rugers  Two Brownings One Remington Rand & One Remington R1 

 

20191013_143111.jpg

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8 hours ago, LawMan Mark, SASS #57095L said:

It's no longer true.  They're all US made now.

 

Made or assembled?

 

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4 hours ago, Utah Bob #35998 said:

Made or assembled?

 

As of 2014, all are made in the US.  The frames are made by a company in TX.  If a Springfield Armory 1911 has an Imbel mark on it, it's pre 2014 made.    I've not asked about this directly from a rep, but I find numerous posts online that seem to confirm it.  

 

From Bud's Gunshop, answering a question about the new "Defender" model:  

"Several years ago, Springfield cut all ties with Imbel Brazil They won't say who they source their parts from though, or who makes the forgings. Now all their 1911s are made in USA. Not with part outside the USA. Some of their parts are from venders in the USA they make some parts and all the tooling is done 100% in the USA as well."

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19 hours ago, Black Angus McPherson said:

No wonder I'm a bit confused.  I looked at a website again today (RuralKing.com if you're interested), put my glasses on and started to look more closely at the photos of the "Range Mil-Spec" #PB9108L and the "Mil-Spec Parkerized" #PB9108LP to see if I could notice any difference.  Well, not only did I not see any difference, I noticed the serial numbers were the same.  :wacko:  So, I don't even know which model they had pictured for the two different ads.

 

Oh, and this was after I went to the local RK to see them in person.  They didn't have either model in stock.

 

Geez, things like this really take the fun out of buying, or trying to buy, a gun.

 

Angus

 

Locally there are very few 1911s available at gun shops nowadays. The glass cases are filled with plastic fantastic and a few revolvers, but I rarely see anything but the occasional SIG or Remington 1911. No Colts, no Springfields, no Kimbers, no S&Ws... virtually nothing. I don't know what the problem is but I find it hard to believe that these gun shops are catering to nothing but the 20-something Tacticool crowd.

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1 hour ago, Sixgun Sheridan said:

 

Locally there are very few 1911s available at gun shops nowadays. The glass cases are filled with plastic fantastic and a few revolvers, but I rarely see anything but the occasional SIG or Remington 1911. No Colts, no Springfields, no Kimbers, no S&Ws... virtually nothing. I don't know what the problem is but I find it hard to believe that these gun shops are catering to nothing but the 20-something Tacticool crowd.

Must just be the  area .

Our local dealer hear has Two cases three shelves each .

Nothing but 1911's .

And I'm Ok with that , I'm not a black plastic gun guy myself .

ps.

I personally wish we had more revolvers locally to choose from too.

Rooster 

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Yes I know it's a regional thing. I read on another forums where guys picked up a new Colt 1911 among several to choose from at their local dealer... and I haven't even seen one around here for sale in over a year.

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Never had one, can't say personally. Long ago in a galaxy far away I shot a lot of IPSC, they seemed to have a good rep. All mine have been Colts. If I was going to buy a new one it would probably be a Kimber.

JHC

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It varies by shop here.  It's rare to find a shop in Alabama that doesn't have any 1911s, but the best stocked one I know of has a bunch of RIA and Armscore, a couple of Kimbers, a few used Colts and one new SA Defender.  We have one shop that advertises as a "stocking" dealer for Kimber, but he rarely has more than three or four.  

 

I ordered two of mine, the others I picked up from local dealers.  The stainless TRP and the EMP were both ordered from distributors.  All my Colts were bought from local dealers as normal stock items.  My solitary Kimber was bought from a dealer... It had belonged to a very good friend who is now deceased.  He had sold the Kimber at a substantial discount to a mutual friend of ours, who proclaimed it was never to be sold.  When the mutual friend traded it for a polymer 9mm wonder, I bought it and it's now got a permanent home.  The mutual friend has tried to buy it back, but I just smile and refuse.

 

 

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I sold one kimber because it jammed once it got dirty, have another one and it does better and is accurate but not thrilled with it like other brands.  Miss the Springfield that was my first 1911. It was great.  Sold it as had to keep it in the armory so sold it.  Miss it.

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I had a Kimber when they first came out. Mine had the Clackamas, OR address on it. Foolishly I traded it in on a fancy Series II that turned out to be a problem child. Sold it, later bought another which was also a piece of crapola. I finally swore off the brand entirely, even though I do wish I had that first one back.

 

I mostly buy Colts, although I have had a stinker from them on occasion as well. Usually it's just cosmetic issues though, not reliability. They build a good 1911 but they have a really hard time keeping the outside edges straight for some reason. The last couple of Springfields I had were okay, but not very impressive accuracy-wise. Both were Mil-Specs.

.

Edited by Sixgun Sheridan

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My first Kimber was a compact model, all steel..... and flawless in function and accuracy was top rate.

 

But, I had another higher priced Kimber with feed problems.   I was reloading .452 bullets.

Called Kimber and the rep told me I probably had a tight chamber and suggested I try .451 bullets.

Ta-Da...... never another problem.

 

As stated above, my two Springfields have been great.

 

..........Widder

 

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