That was a close one.

[El Roberto, SASS #69853]

This was a fun stage. I love the movement. It was a fun match, great stages.

[Constable Nelson #11784]

6 hours ago, El Hombre Sin Nombre said:

That is exactly how I would shoot it. Why? Because I signed up to shoot gunfighter, so I will shoot it gunfighter no matter how much back and forth running I might have to do. I am still young enough and fleet of foot that the extra steps wouldn't sow me down any more than my shooting might. I personally hate shooting duelist unless I have tailored my loads for it, as with 35 grains of BP under a 250 grain bullet makes the recoil between shots seem a very long time. I don't notice it at all when shooting gunfighter because I am aiming and shooting with the other gun while the recoil is happening.

 

I get what you say about comfort zone, and that is fine. What I hate is when non gunfighters chime in about something they know nothing about. I would love to see how many of them grumble if you made a two handed shooter shoot duelist, or a duelist shoot two handed. As for smokestack's stages, I haven't had the opportunity to shoot one yet, but I look forward to it. They look like a lot of fun.

The difference there is that those examples do actually force the shooter out of category.    I shot GF years ago when it was still new... and from the start Double Duellist was a skill GF'ers were required to have.   If you "sign up to shoot GF" then you are signing up to shoot DD where necessary.... as per the rules...  where it is made clear that it can indeed be made mandatory on a stage.... so you might want to be careful accusing other folks of not knowing of what they speak.      Double Duellist is NOT "out of category" for GFs... and IMO the biggest problem is that the phrase "Gunfighter friendly" ever gained such currency......

[evil dogooder]

9 hours ago, Smokestack SASS#87384 said:

LOL. I assure you, the intent wasn’t to slow anyone down as I am certain that the fastest way to shoot this stage would be as a double duelist, and every single category has that option available to them. Gunfighter style has its advantages and disadvantages as does every other style in the game. Gunfighters often bemoan the fact that they must have discernible separation of shots but never bring up the fact that they are the only ones even allowed two loaded revolvers in hand. 

This stage was written because it was a test of transitions for all categories and not having seen one quite like it in the last 9 years, I figured for maybe just one stage, all of the other categories might not be limited by the tastes of some of those who shoot gunfighter. IMO, it’s not fair to allow one category to dictate stage design 100% of the time. 

Curious,  how many two handed shooters shot it double dualist? 

[evil dogooder]

8 hours ago, Smokestack SASS#87384 said:

Surely you see the difference in writing a stage where a gunfighter has to shoot DD and writing a stage where a two handed shooter would. But just in case you don’t, a two handed shooter doesn’t often if ever shoot unsupported with their weak hand whereas a gunfighter dies on every stage of every single match. One is a safety issue and the other, well.....

You're assuming a two handed shooter would shoot it dd, they don't have to shoot with their weak hand.  They could shoot it srong side duelist with both

  If you  knew everybody shooting the match could safely handle shooting duelist you still wouldn't write it where they had to.  Because you'd get run out on a rail if you did

[Beartrap SASS#57175]

I shot the match as a FCGF and enjoyed the stage, even if I had to shoot it DD style. I also know of some traditional shooters who did shoot it duelist.

As Constable Nelson said GFs are capable of shooting DD, just as a right handed shooter is capable of running to the left even if they prefer moving to the right.

Some stages just naturally favor one shooting style over another or one type of firearm over another, or one physical ability over another and a competitor should learn to deal with that fact.

If EVERY stage required shooting it DD or required a 100 yard dash to the left for a right handed GF they probably would have grounds to complain, but that wasn't the case.

Smokestack wrote what I consider 12 excellent and varied stages for this match and I made sure to compliment him on his creativity.

Next shooter.

[Keystone, SASS # 47578]

On 9/25/2019 at 7:44 AM, Beartrap SASS#57175 said:

You have to move downrange with both pistols and the shotgun and per GF rules you can't reholster the pistols.

Well, reading comprehension was one of my lesser acquired skills. 

[Lead Monger]

Don’t understand why you would be in peril. Looks like a fun stage to me.

[Too Tall Bob]

Smokestack. You can’t receive msgs?

Do you have an email address?  I have a question for you. 

 

TTB

[Smokestack SASS#87384]

41 minutes ago, Too Tall Bob said:

Smokestack. You can’t receive msgs?

Do you have an email address?  I have a question for you. 

 

TTB

Should be fixed now. 

[Ozark Huckleberry]

 

On 9/25/2019 at 5:52 PM, El Hombre Sin Nombre said:

Could you not stage the pistols on the table, then come back for them after the shotgun?

 

And as a gunfighter I would grumble. No other category is forced to shoot a stage differently than gunfighters. i don't mind split pistols at all, just as long as there is an option for me to stage pistols and continue to shoot gunfighter if I choose. If other gunfighters wish to shoot it DD, that's perfectly fine, but at no time should shooting DD be mandatory.

 

On 9/25/2019 at 6:47 PM, Yul Lose said:

 I don’t know, sometimes being forced out of your comfort zone is a good thing. It’s not like we have to do it every stage. A GF could have shot the two targets GF staged the guns on the pine box, l grabbed the SG and moved to the barrel and knocked down the KDs and moved back to the pine box and picked up his revolvers and moved back to the barrel to finish up but why would you? One thing about Smokestacks stage writing is that he very rarely writes a stage that splits the pistols up like this. They’ll do it up at Cajon occasionally.

 

(underlining added for clarity)

 

I see what you're saying as far as staging the pistols on the table between each string of five shots, and have a question -- if you staged the pistols on the table, would you make sure they were angled toward the right, so that when you went to the barrel for the shotgun you didn't move downrange of the pistol muzzles, or would you consider that since you're moving well off to the side of the pistols, being downrange of loaded guns wasn't an issue? Or is the fact that the guns were staged hammers down on empty or spent chambers good enough?

 

One other question -- if you shot duelist, instead of holstering the first pistol, couldn't you just stage it on the barrel instead of holstering it, go shoot the SG, then come back and shoot the second pistol and holster both when finished?

[Ozark Huckleberry]

 

The stage, just for reference.

 

 

[PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L]

44 minutes ago, Ozark Huckleberry said:

One other question -- if you shot duelist, instead of holstering the first pistol, couldn't you just stage it on the barrel instead of holstering it, go shoot the SG, then come back and shoot the second pistol and holster both when finished?

 

No.

That would be a procedural.

 

Quote

Revolvers are returned to leather (re-holstered in a safe condition) at the conclusion of the shooting string, unless the stage description specifically directs otherwise (e.g., “move to the next position and set gun on table or prop”).  A shooting string is defined as shots from one type of firearm prior to the next type of firearm engaged. 

SHB p.15

 

Quote

Not returning revolvers to leather (unless otherwise specified). 

SHB p.22 - "Procedural Infractions"

[El Hombre Sin Nombre]

59 minutes ago, Ozark Huckleberry said:

 

 

 

(underlining added for clarity)

 

I see what you're saying as far as staging the pistols on the table between each string of five shots, and have a question -- if you staged the pistols on the table, would you make sure they were angled toward the right, so that when you went to the barrel for the shotgun you didn't move downrange of the pistol muzzles, or would you consider that since you're moving well off to the side of the pistols, being downrange of loaded guns wasn't an issue? Or is the fact that the guns were staged hammers down on empty or spent chambers good enough?

 

One other question -- if you shot duelist, instead of holstering the first pistol, couldn't you just stage it on the barrel instead of holstering it, go shoot the SG, then come back and shoot the second pistol and holster both when finished?

You should be fine, as there will already be a rifle on the same table. And palewolf answered your second question. 

[Yul Lose]

3 hours ago, Ozark Huckleberry said:

 

 

 

(underlining added for clarity)

 

I see what you're saying as far as staging the pistols on the table between each string of five shots, and have a question -- if you staged the pistols on the table, would you make sure they were angled toward the right, so that when you went to the barrel for the shotgun you didn't move downrange of the pistol muzzles, or would you consider that since you're moving well off to the side of the pistols, being downrange of loaded guns wasn't an issue? Or is the fact that the guns were staged hammers down on empty or spent chambers good enough?

 

One other question -- if you shot duelist, instead of holstering the first pistol, couldn't you just stage it on the barrel instead of holstering it, go shoot the SG, then come back and shoot the second pistol and holster both when finished?

Yes, if you staged your pistols on the pine box after the first five shots you would have to make sure the barrels were pointing into the berm. If the pistols were not oriented correctly on this stage set up there was a high risk of the shooter or TO breaking the 170 moving to the barrel for the SG and then back to the pine box for final pistol string.