Jump to content
SASS Wire Forum
Sign in to follow this  
Exodus5

Recommended rifle for first timer?

Recommended Posts

i started with a rossie in 45 colt , still have it and still use it sometimes , i like my 66 wand my 73 better these days , 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

73 Uberti or Winchester in .357 or .45.  It gives you a lot of options down the road w/o having to sell it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

There will be some that don't like this post... but; forging ahead anyway.  Unless you're going to have work done to the rifle you buy to improve it's function, speed, reliability and general "smoothness", whatever, you do, DON'T buy the cheapest one you can.  As with most anything one purchases these days, dependability and proper function from the factory is a thing of the past... and any savings in the sticker price will be reflected in the lower quality.

 

All of the choices presented need SOME work to be as smooth as possible, which in and of itself, improves speed, reliability and plain ole shooting fun.  The toggle-link ('66 & '73) are probably the ones that will provide the MOST improvement, IF, you put a short stroke kit in, new springs and have it timed properly.

 

Prior to the use of short stroke kits in the rifles, the Marlin 1894 was THE rifle to use, if you had one that was timed properly, loaded for it with appropriate bullets and practiced.  The Winchester 1892 or Rossi copy thereof was a really valid alternative... The Rossi needed a BUNCH of smoothin' up, and if set up properly, would run just about equal to the Marlin, and in the hands of some, much more reliably.  The '66 & '73 Uberti's were a distant 3rd.  The stroke is just THAT much longer and distance is time.  When I started in this game, the only folks using a '66 or '73 were those really looking to appear more authentic to the early cowboy era.

 

When folks started short strokin' the '66 & '73, it was the beginning of the end for the Rossi.  There's just no way to shorten its stroke.  But, if one puts the effort into slickin' it up, reducing the weight of its semi-truck sized springs, they are a value option that shouldn't be dismissed out of hand.  Most shooters will really never outrun one.  

Edited by Griff
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If I were a NEW shooter and unfamiliar with lever rifles, I would seriously consider

a nice 73', have it properly 'set up', and probably never look back.

 

Some of the 2018 and recent Marlins (made by Remington) have improved the quality

over their previous productions and can be smoothed up very nice.   But if you want

to go beyond some spring changes and smoothing of parts,  good luck in finding a 

gunsmith who is willing to help.   

 

I have no experience nor knowledge of the 92's.

 

Good luck..... and as Griff mentioned above, I agree that you shouldn't focus on buying the cheapest.

PAY the bucks and get a quality rifle..... then let a reputable gun plumber do some magic on it.

You'll be glad you did.

 

..........Widder

 

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Probably the best bang for the buck is a used Uberti 66 in 45 LC.  The 66's go for less and you can probably get a used on with action work for 800 - 900 if you are patient.....especially in 44-40 or 45 LC. 

 

Then you are all set. Even if you buy a $500 rifle I'm willing to bet you'll put some money in that too and the gap will be closer than you think for a lesser gun. Or at least a lesser gun for cowboy. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When I first started in this sport I got a Rossi 92 in 45 Colt to go with my two Uberti 1860 pistols with the 45 Colt cartridge conversion cylinders. Later those pistols were traded in for some Uberti Cattleman .357's, and a Uberti 73 & Marlin 94 SS in .357 were purchased along the way. I still have that Rossi 92. The wife uses it and no matter how many times I have offered to get her "a better rifle" she declines. She "likes the one she has". Not one time has that Rossi ever failed to function or jammed. If you only plan to shoot once in awhile, and don't want to spend a lot of money for a rifle, then go with the Rossi. If you plan to keep shooting long term then spend the extra money for a slicked up Uberti or Winchester 73 rifle.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There are many options for firearms, for me success has been with Ruger Vaqueros and the Winchester 93 from Mikuro, both in 38/357. The Mikuro has been a really good rifle, at least for the first 1000 rounds I've shot. The only thing I did was file down the Buck Horn style rear site, and lighten the Lever Safety Spring just a tad. It shoots as fast as I can lever. The 38 Special rounds are cheaper in the store and in reloading. Cost for the handguns and rifle about $2,300. You can get the Old Model Vaqueros for about $550 each, and a Winchester 1873 for about $1,200, used Uberti for about $900 on Gun Broker. I would stay away from Cabela's because of pricing.

 

BIG DEAL! Make sure the over all length (OAL) of the rounds you buy fit the requirements of the rifle, usually the minimum OAL is 1.44 inches. Shorter lengths can cause loading problems.

 

Best of Luck and remember, fun also is not having to contend with firearm problems at the range.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I own the Marlin 1894CB in the 2019 production year.
Fit and finish is excellent.

One thing about these:  they eject to the side... and forward.
Much of your brass will go out the window and onto the ground in front of the stage.

Some Marlins can be finicky about 38SP cartridge lengths.
If you get a Marlin, check out Marauder's web page for tuning and slicking.
There is a carrier modification you can do with a new one to avoid the premature wear that seems to afflict all 1894.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
33 minutes ago, bgavin said:

 Much of your brass will go out the window and onto the ground in front of the stage.

 

Must have a strong ejector spring.  Most of our many 1894s throw the brass gently out to the right.  

 

 

Here is my old Marlin 1894 that was a project gun. You can see the brass going to the side.  Maybe even back a little.  All 10 brass was between my feet and the stage wall.

 

Maybe Dr. Widder has a suggestion on ejection?  Mary has a 1894 Cowboy tuned by him and I suspect 90% of the brass would fall in a gallon bucket if she didn't have to swing the gun far in sweep.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 8/19/2019 at 10:12 AM, Exodus5 said:

I have been shooting all my life, but I’ve never had a lever action rifle.  A couple years ago I finally bought a Uberti Cattleman just for fun and I love the “smoothness” and accuracy.  I decided to try my hand at some cowboy shooting.  My home range is setup for this.  I MAY eventually take part in a event, but I will almost certainly not be a “real competitor”.  

I have started looking for a rifle in 45 colt.  I plan on shooting only cowboy style loads.  Which rifle would be best?  I love the Uberti/Taylor’s/Cimarron 1873’s, but they are kinda pricey for a toy.  I have seen Rossi 92’s sell cheap, but sometimes they get up in the $500+ range and then maybe I should look at the Winchester itself?

 

Thanks in advance.

 

Look up Steven Deuce Stevens on FB or Deuce Stevens on here.  He has Marlin '94s with Competition Spring Kits already installed, so you'd have a smooth, slick shooter at a mid-range price.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

IIRC, Widder mentioned the 1894 ejects to the right, and a bit forward.
We talked about so much, it was hard to take notes and pay attention... ;)

Widder recommends the replacement bobby pin ejector, especially if the carrier has Gunner's mod in place.
I assume this one is Slick's product,  same as the 1-pc stainless firing pin

Not very many 1894 in our clubs so far.
Those who do have them mention this type of ejecting.
Out of 10 rounds, 7 go out the stage window.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 minutes ago, bgavin said:

Out of 10 rounds, 7 go out the stage window.

 

We shoot with a lady with a Marlin and every case goes out the stage window. But I watched and she leans so far forward the action of the rifle is past the window.  

 

Another lady shoots a Uberti 73 that scatters brass anywhere and everywhere in a 10' diameter. 

 

A guy shoots a Rossi 92 that throws the brass so hard, I swear the brass hits the roof of the stage harden than the bullet hits the target. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
47 minutes ago, bgavin said:

IIRC, Widder mentioned the 1894 ejects to the right, and a bit forward.
We talked about so much, it was hard to take notes and pay attention... ;)

Widder recommends the replacement bobby pin ejector, especially if the carrier has Gunner's mod in place.
I assume this one is Slick's product,  same as the 1-pc stainless firing pin

Not very many 1894 in our clubs so far.
Those who do have them mention this type of ejecting.
Out of 10 rounds, 7 go out the stage window.

 

Bgavin:  it wasn't the Ejector but rather the Extractor that we discussed.   And yes, I have found

good results using Slick's 1-piece Extractors (especially in the .32 H&R without the shim),

and 1-piece firing pins (steel, not Ti).

Gunners timing mod is first rate.

 

Never hesitate to holler if you got any questions, issues, etc..... 

I've been known to confuse a few Pards..... :lol:

 

P.S. - I've never figured out how to set up an ejection that would flip empties in a particular

direction.    I've seen em flip forward, right and to the rear on nearly every caliber 1894.

If someone gets one from me and it flips to the rear, I'll be glad to take credit for

such a thing.   But please don't tell anyone that it was luck..... ;)

 

Good Luck.

 

..........Widder

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, extractor vs ejector... I get the words confused.  Sorry.
Without benefit of taking apart an 1894 a few times, the words become a jumble without the familiarity of the workings.
 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, don't feel alone.   I know somebody who has worked on MANY of them and still

gets those 2 parts 'jumble-mumbled' quite often..... ;)

 

..........Widder

 

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This thread has about jumped the track anyway , so I will tell a short story.

A pard down in Texas ( who has passed over) had a 357 Marlin that piled the brass in a spot about 18 inches past his right foot. All together.

Have no idea who tuned it , don't know why I never asked. Brass pickers loved it.

 

Rex :D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Recommended rifle for first timer?

 

A BORROWED rifle or 2 or 3.   Don't buy ANYTHING until you know what you like.   What we like is not necessarily what you will like and shoot well.   Shoot other pard's rifles first!

Good luck, GJ

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
22 hours ago, Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 said:

 

A BORROWED rifle or 2 or 3.   Don't buy ANYTHING until you know what you like.   What we like is not necessarily what you will like and shoot well.   Shoot other pard's rifles first!

Good luck, GJ

Thanks all.  Unfortunately, finding a “cowboy style” lever rifle around Charlotte requires a lot of looking in gun stores and pawn shops since there doesn’t appear to be a good shop with several examples.  Also, since my local range no longer has cowboy shoots, I am not sure how soon I’ll be able to get trigger time on one.  

Yesterday I found a wildly overpriced Marlin 94 (but it’s stamped J.M.!) in a pawn shop.  Didn’t care for how clunky that was.  There is only ONE shop that I could locate on Taylor’s website who has new rifles in stock and they are an hour away.  We’ll see what happens.

 

if anyone is in the Charlotte area....do you know of a good place to find rifles?

Edited by Exodus5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Exodus5 said:

Unfortunately, finding a “cowboy style” lever rifle around Charlotte requires a lot of looking in gun stores and pawn shops since there doesn’t appear to be a good shop with several examples.

 

We had much the same problem here in Mid-Missouri finding places that had cowboy guns. They didn't have what we were looking for. Didn't want to talk about ordering anything.  Just wanted to push off something they had.  But hang in there.  We finally found gunshops that had good stuff. 

 

Once you get to matches,  you'll find a lot of guns available among the shooters. At our last match a guy brought a Rossi 92 stainless in 45 Colt to sale. Another a pair of Ruger Vaqueros and another guy had a single Vaquero for sale.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Contact bulletsbyscarlett.com, she's in Lexington, SC to the south of you a little bit.

She has a good idea what's going on in the area and who has what. Great bullets too!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, The Rainmaker, SASS #11631 said:

Contact bulletsbyscarlett.com, she's in Lexington, SC to the south of you a little bit.

She has a good idea what's going on in the area and who has what. Great bullets too!

 

Ding, Ding, Ding.     The winner is:  ^

 

AND..... she's mighty pretty... :wub:

 

Be sure to ask her WHO her #1 Cowboy boyfriend is!  :D

 

Scarlett also has a nice 73' and a few Marlin's.

 

..........Widder

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Exodus5 said:

Thanks all.  Unfortunately, finding a “cowboy style” lever rifle around Charlotte requires a lot of looking in gun stores and pawn shops since there doesn’t appear to be a good shop with several examples.  Also, since my local range no longer has cowboy shoots,

 

OK, first, find you another club that DOES have cowboy shoots.  Otherwise, where will you shoot? 

 

Then, GO to the matches and show you are interested and responsible, and you will have offers to shoot almost every type of gun there.   Cowboy shooting is not like the usual shooting event.  We are MUCH more friendly, willing to help a new pard understand the guns and the cowboy way.   Getting out to a match without guns along may seem weird for a modern gun shooter, BUT IT IS THE BEST WAY TO FIND OUT WHAT YOU WANT TO BUY.

 

Good luck, GJ

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
17 minutes ago, Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 said:

Getting out to a match without guns along may seem weird for a modern gun shooter, BUT IT IS THE BEST WAY TO FIND OUT WHAT YOU WANT TO BUY.


Indeed.
I have accumulated some 170 days of California waiting period days so far.
We should have all our guns by October 1.
Our leather just recently arrived.

We attend the matches as civilians.
I pick up brass, my bride keeps score.

This will get you introduced to the regulars, and get a good look at what they shoot, and why.

Edited by bgavin

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, bgavin said:


Indeed.
I have accumulated some 170 days of California waiting period days so far.
We should have all our guns by October 1.
Our leather just recently arrived.

We attend the matches as civilians.
I pick up brass, my bride keeps score.

This will get you introduced to the regulars, and get a good look at what they shoot, and why.

You've bought 17 guns so far since starting up with SASS?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
39 minutes ago, El Hombre Sin Nombre said:

You've bought 17 guns so far since starting up with SASS?

Been out of CA for 11 years, but while the "Wait" period is 10 days, you can only buy one handgun every 30 days.

 

Phantom

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
42 minutes ago, El Hombre Sin Nombre said:

You've bought 17 guns so far since starting up with SASS?


Nope.
30 days each between 5 revolvers, 10 days each for two rifles.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

Been out of CA for 11 years, but while the "Wait" period is 10 days, you can only buy one handgun every 30 days.

 

Phantom

 

4 minutes ago, bgavin said:


Nope.
30 days each between 5 revolvers, 10 days each for two rifles.

I forgot about the pistols. Funny thing about the wait, it literally goes by the hour. I once went in to pick up something after the 10 day wait, and because of day light savings time, I had to wait an hour. Haha only in California.

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes, it literally goes by the hour and the minute.
My new FFL makes a joke about asking if I am in 1 minute after 10.000 days are up.

Add to these delays my former FFL who dorked up two shipments by not being there to receive them.
7 days to him, 7 days back to the vendor, a few days for the dust to settle, another 7 days back out to (new) FFL, then 10 more days for the last rifle, 30 more days for the next to last revolver.

My last one will be in my hands around October 1.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, bgavin said:

Yes, it literally goes by the hour and the minute.
My new FFL makes a joke about asking if I am in 1 minute after 10.000 days are up.

Add to these delays my former FFL who dorked up two shipments by not being there to receive them.
7 days to him, 7 days back to the vendor, a few days for the dust to settle, another 7 days back out to (new) FFL, then 10 more days for the last rifle, 30 more days for the next to last revolver.

My last one will be in my hands around October 1.

Oh my god. I would be losing my $#%& over that one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

Yep.
"losing my $#%&" and 35 cents used to buy cheap coffee.

I lost 42 days of shipping time from two foul-ups.
My previous FFL was close-by and $35.
The other FFL is 20 miles round trip (twice) and $50, but reliable.
Another local bandit FFL close to me wants $100 for FFL fees.  No thanks.

It would have been more cost-effective and certainly faster, to get the Henry Frontier from Sportsman's Warehouse.
SW does not stock, nor will they order, any of the others.
Three of the revolvers were specialty finds, i.e. pre-2005 Bisley Vaquero (only 4700 made), and two Single-Six Bisley 22LR, also discontinued and out of stock.

The Bisley Vaquero was a gold nugget from a pawn shop in Junction City, KS.
Owner refused to ship to CA, but 3 blocks up the street was an FFL willing to ship.
Pawn owner walked the Vaquero up the street, did the FFL to FFL transfer, and they sent to my FFL.

When one of the 22 was returned to Buds' they immediately sent it back out after I spoke with them, but banged me $25 for shipping.
The returned Henry rifle was only $15 shipping, but charged twice.

I still have two revolvers at the FFL here.
#4 will be delivered 8/26 when its 30-day wait is completed and #5 another 30 days later.
Single action 22s must be terrorist guns in the minds of CA sheep, hence the 30 day waits.
 

Edited by bgavin
edited for clarity

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

Been out of CA for 11 years, but while the "Wait" period is 10 days, you can only buy one handgun every 30 days.

 

Phantom

It's now 1 handgun in 30 days.

 

OLG

Edited by The Original Lumpy Gritz
incorrect statement on my part

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

Got changed to 30 days for any firearm....:angry:

It use to be just 30 days on handguns......

OLG

I don't believe that's correct. When would that have changed? I recently bought a pistol and a rifle, and entered on the same DROS. Last month

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, bgavin said:

Yep.
"losing my $#%&" and 35 cents used to buy cheap coffee.

I lost 42 days of shipping time from two foul-ups.
My previous FFL was close-by and $35.
The other FFL is 20 miles round trip (twice) and $50, but reliable.
Another local bandit FFL close to me wants $100 for FFL fees.  No thanks.

It would have been more cost-effective and certainly faster, to get the Henry Frontier from Sportsman's Warehouse.
SW does not stock, nor will they order, any of the others.
Three of the revolvers were specialty finds, i.e. pre-2005 Bisley Vaquero (only 4700 made), and two Single-Six Bisley 22LR, also discontinued and out of stock.

The Bisley Vaquero was a gold nugget from a pawn shop in Junction City, KS.
Owner refused to ship to CA, but 3 blocks up the street was an FFL willing to ship.
Pawn owner walked the Vaquero up the street, did the FFL to FFL transfer, and they sent to my FFL.

When one of the 22 was returned to Buds' they immediately sent it back out after I spoke with them, but banged me $25 for shipping.
The returned Henry rifle was only $15 shipping, but charged twice.

I still have two revolvers at the FFL here.
#4 will be delivered 8/26 when its 30-day wait is completed and #5 another 30 days later.
Single action 22s must be terrorist guns in the minds of CA sheep, hence the 30 day waits.
 

That is some utter nonsense there. Talk about your bad luck. Hey you're pretty much in my neck of the woods. We should shoot together sometime

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

Sounds like a plan.

Sharon and I belong to both Diamond Dick's Cowboy Town and the Sac Valley shooting center.
It looks she will have Mondays off from grandson babysitting so we can head to the range for practice.
We can use DDCT for practice anytime as long as we have two or more on the range.

We will practice with the Single-Six and Henry 22s to ease her into learning the flow and practicing the rules.
22 is cheaper than shooting up our hand loads.

Did you shoot with the Two Rivers Posse on August 4 at DDCT?
We come out to pickup brass and keep score at the Outlaws matches.
Tomorrow we are going down to do the same at the Shady Ladies match.
I hope to get Sharon introduced to more lady shooters.

Yeah, nothing but sour luck for shipping and endless delays.
I have no more to acquire, unless it is a Remington V3 if our Shrine group starts trap shooting again.
My 870 and 28" barrel does the job, but my shoulder does notice the effects of 25 rounds.

Edited by bgavin
added more data

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, bgavin said:

Sounds like a plan.

Sharon and I belong to both Diamond Dick's Cowboy Town and the Sac Valley shooting center.
It looks she will have Mondays off from grandson babysitting so we can head to the range for practice.
We can use DDCT for practice anytime as long as we have two or more on the range.

We will practice with the Single-Six and Henry 22s to ease her into learning the flow and practicing the rules.
22 is cheaper than shooting up our hand loads.

Did you shoot with the Two Rivers Posse on August 4 at DDCT?
We come out to pickup brass and keep score at the Outlaws matches.
Tomorrow we are going down to do the same at the Shady Ladies match.
I hope to get Sharon introduced to more lady shooters.

Yeah, nothing but sour luck for shipping and endless delays.
I have no more to acquire, unless it is a Remington V3 if our Shrine group starts trap shooting again.
My 870 and 28" barrel does the job, but my shoulder does notice the effects of 25 rounds.

I haven't been to DDCT since the State match last year. It's about a two hour drive for me, so I don't get out there much. How old is Sharon?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.