Dillon powder measure and BlackMZ powder?

[Warden Callaway]

I found a second Dillon manual 450 style powder measure a while back.  Now I'm thinking of setting it up to throw BlackMZ.  I've setted in on using 15 grains by volume (I think that's right at 1CC). 

 

Question 1) For 15 grains,  can I use the light charge bar that's in it or would I need to change to the larger charge bar?

 

Question 2) It's a given that the measure and powder die would need cleaning after every use.  Are there any tips and tricks to cleaning up?

[Too Tall Bob]

FYI - I tried and gave up trying to use Bk MZ through my Dillon 550. It (Bk MZ) is very prone to clumping and bridging. I spent a lot of time cleaning the charge bar out and then wondering if my loaded cartridges up to that point were ok. I gave up and went back to using a Lee Dipper. I do load SG shells with it on my MEC with no problems though. 

Good luck. 

[Warden Callaway]

9 minutes ago, Too Tall Bob said:

FYI - I tried and gave up trying to use Bk MZ through my Dillon 550. It (Bk MZ) is very prone to clumping and bridging. I spent a lot of time cleaning the charge bar out and then wondering if my loaded cartridges up to that point were ok. I gave up and went back to using a Lee Dipper. I do load SG shells with it on my MEC with no problems though. 

Good luck. 

 

That's good information.  Thanks. 

 

Were you using the the light charge bar or the heavy?  

 

I'm using a Lyman 55 black powder measure and it works pretty reliable but wobbles and turns setting lose in the top of a Lee powder die. And I have to set it up to crank left handed.

[Sedalia Dave]

I haven't loaded any Black MZ but I would get a large charge bar. From what I remember 3F APP and Black MZ are the same granule size so I doubt that the small bar is adequate.

 

I usually load a 1 to 2 thousand rounds over a couple of days and don't clean the powder hopper and press until I am done. Then I remove the charge bar and wash in hot soapy water. I use a stiff nylon bottle brush to clean the area where the charge bar slides and the powder drop.  Most of the build up I experience is on the bottom of the charge bar and where is slides inside the body of the measure.

 

Once clean I let everything air dry and then lightly coat everything with a dry film lubricant like Hornady 1 Shot gun lube as a corrosion preventative. 

[Too Tall Bob]

35 minutes ago, Warden Callaway said:

 

That's good information.  Thanks. 

 

Were you using the the light charge bar or the heavy?  

 

I'm using a Lyman 55 black powder measure and it works pretty reliable but wobbles and turns setting lose in the top of a Lee powder die. And I have to set it up to crank left handed.

Large charge bar on the Dillon. I have no issues with APP 3 F but Bk Mz -not so happy. With APP 3F I can load 3 or 4 k rounds with no issues. Just clean up afterwards. 

Good luck 

[Irish Dan O'Shootem]

You might look at dillon powder die P22-16629 and plastic funnel P22-16617.

[Too Tall Bob]

8 minutes ago, Irish Dan O'Shootem said:

You might look at dillon powder die P22-16629 and plastic funnel P22-16617.

This is what I use for loading 38-40. I shoot Bk MZ in them with filler on top. Funnel works fine. Good suggestion. 

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

WC-Stay with the dipper. 

That stuff is like try'n to meter flour.........

OLG

[Warden Callaway]

2 hours ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

WC-Stay with the dipper. 

That stuff is like try'n to meter flour.........

OLG

 

I'm using the Lyman 55 black powder measure and it does ok. Just awkward. 

[Colorado Coffinmaker]

 

I don't know if this will equate to Black MZ.  I actually haven't loaded with the stuff.  With 40# of APP on hand ............... I did learn however, 2f APP does not run reliably thru either of my 650s.  3f runs just fine.  However  ...   The Caveat:  I did have to switch to the "large" powder bar even with 3f APP.  I have had no luck at all with 2f APP as the chunks (fancy wurd for granulation) are just too large.  

 

Just my story.

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

51 minutes ago, Warden Callaway said:

 

I'm using the Lyman 55 black powder measure and it does ok. Just awkward. 

With the RH in your area. Do not leave it in the PM overnight.

OLG

[Rattlesnake Slim]

I can agree with Too Tall Bob. I gave up on BMZ in any kind of powder measure, sooner or later you'll have a clump that will cost you a squib. And he and I both live with single digit humidity! Just dip.

[Warden Callaway]

39 minutes ago, Rattlesnake Slim said:

I can agree with Too Tall Bob. I gave up on BMZ in any kind of powder measure, sooner or later you'll have a clump that will cost you a squib. And he and I both live with single digit humidity! Just dip.

 

I use the RCBS lockout die. 

[CuthbertJTwillie]

I use a 550 with Black MZ.  The powder is similar to irregular coffee grounds and needs to be manually handled in a pan to get rid of any clumps.  I use a small bar for 38 and a large bar for 45.  Pistol and Rifle get the same loads-filled close to the top with room for the boolits to set down with a bit of compression.  I have no idea what the load is as far as grains or volume.  200 grain boolits for the 45 and 125/127 grain boolits for the 38s.  All that being said, Black MZ is messy and meters poorly so if I don't get enough powder in the brass I just dump it back in the hopper and move forward.  I give the bars a trip to the polishing wheel once a year or so.  Oh, the rounds make a lot of smoke!

[Don Coyote, SASS #63736]

We use BlackMZ exclusively for BP cartridges on a 650, 32HR & 38. I've made 1000s of rounds in both calibers, with very consistent loads. Two important things. 1st I dump each new can of BMZ in a plastic pan & manually remove any clumps of any size. 2nd, I do not use a Dillon measure or powder die. Instead, both tool heads are set up with Lee Powder dies, a Lee 1" drop tube, and a Lee Pro Auto Disk Powder Measure. Very consistent powder drop. I found a long time ago that even APP 3f would bridge in the "funnel" of the Dillon flare/drop tube, especially 32 HR, and cause inconsistent powder loads. Several of the smoke shooters here in AZ have gone this way & really like the results. As with all Lee products, the conversion is relatively inexpensive.

[Warden Callaway]

My SOP is to pull the tumbler from the Lyman 55 and brush bore of the body of the measure and take fine steel wool to the tumbler itself.  Reassemble measure.  Make sure set screws are tight.  Take bottle of BlackMZ and shake it and listen for clumps.   Place small funnel with opening about 1/4" opening.   Dump BlackMZ in top and let it trickle through.   Any lumps will catch in the funnel. Return to bottle and shake some more.  Fill to some level.  Put lid on top of measure and on bottle if any remain in bottle   Verily load thrown.  Load.  Dump remainder back in bottle and cap. Disassemble measure and clean it. 

[Sarival Slim]

I load Black MZ on my 650 with the Dillon powder measure. I pour the BMZ into an empty BMZ bottle,  half full, shake it till it seems broken up and pour it into the powder measure. Once in a while it may throw lite, but I watch them thru the powder check station.  Works for me...them little moisture packets cause more trouble than the powder...;)

[Sedalia Dave]

I got a couple of bottles of 3F APP that had clumps in them. Like others I divide the bottle in half and shake it to break up any clumps.  I have a small piece of 3/16" expanded metal mesh that I put into the bottom of the funnel. It catches the desiccant packages and any clumps I failed to break up by shaking the bottle.

 

I can get 2F APP to run through my shotgun press if I don't use the baffles.. However, It will still occasionally drop a light charge if I don't keep an eye on it.

 

Good to know about Black MZ metering poorly. I was looking to buy a case the next time I was near a store.

[Warden Callaway]

18 minutes ago, Sedalia Dave said:

Good to know about Black MZ metering poorly. I was looking to buy a case the next time I was near a store.

 

I'm willing to work with clumping and managing keeping it from sucking up moisture because of the many things I like about the propellant.  Cost (if bought from Sportsmans Warehouse) is the lowest by far to make smoke.  Charges are light to make plenty of power and smoke.  No need to lube bullets.  I just cast from lead from my bullet traps and size. Keeps seating die from caking up with lube.   Gun run entire match without any real attention.  No real panic rush to clean guns or brass (although sooner is better than later).  

[Sedalia Dave]

15 minutes ago, Warden Callaway said:

 

I'm willing to work with clumping and managing keeping it from sucking up moisture because of the many things I like about the propellant.  Cost (if bought from Sportsmans Warehouse) is the lowest by far to make smoke.  Charges are light to make plenty of power and smoke.  No need to lube bullets.  I just cast from lead from my bullet traps and size. Keeps seating die from caking up with lube.   Gun run entire match without any real attention.  No real panic rush to clean guns or brass (although sooner is better than later).  

 

Cost is why I was looking to buy a case. About 1/2 the cost of APP.

[Snakebite]

I've loaded a good deal of Black MZ on my Dillion 650. The first thing that I do is to beat the hell out of new unopened jar, then I pour the powder into a large bowl and stir it very well with a wooden stick and make sure that there are no clumps. works fine for me. At $10/jar it's hard to beat, and works very well. Don't leave it in the powder measure when you are done, and push a nylon brush down the powder drop. Blow off the top of the shell plate then go to dinner.

 

Snakebite