It has occurred to me.....

[Forty Rod SASS 3935]

.....after watching a few hundred hours of WWII documentaries, the from Pearl harbor (and before for some of our friends) until the last round was fired during that war, we humans on both sides blew up one hell of a lot of sea water.  We also polluted the oceans with oil, iron, and a almost every other toxic substance known, tore up hundreds of thousands of acres of earth, poisoned the atmosphere with smoke and other chemicals and killed millions of people, millions of pounds of livestock and groceries, wild life and timber, and damaged or destroyed hundreds of thousands of buildings huge and tiny

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and yet the planet is still here, still thriving, still chugging along at its own pace.  How can anyone seriously contend that our puny automobiles and factories and aerosol cans can destroy this amazing planet.

 

Item #2:  I wonder, from watching these same documentaries, how many of our ships and planes and ground forces were damaged or destroyed, and how many of our people were injured or killed, by "friendly fire".  I see rounds being fired all over the place and not all of them hit the enemy or sea water or turf.  

 

Has there ever been a published document addressing these issues?

[Hardpan Curmudgeon SASS #8967]

Yup.  I have long pondered those very issues.   

[Subdeacon Joe]

Some sources.  I doubt that there will ever be a full accounting, or that there can be a full accounting, of friendly fire deaths.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_friendly_fire_incidents#World_War_II

 

http://www.airforcemag.com/MagazineArchive/Documents/2003/June 2003/0603casualties.pdf

 

https://militaryhistorynow.com/2012/09/19/fatal-errors-the-worst-friendly-fire-incidents-of-world-war-two/

 

 

[Pat Riot]

The planet heals itself with little or no help from humans. 

[Tennessee williams]

3 hours ago, Forty Rod SASS 3935 said:

.....after watching a few hundred hours of WWII documentaries, the from Pearl harbor (and before for some of our friends) until the last round was fired during that war, we humans on both sides blew up one hell of a lot of sea water.  We also polluted the oceans with oil, iron, and a almost every other toxic substance known, tore up hundreds of thousands of acres of earth, poisoned the atmosphere with smoke and other chemicals and killed millions of people, millions of pounds of livestock and groceries, wild life and timber, and damaged or destroyed hundreds of thousands of buildings huge and tiny

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

and yet the planet is still here, still thriving, still chugging along at its own pace.  How can anyone seriously contend that our puny automobiles and factories and aerosol cans can destroy this amazing planet.

 

Item #2:  I wonder, from watching these same documentaries, how many of our ships and planes and ground forces were damaged or destroyed, and how many of our people were injured or killed, by "friendly fire".  I see rounds being fired all over the place and not all of them hit the enemy or sea water or turf.  

 

Has there ever been a published document addressing these issues?

It aint that, it's those pesky cow farts. Everybody knows cow farts cause global warmin.

[Marshal Mo Hare, SASS #45984]

4 minutes ago, Tennessee williams said:

It aint that, it's those pesky cow farts. Everybody knows cow farts cause global warmin.

We old farts add some too.

[Sgt. C.J. Sabre, SASS #46770]

Environmental activism isn't any more about the environment than gun control is about guns. It's all politics.

[J.D. Daily]

After VJ day a lot of equipment was dumped into the Pacific ocean.  I was told by a logistics contractor employee on Kwajalein atoll in 1985, when I was there to provide installation guidance for the diesel generators my employer sold to the DOJ, that the Navy dumped tons of equipment in the deep ocean trench off Kwajalein.  I wonder if the Navy removed all the hazardous & toxic liquids from the fleet of ships nuked off Eniwetok?

[Marshal Mo Hare, SASS #45984]

53 minutes ago, J.D. Daily said:

After VJ day a lot of equipment was dumped into the Pacific ocean.  I was told by a logistics contractor employee on Kwajalein atoll in 1985, when I was there to provide installation guidance for the diesel generators my employer sold to the DOJ, that the Navy dumped tons of equipment in the deep ocean trench off Kwajalein.  I wonder if the Navy removed all the hazardous & toxic liquids from the fleet of ships nuked off Eniwetok?

I read that they did remove all liquids from the ships that were used in the Bikini tests.

[Steel-eye Steve SASS #40674]

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/05/02/first-world-war-mustard-gas-leaks-belgian-underwater-grave/?WT.mc_id=tmg_share_fb&fbclid=IwAR2TzzSThaySN_Yh8F1H4Jgw2lz7eFRbXhuq4R8thI0oZlfjpD9Ic3BzLiA

[Texas Lizard]

4 hours ago, Sgt. C.J. Sabre, SASS #46770 said:

Environmental activism isn't any more about the environment than gun control is about guns. It's all politics.

And our money...

 

Texas Lizard

[Warden Callaway]

And all that steel came from steel mills in Pennsylvania with no pollution control by nasty coal that came from Kentucky coal mining. 

[Imis Twohofon,SASS # 46646]

Notice a common theme in Gun Control, Climate Control...?

 

Imis

[Charlie Plasters, SASS#60943]

And I have wondered what percent of military personnel active at the start of the war were still alive at it's conclusion. 

[Badger Mountain Charlie SASS #43172]

On 5/4/2019 at 5:43 PM, Marshal Mo Hare, SASS #45984 said:

We old farts add some too.

Guilty as charged. 

[Marshal Mo Hare, SASS #45984]

15 hours ago, Charlie Plasters, SASS#60943 said:

And I have wondered what percent of military personnel active at the start of the war were still alive at it's conclusion. 

 

I could not find that actual statistic, but (all from Wikipedia)

US MILITARY PERSONNEL (1939-1945)
 

Year	Army	Navy	Marines	Coast Guard	Total
1939	189,839	125,202	19,432		334,473
1940	269,023	160,997	28,345		458,365
1941	1,462,315	284,427	54,359		1,801,101
1942	3,075,608	640,570	142,613	56,716*	3,915,507
1943	6,994,472	1,741,750	308,523	151,167	9,195,912
1944	7,994,750	2,981,365	475,604	171,749	11,623,468
1945	8,267,958	3,380,817	474,680	85,783	12,209,238

*Coast Guard listed only as wartime strength

 

Total deaths from all causes 407,300

 

total involvement in the military was higher than 12 million of course due to discharge and casualty counts.but the percentage or fatalities from the total is around 3.3%.

 

the 8.6 /1000 below does not mesh with the above stats, by a big number, it’s not even close. The 407,300 includes all causes though.

 

 

PROFILE OF US SERVICEMEN (1941-1945)

• 38.8% (6,332,000) of U.S. servicemen and all servicewomen were volunteers
• 61.2% (11,535,000) were draftees
• Average duration of service: 33 months
• Overseas service: 73% served overseas, with an average of 16 months abroad
• Combat survivability (out of 1,000): 8.6 were killed in action, 3 died from other causes, and 17.7 received non-fatal combat wounds
• Non-combat jobs: 38.8% of enlisted personnel had rear echelon assignments—administrative, support, or manual labor.
• Average base pay: enlisted—$71.33 per month; officer—$203.50 per month

[Sixgun Sheridan]

13 hours ago, Marshal Mo Hare, SASS #45984 said:

• Combat survivability (out of 1,000): 8.6 were killed in action, 3 died from other causes, and 17.7 received non-fatal combat wounds

 

I have a hard time believing that. If true then being a US Infantryman during the war was hardly any more dangerous than being a logger.

[Marshal Mo Hare, SASS #45984]

6 minutes ago, Sixgun Sheridan said:

 

I have a hard time believing that. If true then being a US Infantryman during the war was hardly any more dangerous than being a logger.

As I said, the numbers don’t agree I suspect ten times higher.

[Sixgun Sheridan]

Sorry, I didn't see your comment at the middle of your post.

 

One thing's for sure, the sheer waste of taxpayer-funded equipment after the war bordered on criminal. I've heard stories that'd make any militaria collector cringe. Unfortunately at the time it was considered far cheaper to just bury it or dump it into the ocean than to ship it back to the USA.

[Marshal Mo Hare, SASS #45984]

4 minutes ago, Sixgun Sheridan said:

Sorry, I didn't see your comment at the middle of your post.

 

One thing's for sure, the sheer waste of taxpayer-funded equipment after the war bordered on criminal. I've heard stories that'd make any militaria collector cringe. Unfortunately at the time it was considered far cheaper to just bury it or dump it into the ocean than to ship it back to the USA.

Consider that surplus liberty ships were going for $100. We certainly didn’t want to maintain them.

[Forty Rod SASS 3935]

40 minutes ago, Sixgun Sheridan said:

Sorry, I didn't see your comment at the middle of your post.

 

One thing's for sure, the sheer waste of taxpayer-funded equipment after the war bordered on criminal. I've heard stories that'd make any militaria collector cringe. Unfortunately at the time it was considered far cheaper to just bury it or dump it into the ocean than to ship it back to the USA.

You should see what we did when we left 'Nam.  It would make you cry.

[bgavin]

On 5/4/2019 at 2:21 PM, Forty Rod SASS 3935 said:

.....after watching a few hundred hours of WWII documentaries, the from Pearl harbor...

 

My Dad was the officer of the day on the California, December 7 1941.

As such, he was the last man (alive) off the California some 10 hours later.
He was bitter about it being a setup... and about walking across the guts and brains of what used to be his shipmates.