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Big_Country

How long is too long for a gunsmith??

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Just got back in town from a business trip and figured it was time to give an update. The second of my three 97’s has been completed and shipped back. It is scheduled to arrive Tuesday. I have been told that the third is almost ready to test fire and also be returned. I’m looking forward to receiving them and giving them a run. I will give an update on the work and performance of the second one after I try it out. I will also keep everyone posted on the return of number three. 

 

Thanks

BC

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It is just ridiculous to ask somebody to wait that long to get their gun/s back. I waited a year to get some specialty work done on a vintage Winchester by a man mentioned in a previous post. He was the Tops in the field, but he told me up front that it would be as least that long and he didn't have me send the gun until he was ready for it. It was work that I didn't feel qualified to do myself. I believe that the long waits have been one of the reasons that many have taken up the reins and learned to do some of their own work. The cost is not usually more than the work is worth, IMO. Of course some Big Name smiths do get a pretty penny for their work and do have long wait times. In many cases a lesser know Smith might well be worth giving a try.  A good deal of the most common and basic work needed on the guns used in our game is doable by the Layman. Most of it is little more than disassembly and minor fitting of replacing parts. There is a lot of "How to" material available on line. Moving up the ladder into custom modifications requires a bit more finesse and experience and of course some of the work, especially machining and such require the services of a professional level person. I found a man that I like. Texas has 146,873 Gunsmiths, +/- , he is one of them.  Many of the really good Smiths have the same problem, turn around time.  Also... a good number of the talented Smiths are just getting OLD. They have health issues and end up falling behind in the work that they take in. It is difficult for some of them to admit that it is either time to stop or limit the amount of work that they take in.  

 

Snakebite

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Custom Leather and Ammo can also cause "when am I gonna get it"  stress. - just not to the same extent as a 'missing' firearm. 

 

A "long" wait is not really not that "long" if the vendor tells you up front "hey - I have a back log - it's gonna be a while

The frustration is when they neglect to tell you that they don't have something in stock - or that they have a backlog.

In fact - some of them will just wait until you get frustrated and ask for an update - THEN they give you the "oh, we are having some supply chain issues" excuse. 

Then - after giving you the "one more week" treatment until you have had enough, they try to fleece you for cancellation fees, or restockage fees.

...which is a hoot since they obviously didnt have it in stock in the first place.

 

That type of delay is the type of amateur business practice that DESERVES to be called out in public.  

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3 hours ago, Big_Country said:

Just got back in town from a business trip and figured it was time to give an update. The second of my three 97’s has been completed and shipped back. It is scheduled to arrive Tuesday. I have been told that the third is almost ready to test fire and also be returned. I’m looking forward to receiving them and giving them a run. I will give an update on the work and performance of the second one after I try it out. I will also keep everyone posted on the return of number three. 

 

Thanks

BC

You speak of #2 and #3. What about #1?

OLG

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Hiya OLG,

 

  In the first post “At 14 months I received one back and was told the other two would follow soon and things had been delayed and that this was not normal. 

 

Thanks

BC

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On ‎4‎/‎27‎/‎2019 at 3:43 AM, Cheatin Charlie said:

The late Harry Pope master barrel maker had this sign posted in his shop.  He had more work than he could handle.

 

NO DELIVERY PROMISED. TAKE YOUR WORK WHEN DONE OR TAKE IT ELSEWHERE. IF YOU MUST KNOW WHEN I WILL BE THROUGH WITH YOUR WORK THE ANSWER IS NOW. TAKE YOUR WORK AWAY. I DON’T WANT IT. I HAVE NO WAY OF KNOWING WHEN I WILL BE THROUGH. I WORK ELEVEN HOURS A DAY. DAILY INTERRUPTIONS AVERAGE ONE AND ONE-HALF HOURS. DARK WEATHER SETS ME BACK STILL MORE. THERE IS BUT ONE OF ME. I’M HUMAN AND I’M TIRED. I REFUSE TO LONGER BE WORRIED BY PROMISES THAT CIRCUMSTANCES DO NOT ALLOW ME TO KEEP. YOU’RE A LONG TIME DEAD. IT IS TIME TO BEGIN TO LIVE.

It least he gave you the facts of doing business with him up front.

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56 minutes ago, Big_Country said:

Hiya OLG,

 

  In the first post “At 14 months I received one back and was told the other two would follow soon and things had been delayed and that this was not normal. 

 

Thanks

BC

Well-Looks like my CRS is in full bloom.......:lol:

TNX-

OLG

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An up and coming smith took 2 years to do a custom Vaquero, including a caliber conversion.  He always had excuses but they seemed reasonable, so I waited.  Work wasn't what I thought we agreed upon but was well done.  I had him re-blue an original 1892 Winnie.  Took over a year, again with many excuses-not so reasonable.  I noted that he did good work but many delays on Facebook.  All of a sudden, he refused more work from me (a 71 Winnie re-blue).

 

Information via a PM.

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I suppose I've been quite lucky iny dealings with Gunsmiths.  For most work, I use Three Cut, who's fairly local to me.  He's worked over more guns than I can think of right now, and always did a good job in a timely manner.  

 

If there's a gun type that he is not fully comfortable working on, he'll tell you and recommend someone else.  

 

I do have some guns out with another Smith, because he's one of the few in the country doing what he does.  He has quite a backlog and you know going in that it's going to take awhile.  And that's ok.

 

The only bad experience I had was long ago, and I've not used that Smith since, and now he's retired from the business.  So, no one else is getting disappointed by him.

 

I have bought a few used guns off the Classified.Wire with "action jobs", that were actually gun butchered.  But, Three Cut was able to make them right for me.   So, it all worked out in to end.

 

It is a great thing to have someone you can talk to face-to-face about what you want done.  But I know that isn't always possible.  

 

Anyway, good luck and keep us updated!  If you wish to leave feedback about the transaction, you have the link.

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Guest Texas jack Black SASS#9362
7 hours ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

Well-Looks like my CRS is in full bloom.......:lol:

TNX-

OLG

Thread is alive and well only one more to go .:rolleyes:

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Well number 2 was received. Not quite as impressed with this one as I was the first one. Was told that the third one was almost ready to test fire. Next email stated, recovering from surgery and that it will be delayed another week or so. At least the communication is occurring. I’m “patiently” waiting the couple of more weeks and then ask again. This seems to be the never ending test of patience. I’ve learned important lessons from this.

 

1. Ask for a specific delivery date and state up from if it slips then I would like to be notified and a legitimate reason. 

2. If it slips more than once, ask for my items back and go elsewhere. 

3. Be fair, but be firm. 

4. If the person will not give a date then just go elsewhere. 

 

After this episode, I sent three sets of pistols to a well known gunsmith for action jobs and short strokes. He stated it may take up to three months for what I wanted. I had my pistols back in six weeks. I freely recommend him to everyone every chance I get. I know there are a lot of great people in our sport. I’m glad to work with them. I know at times life happens, but “truthful” communication is the key. 

 

Thanks

BC

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I just had a Colt 1851 fitted with the Krist Knoverter kit done through VTI.  Action job, barrel relined, and fitting of the cylinder, in less than 3 weeks.  If you have a blackpowder revolver needing work try VTI.

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Posted (edited)

Now, the question is: How long is too long for a post to go on about how long is too long for a gunsmith?

Edited by Marshal Chance Morgun
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Marshal,

 

 As long as nice people like you are interested I’m sure we can continue the post thread for a long time. I know several other Cowboys have asked in the forum to be kept updated, that is the reason I’ve continued to update the thread. 

 

  Again Thank You for your interest.  Have a wonderful Memorial Day. 

 

BC

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Guest Texas jack Black SASS#9362
On 5/24/2019 at 9:00 PM, Marshal Chance Morgun said:

Now, the question is: How long is too long for a post to go on about how long is too long for a gunsmith?

 

 

 I predicted back on page one that this will run even after the long lost 97 returns home.:FlagAm:

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Time to close this thread out. 

The last 97 arrived home earlier this week. Yes, I gave him more time. The gunsmith had surgery and asked for more time. He also started communicating, which was a change. The third 97 work was the best of all. The first was good, the second seemed like it was a rushed job and was just okay. The third looks and feels better than either of the other two. 

 

Lessons learned on both sides. 

 

Thanks to all that supported and were interested. 

 

BC

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Howdy BIG COUNTRY.

Congratulations on a successful ending.

Just my observation from working on rifles and handling other firearms from varying gunsmiths,

but sometimes, its hard for a gunsmith to make all of the same type firearm FEEL the same.

Even manufacturers can't do it.

 

I ain't gonna 'second guess' you on your thoughts of a 'rush job', but by your own words it

tells us that 3 of the same type firearms, worked on by the same smith, all have a different

'feeling' than the others.

 

There have been a few occasions where I worked on a persons Henry .22 and it turned out feeling

better than my very own.   And the work and modifications were identical.   Go figure.

 

AGAIN... glad your situation ending successfully and here's wishing you MANY days of happy

shooting them and enjoy the day with all your friends.

 

..........Widder

 

 

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Widder,

 

   I agree 100% in firearms feeling different. The only reason I said that I felt it was a rush job is that there are several places that were polished and have a more finished/tuned look on number 1 and number 3, where on number 2 it looks like those locations were not touched. The polishing and adjusting does not seem to the same level and it shows in the smoothness of the function of the 97. 

 

Thanks

BC

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Big Country,

 

Was the work paid for In advance?

 

Son gave his pistols to a gunsmith.  Smith had all winter, the first spring match was coming up fast.  Son asked for his pistols back.  They were returned in a box fully disassembled with no visible work done.  No money had exchanged hands.

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Glad you finally got the last one back. And thanks for the updates, I was following.

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6 hours ago, Matthew Duncan said:

Big Country,

 

Was the work paid for In advance?

 

Son gave his pistols to a gunsmith.  Smith had all winter, the first spring match was coming up fast.  Son asked for his pistols back.  They were returned in a box fully disassembled with no visible work done.  No money had exchanged hands.

Matthew;

That is Not Service !!!  The Smith should be ashamed ....

 

Jabez Cowboy

 

 

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Matthew,

 

 I did not pay in advance. All payment was made after the fact. I was just glad to get everything back. I can live with the difference in the 97’s.

 

Smoken,

 

  Thank you. I appreciate it. 

 

BC

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On 4/17/2019 at 11:37 AM, Imis Twohofon,SASS # 46646 said:

In the words of Danny Glover's character in Silverado "That ain't right"

 

Imis

Yes , but unfortunately all too common!

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The question is What is to long?

The answer is one excuse for the delay - two excuses ... ship them back if no results in 2 months

I had many long arms damaged by Super Storm Sandy.  Went on a NJ gun forum for recommendations for refinishing. All I heard as Bruce in Bayonne ... so I delivered 24 long arms & 7 barrels

One year and 2 months I heard every excuse ever invented ... time to retrieve the guns

Found another gunsmith in Jersey and delivered the whole pile of firearms that needed deep cleaning, parts repaired and bluing.  All firearms finished in a month & a half. Second batch of guns done in a month

This smith has been my Go To for every thing including relining all shot out cartridge bores I have. And the add is .... we have developed a close personal relationship

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Sorry to say, but I feel that name should accompany these posts to protect other shooters from experiancing the same problems. With results like this they don't deserve to be called 

cowboy action gunsmiths. Just my opinion.

Johnny Meadows

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34 minutes ago, Johnny Meadows,SASS#28485L said:

Sorry to say, but I feel that name should accompany these posts to protect other shooters from experiancing the same problems. With results like this they don't deserve to be called 

cowboy action gunsmiths. Just my opinion.

Johnny Meadows

Johnny, So glad that you finally get to spend more family time with the little ones

So sad that my go - to SKB guy is not around anymore, gonna miss our conversations

Great shotguns (3 of them) no troubles in 7+ years and I think the longest I ever waited for anything was a couple weeks

In my book you're still the man

 

Respectfully

 

:FlagAm: :FlagAm: :FlagAm:

 

Gateway Kid

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