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yo1dog

Winchester 1886 Replica

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6 hours ago, yo1dog said:

Here's something funny: Remember the seller of that Uberti that was rude and unprofessional? Well he admitted that the Uberti 1886 "Deluxe" was renamed to the Uberti 1886 Sporting Rifle a while ago which was why you can't find any information on it. I told him I had already purchased another rifle, and he was not happy.
 

 

I belong to a couple of watch forums and there is a saying on them that goes, “Buy the seller, not the watch.” You did the right thing by walking away. Life’s too short to do business with an @$$4013.

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Yes you need a 1 inch group at 100 yards. If you have a 2 inch at 100 yards and then you shoot a target at 500 yards the 1  inch may be up to 5 inches off the 2 inch group would 10 inches off. So you would have 2  times more chances of missing the target. OH you just lost the match!!!!!!

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15 hours ago, GARDNER KID said:

Yes you need a 1 inch group at 100 yards. If you have a 2 inch at 100 yards and then you shoot a target at 500 yards the 1  inch may be up to 5 inches off the 2 inch group would 10 inches off. So you would have 2  times more chances of missing the target. OH you just lost the match!!!!!!

 

First off, that is quite a list of accomplishments in your signature. Congrats!

As I explained in my original post, this is a gun for fun more than anything else. Defiantly not taking it to any competitions. Also, I am probably not good enough to consistently shoot close to 1" at 100 yards with any rifle lol.

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Gun should arrive today. Woo!

However...

...now I am also looking at the Miroku Winchester 1873. Someone stop me!

 

It is chambered in more reasonable calibers like .45 Colt (which means you can also go shorter and lighter), it is $500-700 cheaper than the 1886 was, and (best of all) no tang safety or rebounding hammer nonsense! If I would have known that last detail I might have gone with the 1873 over the 1886 first. Oh well. Too late now. I guess I'll just have to get both :P
 

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did you get yours yet Yoldog?

 

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5 hours ago, yo1dog said:

 no tang safety or rebounding hammer nonsense!

 

While you are correct about the tang and hammer the 73s do still have a non-traditional safety in the bolt and firing pin.  Not a big deal to some people but it is just another unnecessary safety in my books. 

73 firing pin.jpg

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sorry , i looked at the photos and thought you bought it , now i see the reasons you have not , i also see the communication issues , there are others 

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You need the Miroku 73 in addition to not instead of. There is no rational reason to only have one cowboy rifle.

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I think you made a great choice on the Winchester.  It is handsome.  I have a Browning 1886 Saddle ring  carbine.  I stripped the old Browning finish off the wood and had it hand checkered in the Winchester "H" pattern and refinished in Winchester "Red".  It is a favorite of mine.   One word of advice, do not shoot the Hornady "Leverevolution  45-70s in your rifle as they will knock your socks off.  I still have 18 in my box!  I fired one and could not believe they kicked that much!. I tried one more and quit shooting them .  I hunt with Remington 300 gr jacketed ammo.  Irish Pat  sass 19486 

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11 hours ago, Lead Friend, SASS #53635 said:

You need the Miroku 73 in addition to not instead of. There is no rational reason to only have one cowboy rifle.

 

I agree :)

 

So I got it last night and boy is she a looker! The wife loves it too. It may be her new favorite. My crappy pictures don't do it justice. The grain and case hardening is beautiful. Can't wait to shoot it!
 

2 hours ago, Irish-Pat said:

One word of advice, do not shoot the Hornady "Leverevolution  45-70s in your rifle as they will knock your socks off.  I still have 18 in my box!  I fired one and could not believe they kicked that much!. I tried one more and quit shooting them .  I hunt with Remington 300 gr jacketed ammo.


I ordered some HSM Bear Load +P 430 grain. Just for fun. Got some 300 grain from my LGS.

IMG_20181017_172723.jpg

IMG_20181017_172851.jpg

IMG_20181017_172957.jpg

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congrats! it is gorgeous! Kinda glad we didn't get together on mine.......

See if you can find some cowboy loads somewhere for that. the milder recoil will make you able to shoot it more. Not sure if Bullets by Scarlett offers them in 45-70 but it would be worth a look.

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Might try this and get a Kick Killer pad if the recoil is harsh.

C34AC71F-403F-4FA5-82D4-12A8F31DA041.png

Edited by Canton Chris

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3 hours ago, yo1dog said:

I ordered some HSM Bear Load +P 430 grain.

 

Those loads will kick harder than the Hornady Leveroution ammo does.  Those +P loads are overkill for anything in North America except for maybe a Grizzy charging straight at you. In that case make the first shot count because a follow up shot is going to be slow due to recovering from the recoil.

 

They are also likely not safe in your firearm. They list the Marlin 1895 as safe for this ammo yet I have seen plenty of pictures of 1895s that have failed due to hot ammo. I also wouldn't shoot it in a vintage or reproduction 1885 high Wall

 

From HSM Website

 

Quote

As with the 45 Colt, the 45-70 cartridge goes back a long way. There are still many vintage and of course replica firearms available in this chambering.

It also is officially a low pressure round and only select firearms are capable of handling the pressures of modern +P ammunition including our Bear Load.

Firearms capable of shooting our 45-70 +P ammunition:

Marlin 1895
Ruger #1
Browning 1885 High Wall

Keep in mind that some lever action firearms may have problems with loading and/or feeding cartridges using the longer heavier bullets in the more powerful ammunition.

We get a lot of inquiries about firearms not listed. Unfortunately, we do not have any information about the suitability and safety of using +P ammunition in any other firearms. That is a determination that only the firearm manufacturer can make. If a firearm manufacturer goes on record stating their firearm can safely use +P ammunition we will add that model to our list.

One of the manufacturer’s responses we have seen (and received ourselves) is that +P is safe as long as it is within SAAMI pressure specs. This is a CYA response as +P (plus pressure) would by definition exceed SAAMI MAXIMUM average pressure of 28,000 CUP.

Because there are modern firearms that can safely shoot more powerful ammunition than the SAAMI limits, the firearm/ammunition industry has recognized three levels of ammunition for the 45-70. (Refer to Hodgdon’s load data.)

The first level is up to the actual SAAMI limit of 28,000 CUP. This is safe for vintage trapdoor and replica firearms when no other information is available.

The second level can reach up to 40,000 CUP which far exceeds the SAAMI limit. This can only be used in the above listed firearms. This is the level of our +P ammunition.

The third level pushes the pressures up to 50,000 CUP. We do not manufacture this level of ammunition at this time.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Sedalia Dave
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3 minutes ago, Sedalia Dave said:

 

Those loads will kick harder than the Hornady Leveroution ammo does.  Those +P loads are overkill for anything in North America except for maybe a Grizzy charging straight at you. In that case make the first shot count because a follow up shot is going to be slow due to recovering from the recoil.

 

 


Yea that's kinda the point. Just for fun. Maybe a little masochistic, but fun nonetheless :lol:

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5 minutes ago, yo1dog said:


Yea that's kinda the point. Just for fun. Maybe a little masochistic, but fun nonetheless :lol:

 

Read what I added to by original post

 

BTW the Hornady Leveroution ammo does meet SAAMI specs

Edited by Sedalia Dave

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8 minutes ago, yo1dog said:

Interesting. Thanks for the info. The 1886 actions are supposed to be very strong, right? At least one guy says +P is fine in his Winchester 1886.

If you look at Hodgon's web site for 45-70 loads for example, you will see three "classes" of loads.  The lightest are for Trapdoor type rifles, the next heavier are for "lever action" rifles and the most powerful are for "modern sporting rifles.  The 1886 action is a strong action, but loads meant for Ruger No. 1 rifles, for example, are not recommended.

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25 minutes ago, yo1dog said:

Interesting. Thanks for the info. The 1886 actions are supposed to be very strong, right? At least one guy says +P is fine in his Winchester 1886.

 

I prefer to read and follow my owners manual.

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1 hour ago, Sedalia Dave said:

 

I prefer to read and follow my owners manual.

 

I will consult mine and see what it says. If it doesn't have anything specific I'll just skip the +P loads.

I am glad I brought it up. Am I good to use anything that is not a +P load?

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17 hours ago, yo1dog said:

 

I will consult mine and see what it says. If it doesn't have anything specific I'll just skip the +P loads.

I am glad I brought it up. Am I good to use anything that is not a +P load?

The 1886 action will handle any factory ammo that I am aware of.  I have never seen factory manufactured ammo that is loaded to Ruger only levels.  Most are trapdoor level stuff.  Some ammo is only meant for modern actions like your 1886, Marlin 95s and Ruger single shots. 

Edited by July Smith

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1 hour ago, July Smith said:

The 1886 action will handle any factory ammo that I am aware of.

 

Including +P?

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My daddy used to say to me, “Lead, you ain’t got enough time to make all the mistakes so you would do well to learn from those who have already made them.” 

 

There is a lot of collective wisdom here on the wire. You would do well to heed it. Stay away from the +Ps. They won’t be fun and they might be worse than that.

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2 hours ago, yo1dog said:

 

Including +P?

Just because the action is made to modern standards for modern ammo doesn't mean you should work your equipment that hard.  Your new rifle isn't going to be happy and neither is your shoulder.

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I hope I am not giving the impression that I really want to shoot +P. That is not the case. I am happy to forgo it (especially if there is any risk of damaging the rifle). I was curious though since I already bought it.

I appreciate all the insight!

 

21 hours ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

Make sure you use a rod guide to protect the muzzle when cleaning.

OLG

 

I already have a .45 muzzle guide, so I should be good to go on that front!

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That style action is about the strongest lever action ever made.

Take your Aspirin, and enjoy the +P loads. ;):lol:

OLG

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2 minutes ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

That style action is about the strongest lever action ever made.

Take your Aspirin, and enjoy the +P loads. ;):lol:

OLG

I have a Marlin 1895 in .450 Marlin that would probably be equivalent to a +P 45-70 round.  6 rds and my shoulder wasn't at all happy.  The most anyone could stand it was 8 rounds.  The heavier'86 will help but have some Advil handy :-)

 

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Well, dad-gum...I didn't realize my Chiappa was a piece of junk, until I read the posts here.  Mine has awesome wood, with a great grain, and the casehardening also looks great.  Of course it may just be an acid wash, like they use on the Ruger's, and not real case-hardening.   

On mine, the action is tight, and seems to function well, and is accurate.  No tang safety, which I like.  Not sure what more I would need in a rifle, than looking good, and being accurate.  This one I have was imported by Cimarron. 

I guess now that I have read that these Chiappa '86's are junk, I will need to make a boat anchor out of mine, and use it on the bass boat. Of course, I am sure the Browning '86's might make a better boat anchor. 

 

 

   

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After an agonizing delay I finally got to shoot her. It was a blast! Couldn't help but chuckle after every shot.

 

Again, this is my first lever action so I don't have much to compare it to. That said, the action was easy and smooth (and fun!). Trigger pull was fine. Rebounding hammer gave me no trouble (no failures of any kind). All those things I worried about don't seem to actually be an issue at all. It shoots great!

You guys had me hyped up for the recoil and I was a bit... relived? disappointed? It was not bad at all. Shot a box of 300 grain and 10 or so rounds of the +P 430 grain bear loads. Shoulder was fine. It's a heavy rifle (9lbs) so that helps.

Thanks for the help everyone. I love my Winchester and am very happy with the purchase. I still owe you guys better pictures.

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The FTF from the rebound hammer comes after a bit when the hammer's coil spring takes a set.

Keep an eye out for shallow FP hits on the primer.

OLG

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You may not want to hear this, I shoot a historically incorrect Marlin Cowboy.

It has:

Shotgun butt.

Smith barrel sight for Long Range.

Red dot sight for hunting.

3 parts takedown for breach cleaning (I shoot BP only).

Relatively light for hunting (shotgun butt).

 

I  wanted to get a Browning 1886.  I am glad I got a Marlin.

 

Uriah

 

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