.357 Long Range

[Zeb Gray, #36839]

I just found a Rossi 1892 in .357 to use for long range matches (200+).  I'd like to bump up the velocity using heavier 140 - 158 grain bullets.  What should my limits be using hard cast bullets?  Do I need to go to gas checked bullets?  Can coated bullets substitute for gas checks?  I'm also open to powder suggestions. 

 

I shoot .38 Special for CAS & have shot a lot of long range with various lower velocity .45 Colt pistol caliber, big bore lever & single shot calibers, but I'm inexperienced with .357 at over 1200 fps in the rifle.  Appreciate any help.  Thanks. 

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

What does your reloading manual show?

The target will tell you what to do.

Some info here-

http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/reloading-education/tips-and-tricks/cowboy-action-loads

 

OLG

[July Smith]

I have had best accuracy in my 357 carbine using 158gr-170gr.  Coated and traditional bullets performed better with gas checks for me.   2400 is my preferred smokeless powder for the 357 Magnum. 

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

5 minutes ago, July Smith said:

I have had best accuracy in my 357 carbine using 158gr-170gr.  Coated and traditional bullets performed better with gas checks for me.   2400 is my preferred smokeless powder for the 357 Magnum. 

Have you tried H-110 powder?

OLG

[Sedalia Dave]

Start by reading these. They were written by people that actually know something.  Look into Elmer Keith's books. Same goes for Phillip Sharp and  Glen E. Fryxell.

 

From Ingot to Target; A Cast Bullet Guide for Handgunners.

 

A Few Comments on Cast Bullet Alloys
 

High quality, properly sized bullets and the right lube are the corner stones of successfully shooting precision long range cast bullets. To achieve this you are going to have to learn the fine are of bullet casting.

[Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971]

I have some flyers without gas checks.  I do use W296/H-110 like OLG suggests.  I'll be shooting these out to ~300 yards at our state match on Friday.  I'm using LaserCast bullets for this event.

[July Smith]

1 hour ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

Have you tried H-110 powder?

OLG

Yes.  Its a good powder for max loads but I found 2400 to be more accurate. 

[July Smith]

I might suggest at least trying a few loads that are just below the sound barrier (1126fps).  A good subsonic load around 1050-1100fps can prove to be surprisingly accurate at longer ranges once you learn how much they are dropping.  The higher velocity loads that leave the barrel at supersonic speeds but drop below the sound barrier seem to become unstable and lose accuracy, at least in my experience. 

[Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971]

10 minutes ago, July Smith said:

I might suggest at least trying a few loads that are just below the sound barrier (1126fps).  A good subsonic load around 1050-1100fps can prove to be surprisingly accurate at longer ranges once you learn how much they are dropping.  The higher velocity loads that leave the barrel at supersonic speeds but drop below the sound barrier seem to become unstable and lose accuracy, at least in my experience. 

I have a small quantity of 2400  got from my late father's estate.  I'll give it a try.

[John Boy]

http://reloadammo.com/357loads.htm

[Judge Gardner]

You still should keep them under 1400 fps if you are shooting a sass match. I would go with 2400 and a good hard lub like Thompson Blue angle  or there red lube Call them Rody will help you out.  You should cast the bullets to so you can control every thing.

[evil dogooder]

Zeb. You may be overthinking it.   You've seen where we shoot long range from at Kimball.  From the tent to the back berm is just under 200.  My main match rifle and loads hit just fine at that range.   Mindy used to have a 92 that we ran 158s with  banging the back targets was easy with stock sights.  

[Boulder Canyon Bob# 32052L]

5 minutes ago, evil dogooder said:

Zeb. You may be overthinking it.   You've seen where we shoot long range from at Kimball.  From the tent to the back berm is just under 200.  My main match rifle and loads hit just fine at that range.   Mindy used to have a 92 that we ran 158s with  banging the back targets was easy with stock sights.  

Yeah, but Enderlin has a 250 yd target for pistol caliber rifle.

[Zeb Gray, #36839]

Thanks all.  I've read the manuals.  Just asking for a good place to start for long range .357.  Thanks for suggestions. 

 

I'm familiar with Enderlin, Kimball & Morristown's distances.  My Redwood Regulators range has targets out to 800 yds., though pistol caliber only to 2-300 unless we really want to play. 

 

Still curious if coated bullets could substitute for gas check lead? 

[Duffield, SASS #23454]

I suggest using the heavier bullets, 173 to 200 grains, loaded to about 1200 fps muzzle velocity.

H110 or Allaint 2400 would be good powders, Unique is a possibility. Check your manuals, the older Lyman manuals have some good heavy bullet loads.

 

Duffield

[Judge Gardner]

I have tried them for 45/70 they are very  bad!  they take bullet that is not to bad and run them though a cement mixer to put the coating on.

 

 

[Ace_of_Hearts]

On 9/18/2018 at 9:41 AM, Zeb Gray, #36839 said:

I just found a Rossi 1892 in .357 to use for long range matches (200+).  I'd like to bump up the velocity using heavier 140 - 158 grain bullets.  What should my limits be using hard cast bullets?  Do I need to go to gas checked bullets?  Can coated bullets substitute for gas checks?  I'm also open to powder suggestions. 

 

I shoot .38 Special for CAS & have shot a lot of long range with various lower velocity .45 Colt pistol caliber, big bore lever & single shot calibers, but I'm inexperienced with .357 at over 1200 fps in the rifle.  Appreciate any help.  Thanks. 

Penn Bullets rates their premium grade alloy to 1600fps.

http://www.pennbullets.com/38/38-caliber.html

 

[Zeb Gray, #36839]

Thanks Ace & Duffield. 

[Sedalia Dave]

On ‎9‎/‎19‎/‎2018 at 11:50 AM, Zeb Gray, #36839 said:

Thanks all.  I've read the manuals.  Just asking for a good place to start for long range .357.  Thanks for suggestions. 

 

I'm familiar with Enderlin, Kimball & Morristown's distances.  My Redwood Regulators range has targets out to 800 yds., though pistol caliber only to 2-300 unless we really want to play. 

 

Still curious if coated bullets could substitute for gas check lead? 

 

There was some talk on BPCR.net about using coated bullets.  Don't think they were very successful because if inconsistancies in weight and symmetry.

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

On 9/18/2018 at 2:09 PM, GARDNER KID said:

You still should keep them under 1400 fps if you are shooting a sass match. I would go with 2400 and a good hard lub like Thompson Blue angle  or there red lube Call them Rody will help you out.  You should cast the bullets to so you can control every thing.

The 1400fps SASS rule does not apply to side matches. 

OLG

[Judge Gardner]

That is  really not defined  one way or other.

[Sedalia Dave]

10 minutes ago, GARDNER KID said:

That is  really not defined  one way or other.

 

SHB page 25, RO I pg 21, 

 

 

Quote

Pocket pistols, derringers, and long-range rifles are exempt from the power factor and velocity requirements.

 

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

TNX Sedalia Dave. 

Just get'n ready to post the same information you did, confirming my earlier post.

OLG

[Judge Gardner]

OK I was wrong 

[Rancho Roy]

Are gas checks allowed in long range side matches?

[Tyrel Cody]

3 hours ago, Rancho Roy said:

Are gas checks allowed in long range side matches?

Yes. Page 30 of the shooter's handbook:

 

"Regardless of category or caliber, bullets used in long range and precision rifle 
matches must be made of pure lead or lead ally having a plain base, gas checked, 
or paper patched configuration."

 

 

Long range only though.

[Big Timber SASS #19724Life]

Lazer cast 180 gainers and 4227 have been match winners, for me in my marlin ,both in SASS and IHMSA