pistol squid and possible recovery?

[Cheyenne Ranger, 48747L]

revolvers only concern here, shooting at two locations

 

1st pistol:  all 5 shots go boom, reholster--life is good

 

2nd pistol at next window:  Bang, Squib.  done with that one 4 misses as it should be

 

question:

could I have unloaded the squib pistol to get at the unfired rounds, grounded the pistol on the shelf, drawn the first pistol, unloaded the fired cartridges and then with the 3 cartridges from the first pistol and 1 off my belt reloaded the first pistol with 4 rounds and picked up on second target of the 2nd pistol's string?

 

Only reason I would do this is to keep working on clean match as I usually am about 3/4 of the way down the overall list on the best of days.

 

did shoot the other 5 stages clean which means I still didn't have a clean match

 

[Irish Pat]

Not at my club.

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

2 minutes ago, Irish-Pat said:

Not at my club.

Why?

Seen it done a few times.

OLG

[Hoss]

you can reload other pistol (unless club rules forbid) would not even have to unload first pistol if you had enough ammo on body to do the reloading with. just be sure to audibly declare it "BROKE GUN" before you set it down. 

[Colorado Coffinmaker]

I don't see any reason why not.  Very time consuming but also very doable.  I am however, really too lazy right now to go look up all the various "whys" and "what if's" in the rule books.  AS long as you don't have two loaded revolvers out of leather at the same time??  Understand though, while your doing all this, the Peanut Gallery will be jumping up ad down waving their arms and screaming atcha 

[Dutch Wheeler]

Chalk it up to an unfortunate learning experience, add an RCBS Powder Lock-Out die to your press, and eliminate that from happening again.

[Creeker, SASS #43022]

No need to unload pistol two (assuming you have sufficient ammo to complete stage on body).

 

Declare malfunction and make safe.

Draw pistol one, clear empties as needed, load from body, (again assuming you have ammo) complete stage.

 

After the first round goes down range, you own the stage and must be allowed to complete the stage (safely) to the best of your abilities.

 

If I were TO; I would NOT allow you to unload pistol two on the firing line as I am not going to allow you to cock a hammer (Colts/ clones) or advance the cylinder (Ruger) over the squibbed barrel on the firing line or on the clock (potential for unsafe gun handling). 

 

But using your other pistol and ammo from body...

All approved equipment

Initially loaded at the loading table

Carried to the line legally

 

I can see no reason why you could not legally and safely continue your stage.

[Colorado Coffinmaker]

BIG HUGE PLUS ONE to CREEKER!!

[J-BAR #18287]

+1 to Creeker.

 

Many times a squibbed bullet will lodge between the cylinder and barrel and prevent the cylinder from being rotated, so the malfunctioning revolver probably could not be unloaded anyway. 

[Jefro, SASS#69420]

26 minutes ago, Colorado Coffinmaker said:

BIG HUGE PLUS ONE to CREEKER!!

Yep +3. Declare malfunction-ground it. Load 4 in other pistol for a clean match

[Sedalia Dave]

1 hour ago, J-BAR #18287 said:

+1 to Creeker.

 

Many times a squibbed bullet will lodge between the cylinder and barrel and prevent the cylinder from being rotated, so the malfunctioning revolver probably could not be unloaded anyway. 

 

9 out of 10 pistol squibs probably result in this condition.

[PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L]

^^^^^^^

What they all said.

 

Quote

SASS matches above the club level are “no alibi” matches.  Once the first round goes down range, the competitor is committed to the stage and must finish the stage to the best of his or her ability.

SHB p.20

 

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

Had a t'bar break in my Ruger on the first shot, declared 'broke-gun' and benched it.

Drew 2nd Ruger and when done, did the reload-SLO as could be-Finished with a clean match.

OLG

 

[Cheyenne Ranger, 48747L]

thanks to all--of course this occured to me during the night after the match.

 

to clarify:

squib was far enough down barrel so the ruger cylinder could be rotated while hammer was down--no need to cock ruger vaquero to get cylinder to turn.

 

only had three on body (that will change from here on out) so needed one from broke pistol

 

Now to make sure that doesn't happen again!!!

 

 

[Creeker, SASS #43022]

34 minutes ago, Cheyenne Ranger, 48747L said:

to clarify:

squib was far enough down barrel so the ruger cylinder could be rotated while hammer was down--no need to cock ruger vaquero to get cylinder to turn.

only had three on body (that will change from here on out) so needed one from broke pistol

In the middle of a stage - as TO - My job is to "safely" assist you thru the stage. 

(Right or wrong), I'm not allowing the continued handling of a declared "Broken" or "Malfunction" firearm.

And I am not going to bother identifying the "Brand" of revolver before I step in (and brand aside;  plenty of Rugers in our game are  three screw models or half cock conversions, etc.)  

The potential for a dangerous situation outweighs your desire for a clean match.

If you cannot (or choose to not) complete the stage by utilizing only rounds from your body and the "non broken" firearm - then I'm sorry.

 

[Cheyenne Ranger, 48747L]

52 minutes ago, Creeker, SASS #43022 said:

In the middle of a stage - as TO - My job is to "safely" assist you thru the stage. 

(Right or wrong), I'm not allowing the continued handling of a declared "Broken" or "Malfunction" firearm.

And I am not going to bother identifying the "Brand" of revolver before I step in (and brand aside;  plenty of Rugers in our game are  three screw models or half cock conversions, etc.)  

The potential for a dangerous situation outweighs your desire for a clean match.

If you cannot (or choose to not) complete the stage by utilizing only rounds from your body and the "non broken" firearm - then I'm sorry.

 

as an RO this is certainly your right to run the stage as you see fit

I would follow your directions as RO

[Creeker, SASS #43022]

8 minutes ago, Cheyenne Ranger, 48747L said:

as an RO this is certainly your right to run the stage as you see fit

I would follow your directions as RO

I didn't mean for that to sound as snarky as it perhaps did.

I was just explaining my justification for stopping a shooter - even if a certain piece of equipment may allow the safe unloading - too many would not.

Hard to make that call under duress.

[Cheyenne Ranger, 48747L]

51 minutes ago, Creeker, SASS #43022 said:

I didn't mean for that to sound as snarky as it perhaps did.

I was just explaining my justification for stopping a shooter - even if a certain piece of equipment may allow the safe unloading - too many would not.

Hard to make that call under duress.

 

didn't take it as such

just was explaining what I had envisioned doing 

fully understand where you are coming from

 

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

CR-I as a T/O, would not let the shooter handle a DECLARED 'broken gun', that I know is loaded in this case(squib). As it would be very easy for the shooter(or 'I')to get the 2 guns mixed up........

Just ain't worth it, IMO.

Respectfully,

OLG

[Cowboy Junky]

I sure wouldn't go to the trouble to shoot a gun with a squib and empties in it when you have a perfectly good one without any issues right there as well. 

[Rafe Conager SASS #56958]

Ok I'm kind of a noobi at ROing so please be gentle, how could anyone get a clean match with a squib? The shooter would have fired a round causing the squib, thus if reloading rounds to keep clean match he/she would have used 11 rounds to hit 10 targets. Do they not count the squib round even though it didn't leave the barrel? It did go off and traveled in the direction of down range.

Rafe

[Jefro, SASS#69420]

53 minutes ago, Rafe Conager SASS #56958 said:

Ok I'm kind of a noobi at ROing so please be gentle, how could anyone get a clean match with a squib? The shooter would have fired a round causing the squib, thus if reloading rounds to keep clean match he/she would have used 11 rounds to hit 10 targets. Do they not count the squib round even though it didn't leave the barrel? It did go off and traveled in the direction of down range.

Rafe

Howdy, has to leave the barrel to count as down range.

[Hairtrigger Hayes]

22 hours ago, Dutch Wheeler said:

Chalk it up to an unfortunate learning experience, add an RCBS Powder Lock-Out die to your press, and eliminate that from happening again.

The RCBS Powder Lock-out die has saved my bacon more than once.  When the machine locks up you know you've got a powder supply issue.  Probably the smartest re-loading investment I've ever made.

 

In regards to the original question:  No problem as long as you declare broke gun before you abandon that pistol on the stage.  You sure might have trouble unloading that pistol depending on where the squib is.  If it's lodged between cylinder and forcing cone that plan won't work...and besides, it would take an excessively long time to unload one and then load another.  Carry plenty of extra ammo on your belt and load from there.  Big question.  Is it  quicker than four misses???...I doubt it.  But if you're protecting a clean match, why not?  And it would be a real hoot to watch someone go to that length to stay clean on a stage!!!

[Rafe Conager SASS #56958]

29 minutes ago, Jefro, SASS#69420 said:

Howdy, has to leave the barrel to count as down range.

Thanks now I know 

Rafe 

[Too Tall Bob]

That’s all well and good but I still want to know what a “Pistol Squid” looks like. (Just pulling yer chain pard!”

[Cheyenne Ranger, 48747L]

8 hours ago, Hairtrigger Hayes said:

The RCBS Powder Lock-out die has saved my bacon more than once.  When the machine locks up you know you've got a powder supply issue.  Probably the smartest re-loading investment I've ever made.

 

 

I've heard good things about the powder lock out die but the SDB isn't built to use it.  SBD has own dies that aren't interchangeable with normal dies

 

thanks for thinking of it though

[Cheyenne Ranger, 48747L]

1 hour ago, Too Tall Bob said:

That’s all well and good but I still want to know what a “Pistol Squid” looks like. (Just pulling yer chain pard!”

 

It's simply a squid with 8 pistols, one in each arm and the two tentacles hold a rifle.  

[Shooting Bull]

Dang, Too Tall Bob beat me to the punch line.

 

And by the way, a pistol squid is four Gunfighters shooting all at once.

[Too Tall Bob]

Look out boys!  It’s Billy the Squid!!

[Frontier Lone Rider]

Just another reason to buy Schofields.  The break top action sure allows for faster reloads.

[Cheyenne Ranger, 48747L]

On 3/29/2018 at 7:17 AM, Cowboy Junky said:

I sure wouldn't go to the trouble to shoot a gun with a squib and empties in it when you have a perfectly good one without any issues right there as well. 

 

didn't say I was going to shoot the squibbed revolver (is squibbed even a word?)

was going to take the unfired cartridges out of it so I would have enough to reload the second pistol to finish out the revolver string

I like clean matches but not enough to jeopardize the folks around me as well as the revolver--after all it's only a game 

[Cheyenne Ranger, 48747L]

13 hours ago, Lone Rider, SASS# 73063 said:

Just another reason to buy Schofields.  The break top action sure allows for faster reloads.

 

that would sure do it but would you run into the problem of handling a 'broke' revolver after it was declared dead?  

 

Plan plan would have worked EXCEPT for that and THAT is a pretty big problem--these days if you don't follow the RO's directions I think you can get a MDQ.  (it was explained to me if the RO yells STOP and you don't, you're going home)

[Dutch Wheeler]

17 hours ago, Too Tall Bob said:

That’s all well and good but I still want to know what a “Pistol Squid” looks like. (Just pulling yer chain pard!”

 

[Colorado Coffinmaker]

Plus One Dutch.  Really want to see that "Pistol Squib" in action!!  

[Sixgun Seamus]

On 3/29/2018 at 10:39 AM, Hairtrigger Hayes said:

The RCBS Powder Lock-out die has saved my bacon more than once.  When the machine locks up you know you've got a powder supply issue.  Probably the smartest re-loading investment I've ever made.

+1000