38 special load question

[Noz]

I am recently returned to the smokeless side and have bee loading 38 special with Tightgroup at 70% of listed max loads.  Nice load, snappy but easily controllable.

I seem to be getting a lot of fouling on the outside of the cases.  Do I need to beef my load up to get better case expansion?

 

Sorry about the double tap.

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

Use a different powder like WW231/HP-38 for a cleaner burn.

If you want the Unique powder load I load for my Wife, PM me.

OLG

[Rye Miles #13621]

I use Tite-Group as well and I don't notice a lot of fouling on the outside of the cases, maybe some but I just tumble 'em reload!! 

 

I'll pm you what I use.

 

Rye

[Smuteye John SASS#24774]

How heavy is your crimp?

 

If it's light, changing to a heavier crimp will delay the bullet pull slightly and allow the brass to expand to the chamber walls more and improve the seal.

[J-BAR #18287]

If you like your present load otherwise, I would live with it.

 

Increasing powder charge or bullet weight in an effort to expand the case more will increase recoil a bit.  Changing to thinner walled brass (Winchester used to be the thinnest but I don't know anymore...) will allow easier case expansion but probably at the expense of case life.

 

The outside soot comes off my brass in my vibratory tumbler with corncob media, so it's shiny  by the time it is reloaded.  I'm not offended by it on either BP or smokeless cases.

[Noz]

OLG: I'm using your 12 ga Unique load and really like it, but I have some Tightgroup that I need to use up.

 

Rye, thanks for the PM

 

Smuteye John, I crimp tight enough that the bullet squeals.

 

Twin, you know I need something else to worry about at least once a week.

 

General consensus is that I'll live with the smudges on the brass at least until I get the Tightgroup used up

[Moose Wesson]

Whats the bullet weight, style, and material?

[Marshal Dan Troop 70448]

As Lumpy, I only use HP38.  Clean with never a problem.  MT

[Noz]

1 hour ago, Moose Wesson said:

Whats the bullet weight, style, and material?

lead 110grs Truncated cone

[Abilene Slim SASS 81783]

I'm amused that a longtime soot lord is now concerned with smudgy cases from smokeless powder. Now go have some Jamesons until you regain some perspective.  

[Blackwater 53393]

3 hours ago, Abilene Slim SASS 81783 said:

I'm amused that a longtime soot lord is now concerned with smudgy cases from smokeless powder. Now go have some Jamesons until you regain some perspective.  

 

Slim’s got the right idea!!!

[Noz]

9 hours ago, Blackwater 53393 said:

 

Slim’s got the right idea!!!

but?  I need something to worry about. I know I'm concerned about breaking my transfer bars.,

[Capt. James H. Callahan]

231 has been my sole powder for light loads and even some +P type to make major in .357 when I shot IPSC revolver. Have used it as far back as when it was 230. Never had any complaints. If it ain't broke don't fix it says I!

JHC

[Jabez Cowboy,SASS # 50129]

Noz ,,, What's Transfer Bars ???

Is they busses that move you from one Bar to da Next ???

 

If Colt thought more parts were needed in a SAA type gun ,,,,,,,,,,,,, He would have put them in there .

 

Have You lost the Faith ???  Gone over to the Slippery down-slope to Gamer- Ship....

 

Jabez Cowboy

[Noz]

Jabez, my right thumb(right handed) has been dislocated several times and it finally announced that it's days of shooting dualist were over. My thinking was: If I can't shoot dualist then I am out of Frontiersman. If I can't shoot Frontiersman then I don't need to be shooting my ROA tanks. If I'm going to shoot two handed then I need a pair of guns that lend themselves to that style.  If I'm going to shoot RNV two handed, why handicap myself further by shooting black powder.  Besides 38 Specials with black is kinda silly.

Therefore I have fallen from grace into the evil realm of smokeless powder.

[J-BAR #18287]

27 minutes ago, Noz said:

Besides 38 Specials with black is kinda silly.

 

Not the first time in my life that I’ve enjoyed being silly.    

[Badger Mountain Charlie SASS #43172]

48 minutes ago, Noz said:

Jabez, my right thumb(right handed) has been dislocated several times and it finally announced that it's days of shooting dualist were over. My thinking was: If I can't shoot dualist then I am out of Frontiersman. If I can't shoot Frontiersman then I don't need to be shooting my ROA tanks. If I'm going to shoot two handed then I need a pair of guns that lend themselves to that style.  If I'm going to shoot RNV two handed, why handicap myself further by shooting black powder.  Besides 38 Specials with black is kinda silly.

Therefore I have fallen from grace into the evil realm of smokeless powder.

Welcome to the BRIGHT SIDE, Noz. 

[Rooster Ron Wayne]

Like OLG .

I like Unique Powder .

You can load about anything with Unique .

And if your Not trying to make Magnum loads .

Unique works good for light to light magnum loads .

Personally Im Not a Fan of Tightgroup or Trailboss powder .

Anything you can load with them you can load with Unique for less Money .

Rooster 

 

[Noz]

I've already found that I do not like Trailboss.  I have no real quarrel with Tightgroup. In a previous era I loaded for heavy handguns with W296, H110, Little Gun, 4227, Green Dot, Unique and Bullseye.  My go to loads were Bullseye, Unique and W296.

[Abilene Slim SASS 81783]

10 hours ago, Noz said:

Therefore I have fallen from grace into the evil realm of smokeless powder.

Once a Soot Lord, always a Soot Lord. There is no falling from grace.

[Gateway Kid SASS# 70038 Life]

If cost is an object then check out powder valley and do some math

tight group = 127.50 for 8 pounds (127.50/8/7000 = .022767 per grain) 15.9375 per pound

unique = 132.95 for 8 pounds (132.95/8/7000 = .023741 per grain) 16.61875 per pound

tight group 68 cents less per pound

my lyman manuals do not list a 110 gr bullet but using their minimums for a 120 gr bullet

tight group = 8.65178 per round with 1842 rounds per pound or 14,736 per keg

unique = 9.49642 per round with 1750 rounds per pound or 14,000 per keg

tight group .84464 per round less

tight group gets 92 more rounds per pound or 736 more per keg

The alliant site and the hogden site have even bigger differences in charge weight with a corresponding bigger difference between the two powders using 125 gr bullets (or larger)

So how does one figure that unique is cheaper? (unless of course one is using "off the books" loads which most of the "wise ones" do not recommend)

 

Just curious

 

Regards

 

  

 

Gateway Kid

 

[Jabez Cowboy,SASS # 50129]

He might still have some Old Stock Unique bought at Say 3 dollars a pound ....  Some Do ...

 

Jabez Cowboy

[Kingair]

2 hours ago, Gateway Kid SASS# 70038 Life said:

If cost is an object then check out powder valley and do some math

tight group = 127.50 for 8 pounds (127.50/8/7000 = .022767 per grain) 15.9375 per pound

unique = 132.95 for 8 pounds (132.95/8/7000 = .023741 per grain) 16.61875 per pound

tight group 68 cents less per pound

my lyman manuals do not list a 110 gr bullet but using their minimums for a 120 gr bullet

tight group = 8.65178 per round with 1842 rounds per pound or 14,736 per keg

unique = 9.49642 per round with 1750 rounds per pound or 14,000 per keg

tight group .84464 per round less

tight group gets 92 more rounds per pound or 736 more per keg

The alliant site and the hogden site have even bigger differences in charge weight with a corresponding bigger difference between the two powders using 125 gr bullets (or larger)

So how does one figure that unique is cheaper? (unless of course one is using "off the books" loads which most of the "wise ones" do not recommend)

 

Just curious

 

Regards

 

  

 

Gateway Kid

 

 

I like your numbers - and if we can save a buck - combined with the right performance - I am all ears !

 

I am one of those rookies who still listens . . . 

 

I just paid $ 19.99 per lbs (on Black Friday at Brownells) for Titegroup (only ordered 2 lbs to give it a shot) but also got a extra $ 10.00 discount on my complete order + $ 0.00 HAZMAT + $ 0.01 shipping

[Noz]

9 hours ago, Abilene Slim SASS 81783 said:

Once a Soot Lord, always a Soot Lord. There is no falling from grace.

I think you are probably correct.  The mental part is still active, the physical part has bowed to the ravages of time.

[Capt. James H. Callahan]

57 minutes ago, Noz said:

I think you are probably correct.  The mental part is still active, the physical part has bowed to the ravages of time.

I kinda ran up against that too. Used to LOVE my short barreled .45 LC Vaqueros loaded with a max load of FFg. Got to noticing my hands would be sore for a day or two after a match (I've got #$#$^ itty bitty woman's hands to start with. ).  Ended up shooting my .357's more than the beloved .45's.

JHC

[Rye Miles #13621]

21 hours ago, Noz said:

Jabez, my right thumb(right handed) has been dislocated several times and it finally announced that it's days of shooting dualist were over. My thinking was: If I can't shoot dualist then I am out of Frontiersman. If I can't shoot Frontiersman then I don't need to be shooting my ROA tanks. If I'm going to shoot two handed then I need a pair of guns that lend themselves to that style.  If I'm going to shoot RNV two handed, why handicap myself further by shooting black powder.  Besides 38 Specials with black is kinda silly.

Therefore I have fallen from grace into the evil realm of smokeless powder.

No need to explain why you went to smokeless, I did after 8 years of BP and I'm so glad I went BACK to smokeless, easier to clean, shoot and it's cheaper, waaay cheaper! I went from .44-40 to .38 and I love shooting every bit as much as I did with BP! Have fun, oh and yea you'll be surprised at well you see the targets now, I can actually SEE MY MISSES!! 

[Gateway Kid SASS# 70038 Life]

7 hours ago, Kingair said:

 

I like your numbers - and if we can save a buck - combined with the right performance - I am all ears !

 

I am one of those rookies who still listens . . . 

 

I just paid $ 19.99 per lbs (on Black Friday at Brownells) for Titegroup (only ordered 2 lbs to give it a shot) but also got a extra $ 10.00 discount on my complete order + $ 0.00 HAZMAT + $ 0.01 shipping

I buy most of my primers and powder on line. I typically wait for free shipping/free hazmat deals then buy 20k primers (or more) and 16 to 32 pounds of powder. Generally from a single vendor. In my example both powders would be bought from the same company so did not think it necessary to include a factor that should be the same for both.

I have used unique in the past and it works well, switched to Titegroup 8 years ago and like it better. My opinion only, others have different experiences. My personal choices generally come from trying 4 or 5 pounds of a powder then another then another. Keeping good notes is the key.

Good luck in your SASS endeavors and welcome

 

Gateway Kid

[Kingair]

3 hours ago, Gateway Kid SASS# 70038 Life said:

I have used unique in the past and it works well, switched to Titegroup 8 years ago and like it better. 

 

Good luck in your SASS endeavors and welcome

 

Gateway Kid

 

Gonna give the Titegroup a try 

Did some 'research here and I read that a lot of shooters like it  

And pretty sure that this rookie will like it as well !