"Mass killings" in Australia

[Blackwater 53393]

I was reading some liberal screed begging for an "Australian style" confiscation scheme!  

 

An Australian commented on the article with this reply!!

 

 

Finally, if someone really wants to kill someone, they will find a way. Let’s look at the recent Cairns child killings in Australia where someone killed 8 children with a knife. Or the Quaker Hill Nursing home arson in Australia that killed 11 by fire. Or the Lin killings, also in Australia, that killed 5 with a hammer.

 

Wonder why these incidents are hidden when they say that there haven't been "MASS KILLINGS" in OZ since the gun confiscation??

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

When there's the 'will', the 'way' will be found.......

OLG

[Major Crimes]

I have been asked to post some points on the above.

 

The link is a fair account of what has happened in Australia since the Batavia. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_massacres_in_Australia

 

I guess the point is that since our buy back there has been no "gun" "Mass Killings" (I am not sure what the definition of that is?)

 

Here is my view and take it for what it is worth.

 

You cant compare apples and oranges. Australia is a very different country of very different culture and back ground. 

 

Australia didn't fight for its Independence it was given to us by an Act of Parliament. We didn't fight a daily battle as settlers against Natives that were organised and bought up to the concepts of war and raiding. We fought and butchered nomad hunter gathers who still used throwing sticks as hunting implements and had only the spear and Woomera (a means of improving the effectiveness of a spear by increasing throwing speed).

 

We didn't have to carve out small homesteads and hold it and our families lives by our skill with a gun. Our nations homesteaders had police to call on and Bush rangers were generally one of your family and prayed on travelers and rich homesteaders not the isolated and weak (they were too poor to be worth robbing and were probably your kin or at least sympathetic and would give you shelter in desperate times).

 

As time went on our guns were a means of feeding ourselves when times were tough and nothing more. We do not have the same history and legend tied into our firearms as the USA.

 

So we come to Port Arthur and the buy back.

 

In Australia we made it harder (check our used gun sites there are still semi auto's for sale but yes you need very good reasons to buy them and most of us wouldn't bother trying) to get certain classes of guns for the average Joe. For those of us who do shoot (hunting or target) it is expensive and time consuming to get guns and we do have stringent laws about locking them up and the separation of guns and ammo. 

 

My background is a country boy who hunted rabbits and foxes for pocket money as a kid and nothing that has happened would stop that for my kids (if they wanted to but neither of my daughters are particularly interested:) ). I then joined the Army and have had my fill of firearms from 9mm sub machine guns thru to 105mm tank guns. 

 

Now I shoot cowboy (I hate punching paper and I love the immediate feedback of steel) I own some pretty 45/70's (an 1886, a Sharps and a Double Rifle) and a couple of C&B handguns (a 1851 and a 1861). I doubt I will ever buy a gun designed/built after 1900 ever again?

 

How do I feel about all that?

 

Pretty Bloody Happy!

 

Yes criminals get guns but here our criminals pretty much only kill one another (power to them and crack on I say). Our mass killers are generally killing their own family (this is sad and I wish any family murder/suicide would start with themselves) and need to resort to knives/hammers/fire/etc which is terrible but we need to deal with the art of the possible when it comes to stopping murder.

 

Finally and best of all for me it means for a Terrorist to get the sort of firepower where he can be a real problem he needs to deal with criminals and that increases the risk of detection remarkably here in Australia. So far we have picked most of them up before they have acted (two very sad exceptions) and where we haven't they had a 38spcl revolver and the other a cut down pump action 12g. 

 

To sum up.

 

Australians should worry about their country and their laws and what works here may not work anywhere else.

 

We live in democracies where we vote in or out the people who will make these decisions. If they change the laws and we don't like them we vote them out and get new people to do what we want. In Australia we the people supported the change and voted the people who made it back in.

 

That is Democracy!

 

America, it is your country and you need to make the decisions in accordance with your laws and customs. It is not my place, or anyone else, to comment or provide advice. You need to decide and you need to act in your own best interest.

 

God Bless us all.

 

 

 

 

[Rooster Ron Wayne]

Prayers for all.

Like OLG said .

If there is a will they will find a way .

Rooster 

[Blackwater 53393]

Thanks for the input, Major!!  The liberal news media here would have us believe that since the confiscation, NO mass murders have occurred, much less ANY that involved the use of firearms!!

 

What bothers me most in your situation is that since one "buy back/confiscation" was allowed, the next major incident would trigger another, more comprehensive taking of your firearms!!

 

As has been stated, this is how it was done, historically, in other places and times.

[Painted Mohawk SASS 77785]

Howdy Blackwater my friend, received your pm & will add my input to the topic you have raised.

Firstly my Aussie pard 'Major Crimes has raised many  issues that I agree with  relating to Australia as we were & what we are now & in particular I will mention a few things about our current gun laws.

I can remember as a 12=15 year old pedalling my push bike with rabbits strung out on a pole across my handlebars  & a shotgun over my shoulder, all types of firearms were around, in corners of the shed , on the wall, back of the car..people had them & nothing was said. Then gradually you could see little changes creeping in, questions by the do-gooders being asked & yes like everywhere else  gun related crimes were happening just as they had years before.

I'm not sure when pistol  registering was first introduced but I do know it has been around for a long time, however there was not  the caliber,  barrel length & magazine capacity restrictions that we have now. Long arm ownership was never a problem, you could buy whatever you wanted.

As a 17 y.o. I joined the Army in the earl 70's....probably in hindsight I should have waited as I was to learn that I had to be 19 to serve overseas !

In the early 90's there were rumblings by some politicians that guns were to readily available & something had to be done. It was even mentioned that it will take a massacre in Tasmania for the action to be taken !

Well that massacre did happen at Port Arthur in Tasmania & not long after licenses for gun owners & the registration of serial numbers took place.

If you google Port Arthur or Martin Bryant there is a lot of interesting reading.

Just let me say that there are a lot of corrupt Governments in this world so why would Australia be any different !

Law abiding gun owners have been the soft target here now for 20 years, whenever something gun related happens even if it is overseas they quickly look to another restriction.

All our guns & depending on how many you have  determines different storage requirements as in thickness of safe walls, security monitoring etc.

What authorities don't like is that gun ownership is continually on the rise, people are willing to do all the paperwork, courses etc..& pay the money , which is  plain robbery. Everytime you buy a gun the Permit to Aquire costs $ 40 in my State of Queensland  [ different in  other States ].

The fee goes up every year [ started at $ 15]..we were told we would hold a lifetime license for no charge, presently it is around  $ 150 for 5 years to have the pistol & longarm licenses.

Our neighbour New Zealand  had similar requirements but to their credit could see it was flawed so scrapped it.

As a licensed shooter I can possibly recieve a tougher penalty for not adheriing to some part of firearm ownership regulations than for example a drunken driver or someone on an assault charge.

For a fact I know of a friend who had a gun stolen , he was severely reprimanded & threatened with being charged [ he wasn't ]..the felon got off on a good behavior bond !!

The do-gooders would try & have you believe that gun crime is on the up & the theft of licensed  guns is a major part of that problem..both claims have been proven to be wrong.

Authorities say  that saying 'you have the right to  protect yourself or family is not a reason to own a gun..if you state that reason your application will be refused. The bad guys can break into your home  & we supposedly don't have the right to defend our family & property..well let's just say  ' yeah right !!

A short & true story...A male  hears his female neighbour screaming as a drug induced crazy man attacks her..he runs next door , wrestles the intruder eventually killing him.Two years later he is exonerated, cost him a lot of money & emotional strain on the family....that's with his hands , imagine what happens when there is a gun !

He did say he would do it all again as 'that's what you do .

Our politicians are no different to yours ..I can't say all but most are only concerned with keeping their position,making ill informed decisions or worse still going against the correct information they were given.

What we have in Australia at this moment is a Government  that does not listen, does not or want to understand that licensed gun owners are not the problem....they don't crack down enough  on illegal guns coming into the country, punish the criminals properly..hey I'm not saying anything new you've got the same problem in the U.S.A.

Criminals  are weak ...if they know for sure you  have a gun then they won't break into your home but if they know you haven't then there's a good chance they will . We have here in the workplace that the employer must provide a safe & healthy  environment' for the employee ..I  don't see any difference with the relationship between a Government  & citizen.

We are seeing the rise of some political parties in Australia that are pro guns , hunting, fishing etc  so we hope that the landscape here will change in the years to come..only time will tell.

As well as knives , hammers & anything else that can be used  there are increasing instances of  cars etc being used as weapons of destruction.

We can only keep trying down under to get some common sense flowing. 

 

[Blackwater 53393]

Painted Mohawk!  Thanks for your input.  I’m hoping more of our Australian friends will chime in. You and I have talked before and I hope that we can spend time and break bread together again! Maybe Wallaby Jack will chime in too!

 

Like I said!! Our media tends to hide the facts when it suits their purpose.  They would have us believe that there are no mass murders in Australia and particularly none perpetrated with firearms!!

[Cemetery]

On 11/10/2017 at 5:25 PM, Blackwater 53393 said:

I was reading some liberal screed begging for an "Australian style" confiscation scheme!  

 

An Australian commented on the article with this reply!!

 

 

Finally, if someone really wants to kill someone, they will find a way. Let’s look at the recent Cairns child killings in Australia where someone killed 8 children with a knife. Or the Quaker Hill Nursing home arson in Australia that killed 11 by fire. Or the Lin killings, also in Australia, that killed 5 with a hammer.

 

Wonder why these incidents are hidden when they say that there haven't been "MASS KILLINGS" in OZ since the gun confiscation??

 

Over thinking things Blackwater......they mean no mass killings with 'guns', they don't care about any other type of weapon or device used.  This phenomena of not being concerned with killings/deaths unless a 'gun' is used is pretty worldwide. 

[Blackwater 53393]

Maybe, but if you look at the Major’s post, wikipedia even lists a couple of incidents that the perp used a gun!!   This AFTER the big buyback/confiscation!!

 

Another instance where the media has just plain LIED!!!