Question for moderators concerning transactions on the wire

[John Barleycorn, SASS #76982]

Pards, SASS is not going to involve itself in    these matters. Let’s jst be glad we have the classifieds where 99.9% of deals go off without a hitch. 

[meesterpaul]

A feedback system seems reasonable. 

However; given SASS's inclination to overdo the warnings, legalese and boilerplate don't do this or that or else warning on most every page I think someone's head woyld blow up dealing with something like a Feedback system. 

Probably not enough room on the internet for them to say as much as they would say about the subject.

[Tell Sackett SASS 18436]

5 hours ago, captqueeze said:

Mr Dollar;  I think what Sackett implied is that SASS could provide a valuable service assisting it's members with feedback about sellers and buyers(rating system) to alert if someone has had questionable dealings thus helping someone with online transaction(s).  He stated in so many words just that with his last sentence.

Exactly. 

If THEY don't want to warn us, at least they could let us warn each other.

[Tell Sackett SASS 18436]

oops, double post.

[Chili Ron]

Howdy,

Local PD......Hmmmmm.

Could work.  Worth a shot.

Best

CR

 

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

Some gun based forums I visit, they have a policy of at least 25 posts before one could post a WTB or FS in the classifieds.

Might be something to try here--

OLG

 

[cowrustler]

Lumpy, no offence but how do you get 25 posts on a classified section if you don't want to  buy and you don't want to sell. There are already enough people on here who apparently just want to see their name on the net or brag about their own guns.

[Pat Riot]

6 minutes ago, cowrustler said:

Lumpy, no offence but how do you get 25 posts on a classified section if you don't want to  buy and you don't want to sell. There are already enough people on here who apparently just want to see their name on the net or brag about their own guns.

He is talking about regular posts so they can see what kind of person you are and if you sound like trouble you don't get to post sales.

 

[Johnny Dollar]

1 minute ago, cowrustler said:

Lumpy, no offence but how do you get 25 posts on a classified section if you don't want to  buy and you don't want to sell. There are already enough people on here who apparently just want to see their name on the net or brag about their own guns.

 

Im not trying to put words in Lumpys mouth but I’m pretty sure he meant 25 posts in the entire forum, not just classified.  .   I belong to a couple gun forums that do that.   I’ve also seen where people try to get around it by posting a lot of “me too” type posts.  

Ive said this before and for some reason has been met with resistance.   Another thing I’ve seen on other gun forums is all ads have original (not copied photos from the internet) and clear photos of the item for sale.  No photo, the ad gets deleted.  To many people are putting things up for sale with a fair at best description and no photo.  Then several people asking for them.  Others say they will put photos up later but never do. 

Now it’s even easier to post photos.... no excuse.  

[Pat Riot]

OKAY, here goes...

 

Imis, you seem like a great guy and I am sorry for your trouble. I am just wondering, have you been on the Classifieds this morning and seen a post where you talked about a trade on some holsters...I made a reply to that thread asking to see photos of the rig. I am interested in getting some work done myself and looking for ideas...anyway, Sorry for Hi-Jacking your thread here...

 

So, I am a Moderator here on the WIre. I don't get paid and I DO NOT speak for SASS HQ. I just Moderate our Wire, try to follow the rules and try to make sure rules are followed. If you are sitting there right now thinking "he's just making excuses" you'd be right. But, I as a Mod cannot get involved in deals made on the Classifieds. Period. I was told that if SASS HQ gets enough complaints they can ban someone from selling on the Wire.

 

Also, have you folks taken the time to look at the "Warning Points" thread? Do you all understand how that works? Do you all also understand that there have been a few people missing lately that used to post on the Wire ALL THE TIME but just don't post any more? We as Mods do not post who gets "time outs" or sho gets "banned" as that ain't The Cowboy Way but we have a couple of guys cooling their heels in Time Out right now and have banned folks when there were enough complaints or they just couldn't stop violating rules.

 

It used to be to ban a seller one had to go to SASS HQ. And, from what I hear, it took a long time to get sellers into hot water. I have no idea water "hot water" SASS can put them in except for banning them but here is what I recommend.

 

Use "Report" function and report sales that go the wrong way. I can't go fix your sale issue but I can respond to the report and I can send the people in that report a PM and even an email, if it is warranted. What I can't do is be a go between as a SASS Mod. SASS provides the Classifieds as a service but states outright they will not get involved in sales...I am not going to quote the guidelines, you can read them yourselves...

 

I have had several dealings on the Classifieds and every one has gone very well except for one where I bought a holster and it took a little while to get, and I do love it , by the way, so I will be going back to that person that sold it to me for more work. The thing is we didn't establish a date on which I should expect it from the start. He got a little backed up and then had a family thing to deal with but I did get my holster and it was / is great. I have also bought and sold on the Classifieds without one little hitch so I think the good dealings that happen in the Classifieds FAR outweigh the bad.

 

Here is what I would do:

You have the "report" system as I mentioned.

When you make a deal on the Wire and you are dealing with someone new there is no rule that says you can't detail the sale on the thread, like;

• Cowboy 1 selling rifle. Cowgirl 1 wants to buy it and makes a deal then Cowboy 1 says "Sold"! Cowgirl 1 could go on and say "Okay Cowboy 1, as we discussed , PM'd, emailed, whatever...I will send you money by _____ and then you will ship by ____ and I should expect to receive it by ___. If that date goes by and Cowgirl 1 doesn't get her rifle she can make a post. And then people can see that post and the if Cowboy 1 doesn't respond Cowgirl 1 can keep asking him IN PUBLIC what is going on...SO EVERYONE can see Cowboy 1 ain't "Cowboy".
• Another thing you can do is when you make a deal that goes well go back and make a post that it went well. That way folks know how it went and know that the person is "Cowboy".

SASS is not going to rate people on their sales on the Wire. That just isn't going to happen.

Also, SASS is not your big brother that can step in and fix things when they go wrong. We, as Mods, can use the report and warning pointsystem though. I can tell you though that warning points, when acquired, do not appear to anyone on the Wire except the person that got them and the Mods. Personally, I think everyone should see people's "warning points". They are like the big red "A" from the early days of our country or like putting someone in stocks for all to see that they did wrong. But people do get warning points for infractions other than bad sales so perhaps public warning points wouldn't be fair in those instances and the way this board is set up there is now way to differentiate between sales complaints and rule infractions.

 

So many of you, including me, think we all operate under "the Cowboy Way', but not just isn't the case all the way around. 

So many of us want to keep our deals private because what is said in the deal "is no one else's business". Well, maybe some of us need to rethink that and publish details of deals, up to a point. You can bet in the future when I buy anything I am going to at the very least say:

"Okay Cowboy, I agreed to buy your _____ so I will send the money and you can ship it and I can get it by _____, correct? And you said the Coltrugerwinchester has only been a safe queen and operates great and I should have no problems, correct?'

• Then the Coltrugetwinchester arrives and it's a piece of junk one could contact SASS HQ and report the issue - going back on THAT THREAD and saying "Hey Pal, this thing is a piece of junk, what gives and how are you going to fix it?" would be against SASS Wire Guidelines
• Or when the Coltrugerwincehster arrives and it's tippy-top, as advertised you can say "Hey Pal, Great gun, great deal, I am happy"

These are things YOU can do and I cannot find anywhere in the rules that says you can't. Now, you can't go on the Wire after a bad deal and badmouth a seller but you can ask the seller questions and nothing says you can't keep asking questions and depending on what the response is or the lack of response others can see that the seller is or is not Cowboy and can draw their own conclusions. That may not help you in your deal but if everyone started posting details or expectations of deals made people that aren't completely honest may just get a bit more honest real quick or maybe they'll not try being dishonest at all.

 

These are just my 2 cents.

 

Imis, you asked for a response from the Moderators. Here is my response. I don't think it will fix your deal but I would take some of the advice you have gotten and use it...like going back t that thread and reviving it and asking "Hey Pal, what's the deal?"...if it isn't revived already, of course...

 

I had to amend / edit my original post...

 

Best Regards,

Pat Riot

 

[Imis Twohofon,SASS # 46646]

Thank you, Pat Riot. This is the type info I was looking for. 

 

Imis

[cowrustler]

Pat, your solution makes sense, cowrustler

[Chili Ron]

Howdy,

I like the original photos idea.

Its simple. 

And almost everyone, even me, can do it.

 

If any pard is having a bad time with a trade deal, I would

sure like to know.   Why should I have to deal with crooks?

I wonder what it would take to set up an ebay style feedback system?

Anyone ever look into that?

Best

CR

 

[Pat Riot]

"Crooks" Chili Ron? How many "crooks" have you HAD to DEAL with here on the Wire? Seriously. 

51 minutes ago, Chili Ron said:

Howdy,

I like the original photos idea.

Its simple. 

And almost everyone, even me, can do it.

 

If any pard is having a bad time with a trade deal, I would

sure like to know.   Why should I have to deal with crooks?

I wonder what it would take to set up an ebay style feedback system?

Anyone ever look into that?

Best

CR

 

 

[Johnny Dollar]

2 hours ago, Chili Ron said:

Howdy,

I like the original photos idea.

Its simple. 

And almost everyone, even me, can do it.

 

If any pard is having a bad time with a trade deal, I would

sure like to know.   Why should I have to deal with crooks?

I wonder what it would take to set up an ebay style feedback system?

Anyone ever look into that?

Best

CR

 

 

Im sure they could build an EBay or gunbroker type of feedback system.  

The question is are you willing to pony up for it? EBay charges for the use of their site.  So if you are willing to pay a listing fee and a percentage of the selling amount, then I’m sure SASS can make that happen.  What your asking isn’t a free thing.  

Or we do as Pat very eloquently put, we police ourselves.   I think Pat explained it perfectly.    

[Randy Saint Eagle, SASS # 64903]

This would appear to be a pertinent thread. 

 

 

 

Randy

[Eyesa Horg]

Pat--- I think I like the "Put 'em in stocks idea"

[Boomstick Bruce]

I dodged a bullet in another forum on a deal for a 58 Remington revolving carbine. I got a bad feeling and I backed out at the last minute and someone else got ripped off...

[Doc Faraday, SASS #5749]

Buying and selling on the SASSWire Classifieds is at the buyer and sellers own risk. We have found that 99.9% of the buyers and sellers are good and honest folks. There is the other 0.1% of either buyers who are never satisfied with what they bought or sellers who mis-represent the item being sold. Because these can be problems with either the buyer or the seller - it becomes a "he said/she said". There is no way we can get involved. What we try and do is look for patterns (which because of the volume of posts and we are volunteers can be difficult). We are mainly concerned with mis-use of the SASSWire Classifieds. One of the examples I use is one about a seller who would follow the Guidelines regarding posting a price, but required the buyer to contact him either by phone or email to complete the deal. During this communication he would state that he had another offer at a higher price but would sell it to the SASS Member at the higher price. We had several complaints from different buyers regarding this so we did take action and PM'ed the seller and told him that he must sell the item for the price listed in the Classifieds. He stopped selling.

 

That is about all we can do.

 

Doc

 

[Pat Riot]

For everyone's information I had to go back and amend / edit my original post about 3/4 of the way down - it's in bold so it's easier to find.

It appears this Mod was recommending violating SASS Wire Guidelines...oops...Apologies all around.

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

15 minutes ago, Pat Riot, SASS #13748 said:

For everyone's information I had to go back and amend / edit my original post about 3/4 of the way down - it's in bold so it's easier to find.

It appears this Mod was recommending violating SASS Wire Guidelines...oops...Apologies all around.

To the wood-shed with ya.......

OLG

[Pat Riot]

3 hours ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

To the wood-shed with ya.......

OLG

Nah. I had to cut my own virtual switch...

[Major Crimes]

4 hours ago, Pat Riot, SASS #13748 said:

Nah. I had to cut my own virtual switch...

I would suggest putting you in the virtual stocks with a few virtual swipes of that virtual switch, BUT, I get the feeling you might (virtually) enjoy it

[Pat Riot]

vir·tu·al

ˈvərCH(o͞o)əl/

adjective

1. almost or nearly as described, but not completely or according to strict definition.

    

   ”Almost” being the key word there 

[Garrison Joe, SASS #60708]

I have had almost 100% excellent transactions on the wire. 

 

One deal 8 years ago seemed to be going south, with the seller not sending the item nor even responding to queries about the item for a month or so, followed by another month of vague replies about being ill or out of town, and then the seller went quiet again.  Well, I posted in the re-animated Classified ad that I was having trouble contacting the seller to get the deal finished, and a couple of pards who had shot in the past with him PM'd me back and said they would keep an eye out for him and pass on the word that I and the sheriff in his locale both were asking about him.  Got the sheriff's contact info from one of those pards.  Well, gun showed up about a week after that.   He's not posted here for the last 8 years, so I suppose he was on the way out of the game.  And given his attention (or lack thereof) to upholding the Cowboy way, kinda glad he did disappear.

 

Good luck, and hope you get a good resolution.  GJ

 

 

[hamholfarm]

I disagree with a minimum post rule.

I am not a member of SASS. I cannot play SASS because of my disabilities. I do like to purchase firearms, accessories, reloading equipment, etc. I have made several purchases here and have always been more than satisfied with the transactions. I do not post in the other forums here on the site, it is just not my thing. I read and enjoy others posts, I am just not a poster. I feel it unfair to exclude myself and others like me just because we are not the "share all" types.

 

[captqueeze]

34 minutes ago, hamholfarm said:

I disagree with a minimum post rule.

I am not a member of SASS. I cannot play SASS because of my disabilities. I do like to purchase firearms, accessories, reloading equipment, etc. I have made several purchases here and have always been more than satisfied with the transactions. I do not post in the other forums here on the site, it is just not my thing. I read and enjoy others posts, I am just not a poster. I feel it unfair to exclude myself and others like me just because we are not the "share all" types.

 

Totally agree.  We "guests" have much to offer and I bet we are just as honest; after all, it's the Cowboy way.

[Imis Twohofon,SASS # 46646]

Please see my correction on the original post. I was wrong.

Imis

[captqueeze]

So glad you received the item(s) you paid for, but, 4 months seems like a long time to wait for the seller to ship (unless you both agreed it would take that long to ship).  At any rate, it sounds like all is well.  BTW, I don't think you were wrong and posting your "problem" might have spurred on the transaction.

[Yul Lose]

3 hours ago, Imis Twohofon,SASS # 46646 said:

Please see my correction on the original post. I was wrong.

Imis

Maybe you could enlarge the script on your correction. It’s really hard to read.

[Shotgun Clay]

Glad you got your goods, an update of thread title might be a good idea.

[Cowboy Small]

Hello  to  the  wire , 

 

I got  my rig today . 

 

Haven't  got to  try it  out ,  but it is what  I  bargained  for.

 

Gonna be fun.

 

Cowboy  Small