Whats the minimum needed to knock down a Shotgun target?

[July Smith]

To date, I have been using a 1oz load with 2-1/2 drams of 2fg black powder in my 12 gauge SxS.  I am using full-length brass shotshells and vegetable fiber wads.  Compared to just about everyone else at the monthly shoots this load seems really excessive.  In an effort to save on shot, powder, and shoulder I am curious what you all have found to be the minimum amount of shot and powder necessary for a clean knock down?

[Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933]

There is no definable minimum.  No one knows the quality of the knockdowns you shoot at or how well you aim.  BP is really easy.  If you think it has to much power put in less powder.  Since you are using brass shells the wad column height is not that important.  I personally would not go much below 1 oz as I like a little more shot in case I am not all the way on target or if there are flyers.

[Church Key, SASS # 33713]

I use 3/4 oz. loads with the Clays minimum. Don't have any issues. I seem to remember that knockdowns were to be calibrated with a 158 gr. 38 bullet at 600 FPS; perhaps this was only for pistol targets. I'll look it up and edit as necessary. This is the quote from current handbook: "To the extent possible, reactive targets are set to fall when squarely hit with no more than a standard .38 Special 158 gr. factory load."

 

Church Key

[Black Angus McPherson]

Hard to say.  When my son was shooting a .410 as a buckaroo and having no problem with the KD's some other shooter's with 12's couldn't seem to make those same KD's go down.

 

I'd say it all goes to shot placement.  Load 'em light but make sure you're on target.   

 

FYI I've been using 1 oz. or 7/8 oz. loads for the last couple years and have not had a problem.

 

Angus

[Sedalia Dave]

I have used a little as 3/4 oz of shot in my BP loads with no issues as long as I do my part. I am using plastic wads in plastic hulls and not brass shells.

 

  For reference the Winchester Low Noise Low Recoil (featherlite) loads have 24 grams (0.85 ounces) of shot in them.

[Sedalia Dave]

2 minutes ago, Black Angus McPherson said:

Hard to say.  When my son was shooting a .410 as a buckaroo and having no problem with the KD's some other shooter's with 12's couldn't seem to make those same KD's go down.

 

I'd say it all goes to shot placement.  Load 'em light but make sure you're on target.   

 

FYI I've been using 1 oz. or 7/8 oz. loads for the last couple years and have not had a problem.

 

Angus

 

I have seen at least one shooter whose 12 gauge reloads probably had less muzzle energy that those .410s. She got really mad when she couldn't knock down targets that everyone else had no problem with.

[Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933]

Actually the Winchester low noise Low Recoil uses 26 grams of shot or .917 ounces.  (About 15/16 of an ounce.)

[H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619]

A 30" full choke barrel seems to help me quite a bit.   I find that they fail to fall much less frequently than when I use a 20" no choke barrel.

 

[Marauder SASS #13056]

Especially with black powder and various wads, you need to pattern your barrels.

 

Many have found that adding a little too much power resulted in shooting "donut" patters where the shot didn't hit much at all in the center.

By reducing their loads -- they had success.

 

And many have said they prefer the plastic wads to have a better pattern, but your mileage may vary.

[Father Kit Cool Gun Garth]

I developed my technique after watching Robert Redford in the Horse Whisperer, and now they call me the KD Whisperer as shown below:

(NOTE: Video is in slow-mo)

 

 

[Slow Mo Dern]

Howdy July,

 

     Wouldn't this depend a lot on how your shooting club has the targets adjusted?  A lot of our shotgun targets can be adjusted and I try to adjust them to fall when hit with a .22 round or a .38 cowboy load.  Some of the targets have to be adjusted by installing wooden shims here and there because there's no adjustment bolt.

 

     We try to adjust them twice a month so they fall with a minimal hit.  It would seem easier to adjust the target than to keep increasing your powder load. 

 

     Mo

[Warden Callaway]

 

Have you patterned your load on paper?  You could be throwing a doughnut hole at your knockdown.  

 

Some of us have discovered that a 10 gauge plastic wad works remarkably well in 12 gauge brass hulls. 

[Cypress Sam, SASS #10915]

A good solid hit is all that it takes.  I can't count the times I've seen a wad (with no shot) knock down the popper.  

 

If your matches set the poppers somewhere just south of oblivion, you'll have to experiment some.

[Cowboy Junky]

4 hours ago, Church Key, SASS # 33713 said:

I use 3/4 oz. loads with the Clays minimum. Don't have any issues. I seem to remember that knockdowns were to be calibrated with a 158 gr. 38 bullet at 600 FPS; perhaps this was only for pistol targets. I'll look it up and edit as necessary. This is the quote from current handbook: "To the extent possible, reactive targets are set to fall when squarely hit with no more than a standard .38 Special 158 gr. factory load."

 

Church Key

I think that' for a KD to be shot with a rifle/pistol load. I don't think that pertains to a dedicated shotgun target.......I'm sure we will find out soon........lol

[Yusta B.]

Seeing as how about a zillion SASS shooters use AA LNLR shells, I would look at a load at just about that weight & velocity as a starting point. About .9 oz of shot at about 1000 fps, and see how that works for you.

And pattern your gun !

[Church Key, SASS # 33713]

I ran many a match at the Monocacy Pistol Club in Frederick, MD which used 4 foot tall heavy steel knockdowns; they dropped every time they were hit with CAS pistols or rifles or shotguns. They did not fall if missed.

 

I don't see any qualifiers for the quote on Reactive Targets in the SAS handbook.

 

The golden BB might work on clay targets, you have to smoke knockdowns.

 

Church Key

[Colorado Coffinmaker]

July .... Sent ya a PM

[Noz]

Some KDs take their instructions to fall straight from a demon.  An example: A well known shooter on the Wire was shooting a bank of plates at a previous LandRun.  He was shooting ROAs with a very light powder charge. When faced with the plates he almost doubled his powder to insure the plates would fall. 10 shots on 5 plates and none fell.  All shots were obviously on target.  The next shooter was a Buckaroo and he took down all of the plates with one each shot with 22LR.  Demonic possession.

[Jabez Cowboy,SASS # 50129]

My 16 Ga. takes them down right sudden ,,,,, I use 3.4 cc hole for both shot and Real Powder .... And 4.3  hole for 12 Ga.

 

 

Jabez Cowboy

[Amarillo Rattler]

My practice load of 3/4 oz reclaimed shot and 34 gr 1.5F in 12R wad rolled crimped in a cut down AA gets 'em everytime.

I need to chrono my practice and match shotshells and post the Power Factors.

Amarillo Rattler