Ruger problem

[Slowhand Bob, 24229]

I recently purchased a SS New Vaquero and thought I lucked into birdshead grips for a pair.  I was told that these gip assemblys were removed from New Vaqueros several years ago BUT.  These birdshead grip frames have weird extensions protruding at the vert of the frames  that would have indexed into cuts in the main frame.  Is it possible that these were from an OMV or was there a change in the match up of the earlier frames style of match up?  Not sure of why these cuts would have been deemed necessary by Ruger earlier only to be dropped later?  Wish I had a photo server, this is a case where a picture is worth a thousand words!  Wondering if I should just grind the extensions off or perhaps better to give up on the whole project?  

[Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933]

Yes for OMV or single six.  Just grind the little tabs off and they will screw to your New Vaquero.  Same except for the tabs.

 

Just got home so I figured I better explain this a little better.  The frames and grip frames are cast and then during the final fitting by Ruger they are screwed together and finish ground.  There are very few New Vaqueros with birds head grips so they are very hard to find.  The grip frames on the Vaquero and Single Six are the same.  The new Vaquero uses the same casting but it has the little ears deleted.  All you have to do is grind off the ears and the grip frames should screw onto the New Vaquero frame.  They may not fit perfectly because the used grip frames were fitted to a different gun.  Most of the time the variations in fit are inconsequential.  Occassionally the top of the grip frame that goes on either side of the hammer (the area above the upper screw holes in the photo) will be to tall.  The grip frame will work perfectly, there will just be a cosmetic issue.  In those cases I grind and blend the old grip frame so it fits the new frame more closely.  If the ears above the screw holes are to short there is really nothing that can be done BUT this is just a cosmetic issue and the grip frames will work fine.  There is one other issue with fitting older gripframes on the New Vaquero.  The New Vaqueros have a free spin pawl and these pawls have a tail that extends downward toward the top of the grip frame.  If you look at the grip frame on your New Vaquero you will see a little notch in the frame for the pawl tail to fit into.  The location and depth of this groove determines how well the free spin function works.  You will have to duplicate this groove.  In the photo the groove is in the area on the right of the grip frame where there is a half moon shaped mill cut.  On this gun I did not care if the free spin worked so I simply milled a clearance cut for the pawl tail.

 

 

[Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933]

Boy its a pain trying to adjust photos to fit the 50KB limit and still have good enough quality to see detail.  Here is another shot of the gripframe at lower resolution but a larger size.  Hopefully you can see what I was talking about.  These have the little tabs ground off.  Now they will fit an OMV and a New Vaquero.

 

 

[Slowhand Bob, 24229]

Larsen, how embarrassing this is becoming.   Since this morning I have already lost two parts in two different Rugers.   Trying to replace the mainspring+ and its seat has cost me one of each part.  Even using the fork trick I can not get the seat seated properly without everything slipping and going to parts unknown!  Anyone have a good source for Rugers small parts?  Has a better tool for this come along to beat out the fork? 

[Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933]

Wait a second.  Are you talking about trying to get the springs and seat back into the New Vaquero or trying to get the spring and seat into the birdshead gripframes?  The strut and mainspring in the New Vaquero are different that those used in an OMV.  If you are switching the gripframes you have to get new springs, struts and seats.  You can get parts from Brownells, Midway and Ruger.  Photos of what you have and what you are trying to accomplish would be useful as the spring seats have changed in the newer New Vaqueros.  The newer ones no longer have the lock between the grip panels.

[Slowhand Bob, 24229]

Yes, I saw the lock in some of the diagrams and Youtube videos earlier.  These must have been used through the decades that I was strictly a Uberti fan because the New Vaquero I just purchased has a simple seat, looks like a saddle, that the strut rests in.  I remember using the fork method on my Original Vaqueros many years ago but my hand strength has failed me  of recent and I am having a heck of a time keeping the pressure applied long enough to get a punch in.  Being the eternal optimist I will use this setback to order some reduced action springs also and figure it was just destiny!   Anything else that might behoove me to accomplish while the guns are apart?  I think I will play SASS again for a few months now and turn the new guns and birdshead grip assemblies over to a gunsmith at a later date for the rough grinding and finish fitting. 

 

I do like to be able to do simple disassembly and reassembly on my own guns so will need to add a safety step into this mix, perhaps working under a sheet tent might work when springs are involved!     

[Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933]

Hopefully you are putting the strut in a vise (with something to keep the jaws from marring the stut) while you are putting on the spring and seat.  Trying to free hand it is often difficult.  A lighter mainspring and unhooking one leg of the trigger spring will do wonders.

[Gunbutcher]

On 5/7/2017 at 8:43 PM, Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 said:

On this gun I did not care if the free spin worked so I simply milled a clearance cut for the pawl tail.

Another option would be to just grind off the tail. 

[Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933]

10 minutes ago, Gunbutcher said:

Another option would be to just grind off the tail. 

Yep.  But, I left it on in case the original grip frame was put back on the gun.

[Slowhand Bob, 24229]

just as an update, I have already placed an order for a few spare parts and Wolf spring kits from Brownells.  My junk/guy room is really plain awful BUT so far I have found all of the flying parts except for one main spring.  Probably hiding in one of the old cowboy boots!!!  I did tell the wife to find me an old sheet to use as a tent for those tims I have to work with any spring parts..

[Kid Rich]

On ‎5‎/‎8‎/‎2017 at 5:28 PM, Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 said:

Hopefully you are putting the strut in a vise (with something to keep the jaws from marring the stut) while you are putting on the spring and seat.  Trying to free hand it is often difficult.  A lighter mainspring and unhooking one leg of the trigger spring will do wonders.

This works. I use a small vise and put the seat snuggly between the jaws of a small pair of vise grips. Press down to compress the spring and slide a pin of some sort into the hole. Takes all of about 30 seconds and no flying parts.

kR

[Pat Riot]

Don't worry Slowhand Bob, you'll find those parts as soon as the new ones arrive. 

 

Larson,

I referenced your name and the post you made above in a question on the thread about Q&A on the new Wire regarding photo sizing. I was trying to post a detailed photo one day and had the same problem with the 51kb photo limit.

[Yusta B.]

43 minutes ago, Kid Rich said:

This works. I use a small vise to hold the strut and put the seat snuggly between the jaws of a small pair of vise grips. Press down to compress the spring and slide a pin of some sort into the hole. Takes all of about 30 seconds and no flying parts.

kR

This works well for me.

[Pat Riot]

Here is a tool I made for the Hammer Spring / Mainspring.

It's an aluminum tube with, I believe, a 5/16" opening. I cut a slot in it so that when you compress the mainspring over the strut you can insert a small nail or pin to hold the spring compressed on the hammer strut. You just have to keep the slot lined up with the hole in the strut. I got the aluminum tube at Ace Hardware. It was a couple feet long. I just cut it to size and made the slot with my Dremel Tool.

 

Sorry the photo isn't all that great.

[Slowhand Bob, 24229]

Plenty good photo Pat when we understand what needs done.  If I had the ability to post photos I could show the tool I will be using, a weird version of an adjustable socket wrench.  As said earlier, I am going to put these back together and address the grip frame issue later.  I did put birdshead grips on my Ubertis and really liked the way they felt better BUT for some reason thing these Ruger grips feel thicker??  These are a black 'plastic?' grip.  Not sure if they can be thinned BUY they sure should look good on stainless steel!

[Pat Riot]

Slowhand, Altamont makes a "slim" grip for the NV. I believe they  said it was about 1/8" slimmer for each grip panel.

[Slowhand Bob, 24229]

Parts came in and I have the first Ruger assembled  with new parts, including the Wolfe spring kit.  I did not use the heavier latch spring that was included, do people really need this very often?  In the end I did ruin a pawl spring and a bolt latch spring during assembly.  Though the second attempt went ok I do think that if I take the gun down very often, it might be smart to keep several of these little springs on hand, they really fold on me badly during alignment of the two frames.

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

The HD latch spring is a good idea.

I hav'em in my OMV 44's.

OLG