Hanso Lowe Posted April 22, 2017 Share Posted April 22, 2017 Anybody thinking about reaming your cylinder throats? I kept having an issue when shooting. I would have misses with my pistols that I was sure should have hit. I did some research and figured it might be the cylinder throats were too small. The bullets were probably being squeezed too much before they entered the barrel so they didn't contact the grooves like they should. I tested my theory by taking a properly sized bullet and dropping it into each cylinder hole. Apparently it should take very little effort to pass it through. Mine did not. I had to pound them through with a dowel and mallet. All of them. I decided to buy the Manson cylinder throater reamer and pilot set for $150 shipped. I didn't think it was worth it as I was reaming the holes and very little metal was removed. However, when I tried the bullets again, they fell through with a very light tap with a pencil. I shot the next day and couldn't believe the difference. I still missed some, but I had no doubt that it was my aim and not equipment. I could actually feel the difference in the way it shot. My next purchase is gonna be the forcing cone tools. Not sure I need em, but if it will make me miss less then I'm all in. Plus I can use em on all my future guns. Thoughts? Questions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted April 22, 2017 Share Posted April 22, 2017 Good deal-Hope you turned it by hand. Do NOT turn that reamer backwards. That will kill the edge. Put some toothpaste on a bore mop, and use a drill motor to polish the throats. OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanso Lowe Posted April 22, 2017 Author Share Posted April 22, 2017 Yeah I watched the videos first. I used a piece of 600grit sandpaper with some oil and wrapped it around a pencil. Just did a light polishing at the time. Gonna do some more polishing this week. Planning on using a mop with polishing paste Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nate Kiowa Jones #6765 Posted April 22, 2017 Share Posted April 22, 2017 Fairly common problem with the Rugers. But, hardly ever an issue with the clones. Although I have seen it come up with the 44-4= and 38-40 guns. If you plan to use lead only the 11° forcing cone reamer will help improve accuracy. The angle is more gentle so the bullet can line up easier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tennessee Trapper Tom Posted April 22, 2017 Share Posted April 22, 2017 What caliber did you have to do? I have a pair of Vaquero 44-40s that need to be done Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colorado Coffinmaker Posted April 22, 2017 Share Posted April 22, 2017 PLUS ONE to Nate Kiowa Jones. Ruger is famous for undersize throats. Same same his comments for .44s and 38-40 from the reproductions. Also, PLUS ONE to Lumpy. DO NOT turn a throat reamer nor a forcing cone reamer backwards. EVER. I suspect you immediately noticed a reduction in felt recoil. Tight throats act like an obstruction and bump up chamber pressure. Before I retired, I charged 10 bucks a hole to amortize the cost of a new reamer when one gets dull. Same same to cut a forcing cone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Boy Posted April 22, 2017 Share Posted April 22, 2017 http://www.beartoothbullets.com/tech_notes/archive_tech_notes.htm/72 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanso Lowe Posted April 22, 2017 Author Share Posted April 22, 2017 3 hours ago, Nate Kiowa Jones #6765 said: Fairly common problem with the Rugers. But, hardly ever an issue with the clones. Although I have seen it come up with the 44-4= and 38-40 guns. If you plan to use lead only the 11° forcing cone reamer will help improve accuracy. The angle is more gentle so the bullet can line up easier. Yeah that's the one I'm gonna get. Plus the 90* face cutter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanso Lowe Posted April 22, 2017 Author Share Posted April 22, 2017 3 hours ago, Tennessee Trapper Tom said: What caliber did you have to do? I have a pair of Vaquero 44-40s that need to be done .45 colt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanso Lowe Posted April 22, 2017 Author Share Posted April 22, 2017 1 hour ago, Colorado Coffinmaker said: PLUS ONE to Nate Kiowa Jones. Ruger is famous for undersize throats. Same same his comments for .44s and 38-40 from the reproductions. Also, PLUS ONE to Lumpy. DO NOT turn a throat reamer nor a forcing cone reamer backwards. EVER. I suspect you immediately noticed a reduction in felt recoil. Tight throats act like an obstruction and bump up chamber pressure. Before I retired, I charged 10 bucks a hole to amortize the cost of a new reamer when one gets dull. Same same to cut a forcing cone. I noticed a huge reduction in recoil. However, I'm not sure how much was the reaming and how much was the new load. I was in the middle of developing my new bullseye powder and just dropped it from 6.3 to 4.5. Either way I could tell the accuracy and felt recoil was better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackey Cole Posted April 22, 2017 Share Posted April 22, 2017 I need my 38 wcf usfa saas done my 45 ruger been done I'm not sure about the 357/38 Rugers or my s&w 38 s&ws Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warden Callaway Posted April 22, 2017 Share Posted April 22, 2017 If you mentioned the caliber I missed it. Maybe you could have used bullets sized a bit smaller? I've ran into this with several guns. One of my Marlin 1894s in 32-20 has to have 311 bullet diameter while the other will take larger diameter. My Uberti 45 Colts have 452 throats. My old second generation Colt SAA has 458! The Ruger 45ACP has 451 throats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanso Lowe Posted April 23, 2017 Author Share Posted April 23, 2017 .45 colt. I wouldn't suggest using a smaller bullet. The barrel is made for .452. I think a smaller bullet wouldn't have proper contact with rifling. Plus my brass is for .452. It wouldn't develop enough pressure to be consistent. I think. It sounded good in my head anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lefty Dude, SASS # 51223 Posted April 23, 2017 Share Posted April 23, 2017 Yep; The throat is where the accuracy lies. Poor throat to bullet fit = poor accuracy. And Yes to your question on the Forcing cone ream. The Forcing cone also has much to do about accuracy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hans Christian Posted April 25, 2017 Share Posted April 25, 2017 We cast our own boolits and size to about .453" Our standard Pistol bullet is a 200 gr ACP style SWC loaded over Trailboss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Riot Posted April 25, 2017 Share Posted April 25, 2017 Is this tight chamber throat issue on the New Vaqueros, the original Vaqueros, or both? I have one of each right now in .45 colt. I have never suspected anything out of the ordinary but I will be doing the bullet check that you did Hanso Lowe. Thanks for posting this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanso Lowe Posted April 25, 2017 Author Share Posted April 25, 2017 From what I've read, all revolvers can be off some. The easiest way to check, without having pin gauges, is to take a sized bullet and drop it into each cylinder hole. It should take a very light tap with a pencil or dowel rod to make it fall through. I had to actually drive mine out with a dowel and mallet before I reamed them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yusta B. Posted April 25, 2017 Share Posted April 25, 2017 28 minutes ago, Hanso Lowe said: From what I've read, all revolvers can be off some. The easiest way to check, without having pin gauges, is to take a sized bullet and drop it into each cylinder hole. It should take a very light tap with a pencil or dowel rod to make it fall through. I had to actually drive mine out with a dowel and mallet before I reamed them. Same here with 7 lg frame Ruger 45's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seldom Seen #16162 Posted April 26, 2017 Share Posted April 26, 2017 On 4/22/2017 at 4:37 PM, Hanso Lowe said: .45 colt Your experience is interesting. My pair of 45 Colt Vaqueros are more accurate using .454" instead of .452" even though .452" hang up in the cylinder bullet drop test. Another important thing to check is the barrel / cylinder gap. One of the Vaqueros had a b/c gap of .003" when measured from one side of the frame and only .001" when measured from the other. I had a gunsmith open the b/c/ gap on both guns to .008" and recut the forcing cones at the same time. p.s Did you use cutting oil when you reamed the throats? The throats look rough and the edges of cutting tool look dinged or chipped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanso Lowe Posted April 26, 2017 Author Share Posted April 26, 2017 Reaming the cylinder throats doesn't improve my aim. I never implied that reaming them meant I would never miss again. Yes I used thread cutting oil and the tool is still like new. It's probably metal chips you are seeing. I plan to adjust the gap as well. Manson has a 90 degree facing cutter and forcing cone cutter I want to get. As far as using .454 bullets in a gun meant for .452, accuracy might be improved because of the increased contact with the rifling, but is the tradeoff increased recoil? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seldom Seen #16162 Posted April 27, 2017 Share Posted April 27, 2017 On 4/26/2017 at 9:57 AM, Hanso Lowe said: Reaming the cylinder throats doesn't improve my aim. I never implied that reaming them meant I would never miss again. As far as using .454 bullets in a gun meant for .452, accuracy might be improved because of the increased contact with the rifling, but is the tradeoff increased recoil? For best accuracy with cast lead bullets it is recommended that using a bullet sized .001 - .002" larger than the barrel will give best results. Thus for a barrel that is .452" .453 or .454" sized bullets should be used. Using .454" also makes it easier with rifles which may have .453 or .454" barrels. I have worked up accurate loads using .452" bullet in my Vaqueros. I was really surprised at how much improvement .454" bullets makes. Since CAS is a speed shooting sport accuracy is not a major factor. Without knowing what bullet weight you are using, how fast you are pushing it and how you grip your gun I can not comment on whether it increases recoil. Recoil is most commonly a direct result of the weight of the bullet and how fast you are pushing it. FELT recoil can be controlled in a large part by how you grip the gun. A firm grip is better than a loose one but too tight of a grip is worse than firm one. In other words the Single Action Revolver is designed to rotate upwards in your hand. I never considered reaming the cylinder throats as a way to reduce felt recoil. It is most commonly done for improving accuracy and functioning of the gun, not reducing recoil although, as commented, it may be a side benefit. Since you are sensitive to recoil moving to a smaller caliber as 32 or 38 will probably help you more than any tuning tricks you can do to your .45's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanso Lowe Posted April 27, 2017 Author Share Posted April 27, 2017 Is there some reason you keep making smart remarks? If you don't agree then say so and move on. Go troll another thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seldom Seen #16162 Posted April 27, 2017 Share Posted April 27, 2017 10 hours ago, Hanso Lowe said: Is there some reason you keep making smart remarks? If you don't agree then say so and move on. Go troll another thread. 23 hours ago, Hanso Lowe said: Reaming the cylinder throats doesn't improve my aim. I never implied that reaming them meant I would never miss again. Yes I used thread cutting oil and the tool is still like new. It's probably metal chips you are seeing. I plan to adjust the gap as well. Manson has a 90 degree facing cutter and forcing cone cutter I want to get. As far as using .454 bullets in a gun meant for .452, accuracy might be improved because of the increased contact with the rifling, but is the tradeoff increased recoil? I was responding to your comment "As far as using .454 bullets in a gun meant for .452, accuracy might be improved because of the increased contact with the rifling, but is the tradeoff increased recoil?" Since you ended your sentence with a question mark I thought you were asking me a question. Nor am I trying to be offensive by asking if the reaming improved the accuracy of your guns or by suggesting you move to a smaller caliber if you are sensitive to recoil. Reduced (actually very little) recoil is one of reasons I like shooting my 32-20's in matches. Actually the 32-20 is my all-around favorite cartridge. Anyway my comments are worth exactly what you paid for it...NOTHING! Be safe, shoot straight and don't squat with yer spurs on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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