Jump to content
SASS Wire Forum
Sign in to follow this  
Subdeacon Joe

Manzanar

Recommended Posts

I was born and raised in southern California (born in 1941) and remember many times passing Manzanar on our way to the High Sierras. My Grandfather said many times "That's where we put the Japs during the war". Never learned about it in school either. Had one classmate all thru grammer & high school who was Japanese who was there as a child with his family during the war.

 

I can understand the mentality at the time after Pearl Harbor, but it was a pretty sad deal.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was born and raised in southern California (born in 1941) and remember many times passing Manzanar on our way to the High Sierras. My Grandfather said many times "That's where we put the Japs during the war". Never learned about it in school either. Had one classmate all thru grammer & high school who was Japanese who was there as a child with his family during the war.

 

I can understand the mentality at the time after Pearl Harbor, but it was a pretty sad deal.

 

 

Yep, that it was. I was born in '57 and I know that the parents of some of my classmates had been there.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I worked with a guy whose parents were incarcerated there.

 

This area where I live has a good number of Americans, whose grand parents or great grandparents emigrated to the US from Japan in the 1890's - early 1900's. They owned, and several families still own, farm land nearby

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No... unlike slavery or any other oppression... it was ALWAYS wrong... and it will not ever stain me or mine. At the time, would never have gone for it.

 

However... there are those who would callously and maliciously stain us with it. And we must reject it. Always.

 

This Great Country was founded... not perfect... but over time... and of all regimes and governments over the centuries... it came as close as possible to bein' perfect. Let's not let it go too far past that point of view. Let's strive to make it so.

 

In the meantime... we have to defend it.

 

ts

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I worked with 3 men who were children when they with their families were "Interred". They understood why but you could see it bothered them to talk about it. It bothered me that these fine men were treated the way they were as children. Funny thing is they were patriotic as all h***.

 

We all worked together on a highly classified project when I worked at Hughes back in the 80's.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hindsight can be cruel and unfair. Americans at that time were scared, outraged and didn't know what was going to happen. The government did not have all the answers. Oh @$&; were all gona die! Then with a common enemy those Americans became the greatest generation and liberated the world. No small task. I wasn't there so I'll give um some slack.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No... unlike slavery or any other oppression... it was ALWAYS wrong... and it will not ever stain me or mine. At the time, would never have gone for it.

 

However... there are those who would callously and maliciously stain us with it. And we must reject it. Always.

 

This Great Country was founded... not perfect... but over time... and of all regimes and governments over the centuries... it came as close as possible to bein' perfect. Let's not let it go too far past that point of view. Let's strive to make it so.

 

In the meantime... we have to defend it.

 

ts

 

 

Well said, sir.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lead Monger,

I agree that it was perceived that it needed to be done. Heck, if I lived then I would have probably been all for it. It's just an unfortunate part of our history.

 

We will never know if interring those folks actually helped save American lives. It may have.

 

That d*** auto correct thing drives me nuts...thought I disabled it...

Edited by Pat Riot, SASS #13748

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My dad had several high school friends who were interned. The Puget Sound area had lots of Japanese-ancestry families, especially in the local farming communities.

 

His observation was that it was powerfully unfair but that the early-war hysteria was big, and it served a protective purpose to some degree. But that it went on too long, long after there was any question of necessity.

 

One issue seldom talked about is how neighbors, etc. reacted. Some acted very nobly, farming the land, paying the taxes on behalf of their interned neighbors, and banking rents for them. Others far less so; buying their land at forced tax sales and otherwise taking advantage of them without recompense.

Edited by Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lead Monger,

I agree that it was perceived that it needed to be done. Heck, if I lived then I would have probably been all for it. It's just an unfortunate part of our history.

 

We will never know if interring those folks actually helped save American lives. It may have.

 

That d*** auto correct thing drives me nuts...thought I disabled it...

No, it saved no lives. Note the record of the Japanese americans who served, for example the 442nd RCT. Most decoated unit in the Army. The Japanese immigrants were so determined to be Americans that many of their children were not even taught Japanese. When the military tried to recruit interpreters from the camps they found many young men who they thought would be fluent spoke only broken Japanese. They had to actually be sent to language school.

 

And it's very telling that although the Japanese were interned, There were no camps for German or Italians.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Probably saved lives in that it kept innocent citizens of Japanese descent from being harmed or killed by vigilantes for the Japanese army atrocities against Allied soldiers

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No, it saved no lives. Note the record of the Japanese americans who served, for example the 442nd RCT. Most decoated unit in the Army. The Japanese immigrants were so determined to be Americans that many of their children were not even taught Japanese. When the military tried to recruit interpreters from the camps they found many young men who they thought would be fluent spoke only broken Japanese. They had to actually be sent to language school.

 

And it's very telling that although the Japanese were interned, There were no camps for German or Italians.

 

 

The standard answer to that is, "Well, the Germans and Italians didn't launch a surprise attack on Pearl Harbor!" But that simplistic answer ignores the Nazi spies, and attempted sabotage, in the US.

 

The Japanese agent in Hawaii, Takeo Yoshikawa (under the cover of being vice-counsel Tadashi Morimura) found the local Japanese in Hawaii to be " unanimously uncooperative."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

The standard answer to that is, "Well, the Germans and Italians didn't launch a surprise attack on Pearl Harbor!" But that simplistic answer ignores the Nazi spies, and attempted sabotage, in the US.

 

My dad's take (as indicated, he was there, with several friends interned) was simpler: you couldn't tell who the "Germans" were.

As for the Italian-Americans, I don't think anybody ever worried much about them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I went to collage with, and remain friends today, with a lady who was born at the Tule Lake Camp in Northern CA. While they never met at the time, her father and my father both worked for the same railroad before the war.

Edited by Boon Doggle

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No, it saved no lives. Note the record of the Japanese americans who served, for example the 442nd RCT. Most decoated unit in the Army. The Japanese immigrants were so determined to be Americans that many of their children were not even taught Japanese. When the military tried to recruit interpreters from the camps they found many young men who they thought would be fluent spoke only broken Japanese. They had to actually be sent to language school.

 

And it's very telling that although the Japanese were interned, There were no camps for German or Italians.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internment_of_Italian_Americans

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internment_of_German_Americans

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internment_of_Japanese_Americans

 

There were German and Italian camps but the numbers were much lower in population.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I worked with 3 men who were children when they with their families were "Interred". They understood why but you could see it bothered them to talk about it. It bothered me that these fine men were treated the way they were as children. Funny thing is they were patriotic as all h***.

We all worked together on a highly classified project when I worked at Hughes back in the 80's.

One minor point. Interred is buried. "Interred" is buried. Interned is imprisoned.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
l

 

The European detainees were not citizens though. Citizens and long term legal resident aliens were not locked up. No doubt the nature of the attack by the Japanese and their race were big factors in their imprisonment.

Edited by Utah Bob #35998

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Interestingly, the Japanese-Americans in the Hawiian Islands were left alone! We cannot undo the past. One wonders what would happen if certain ethnic groups of American citizens were about to be subjected to similar treatment??? Would, for example, the SCOTUS declare it as unconstitutional? What would prevent similar things happening to others? To paraphrase a German clergyman during WWII, "They came for the Jews, and I didn't protest because I wasn't a Jew. They came for the gypsies and I didn't protest because I wasn't a gypsy. They came for the trade unionists, and I didn't protest, either. And when they came for me, there was no one left to protest for me!"

 

Eternal vigilance is the price of Liberty!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Utah Bob, Interned, interred, you got my point. I think i made a mistake and my lovely auto correct, which is now inactive, kept making my mistake for me. Haha

 

I think a lot of it had to do with ignorance of culture and prejudice in regards to why Japanese citizens were put away in much higher numbers. That and perhaps familiarity with German culture. If you look back the "official" language of the US almost became German, not English during the time the Founding Fathers were developing our country. English is our official language regardless of what revisionists say.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.