OT: .22 semi-auto rifle - Accuracy?

[McCandless]

Got large caliber, medium caliber... now I'm looking for a .22 small caliber rifle, detachable magazine fed, and I want to go for accuracy. I'd like to reach out and touch at 200 - 300 yds with somewhat predictable results. I was thinking of a scoped 10/22 Anybody got any experience. Is there another maker I should be looking at?

 

What about the take-down models? Do you sacrifice accuracy for convenience?

 

Thanks,

McC

[Widder, SASS #59054]

To my knowledge, you have pretty much limited yourself to the 10/22.

 

Marlin might make a magazine (clip) fed .22 semi-auto.

 

With the light .22 bullet at 200-300 yards, about the only "predictable results" that you might expect is shooting more of a 'pattern' and not a 'group'.

 

I've got two 10/22 set up for accuracy with heavy barrels and REAL nice NIKON scopes. But I wouldn't trust them to have predictable results beyond 100 yards.

 

I also have two Marlin model 60's that are tube fed semi-auto .22

These are really great .22 rifles.

 

You can always go with a custom made Volquartsen.

 

p.s. - accuracy is as much to do with the ammo as it does the rifle.

 

 

..........Widder

[Lefty Dude, SASS # 51223]

With a 10/22 you are limiting your bullet selection greatly. There are many very good 22's that may not feed or function in the 10/22.

 

And it all depends on what your desired application might be.

 

I found long ago the limitations of the 10/22. My Preference now is the vintage Remington 550-1, tube feed Semi-auto. I have not found a round that will not feed and function in the piece. And it will preform with 22 short, 22 longs & long rifle ammo. When I found this 22 Rifle, I said good bye to the 10/22.

[McCandless]

Howdy Widder!

I've got a Marlin 60 also and a Winchester 72A... I'm going to take them out and see how they compare for accuracy with Iron Sights... The 60 has a built in rail for mounting a scope, but the 72A would have to be drilled and tapped... I was just thinking that the 10/22 or some such might be a kick to have with 25rd. replaceable magazines. But, maybe I ought to give another look at my 60. What do you recommend for ammo...Mini-Mags, Stingers, Velocitors?... of course, I could just set up targets and try 'em out!

 

Duc

[ShadowCatcher]

Got large caliber, medium caliber... now I'm looking for a .22 small caliber rifle, detachable magazine fed, and I want to go for accuracy. I'd like to reach out and touch at 200 - 300 yds with somewhat predictable results. I was thinking of a scoped 10/22 Anybody got any experience. Is there another maker I should be looking at?

 

What about the take-down models? Do you sacrifice accuracy for convenience?

 

Thanks,

McC

Reaching out to some 200 - 300 yds means a hold over of some 4 1/2 to 9 feet, for a 40 gr .22 LR.

Predicable,,,,, yeah, sorta along the lines of missing a lot.

At that range any rifle will fail equally, so get what ever you want.

 

SC

[Widder, SASS #59054]

McCandless,

 

Gosh, bullet selection for good accuracy can sometimes be a 'hit or miss' situation (no pun intended).

 

Example: One of my 10/22's kinda likes the CCI Mini-Mag HP. BUT, it REALLY likes the cheap CCI Blazer ammo better for accuracy. The other 10/22 has different taste.

 

One of my Marlin 60's also seems to like the CCI Blazer.

 

But, although I like to test my rifles with various ammo, I haven't tried many different .22's on the market because of their lack of availability.

 

Aquila makes a wide range of quality ammo, as does CCI. And Remington and Winchester also make a few different types.

PLUS, you have some great ammo in Wolf, RWS, and Federal Gold Medal.

 

As you have probably already noticed with those other .22's you have, the good ole CCI Mini-Mag HP stuff is always a good starting point in testing your rifle for accuracy. Then just try a few more types to see if you can achieve the accuracy you are wanting.

 

You must also remember, there will probably be some 10/22 rifles that are more accurate than other 10/22's.

And sometimes the trigger systems can greatly enhance your accuracy, as well as how your rifle sits in the stock, etc.....

 

One thing you might want to check out is the YouTube videos concerning .22 ammo and some videos of 'Accurate .22 Rifles". Some of those tack drivers are gonna be bolt actions and some custom stuff like the Volquartsen.

 

If you are actually looking for something VERY accurate in the rimfire field, you gotta consider the .17 HMR. Great rifles can be bought from CZ and Savage.

 

 

..........Widder

[Chili Ron]

Howdy,

How about 500 yards? the drop of a .22 rimfire is only 500 inches at 500 yards.

The .22 rf only has two grains of powder to work with.

And those little chunks of lead are not all that aerodynamic.

One local range wants shooters to SHOW they can hit at 100 yards with a .22 rf.

That dangerous at 1.5 mile warning was dreamed up somehow over drinks.

There are ways to spend hundreds or even thousands of dollars on the 10/22 style rifles.

My easy not too expensive nomination for you is: buy a 10/22 sporter with no barrel band.

Buy a Beyer barrel that fits. Put it on per directions.

Buy a picatinny mount instead of the cheap rail, put it on, do NOT put Loctite into

the holes on top of the action. Put it on the screw threads and only a little.

Take a scope at least 10x and mount it.

Zero at 25 yards. Then adjust to hit about 5 inches over poa.

Rezero at 50.

Then try 100, if you run out of scope adjustment put shims under the rear scope ring

OR buy a mount that has built in tilt for the scope.

Once things work at 100, try going out another 25 yards at a time.

If you aren't familiar with shimming scopes to get enuf scope adjustment you probably will be.

Good shim material can be found at the dollar store.

Buy a feeler gauge for a buck or so, cut shims from the leaves of the gauge.

Put shims under the rear of the scope on the lower half of the rear ring

or put shims under the rear of the mount between the scope mount and the action.

Or just hold over and hope for the best.....?

If you can get a 22 rf to shoot good groups at 300 yards, please YOU tell ME

how its done. I always like to learn, pard.

Best

CR

ps the popular free float of barrels for accuracy doesn't work so well with 10/22.

If you free float a heavy steel bull barrel it will work up to the point where the aluminum

receiver cracks. Ymmv.

[Tom Bullweed]

My Weatherby XXII would beat most 10/22s that I have shot, but it has a tube mag.

 

Two thoughts:

The 10/22, along with the AR and 1911, is the most supported modular gun design there is. You can upgrade triggers, stocks, barrels, etc.. Volquartsen is a good source. There are some youtube videos of good accuracy at 100 yards with the 10/22. The big jump is moving from a barrel clamped to the frame to a barrel screwed to the frame.

I shot NRA rimfire prone rifle matches for about 4 years. The best shooters shot Eley and RWS match ammo and measured every round for rim thickness. This in not an Appleseed process.

[Captain Clark]

Got large caliber, medium caliber... now I'm looking for a .22 small caliber rifle, detachable magazine fed, and I want to go for accuracy. I'd like to reach out and touch at 200 - 300 yds with somewhat predictable results. I was thinking of a scoped 10/22 Anybody got any experience. Is there another maker I should be looking at?

 

What about the take-down models? Do you sacrifice accuracy for convenience?

 

Thanks,

McC

Since you only mention 22 caliber but not specifically rim fire, my thought for your 300 yard criteria would be an AR 15 platform sporter with a good quality scope.

[Widder, SASS #59054]

Here's another thought of mine:

 

considering the relatively SLOW SPEED of the .22 LR and the amount of time it takes that bullet to reach 300 yards, the rotation of the earth will move your target before the bullet gets there.....

 

 

..........Widder

[Russ T. Sites]

Here's my Marlin 60, it was made before the round restriction .. It's vey accurate but never tried it past 100 yards

 

[Michigan Slim]

Lot's of good info above. I'm in the 1022 crowd here. You can trick it out as much as you want and those 25 round mags sure are nice. My daughter cracks off three rounds at 300 yard steel then listens for the hits. Not all do but it's pretty fun to hear them ring it. It happens more than you would think possible.

[Slowhand Bob, 24229]

My little S&W AR22 can do 1/2" clusters at 50yds but it never dawned on me to try any longer range with a 22. The rifles scope is a cheappy set on four power and I am not that good a shot anyways. Unless your .22 is a .223 I can not imagine it being effective on any living target at the ranges of which your speak, even head shots might likely bounce off skulls???

[Red Cent]

Duc, you need to give me a call about the 10-22. Pour about four fingers because you can really do a lot of stuff with the 10-22. Stuff that is necessary for accuracy.
The Marlin M60 will shoot circles around most 10-22s if they both come straight from the box.
The headspace on a 10-22 is sloppy (shoots anything).
Chamber too big. (shoots anything)
One action screw. Think pillar bedding. Mine has another bolt horizontally through the stock and the rear hole of the trigger group. Mine has a pillar bedded screw under the barrel about 4"s in front of the receiver. Look up barrel droop.
Terrible trigger. Adjustable sear works wonders.
More than a 16" barrel is a waste and is in-efficient.
Mine shoots 1/2" @ 50 yards. 1# trigger. Yes, you can do the bump and grind and it will not drop the hammer.
Inch pound torque wrench is a necessity.

[McCandless]

Duc, you need to give me a call about the 10-22. Pour about four fingers because you can really do a lot of stuff with the 10-22. Stuff that is necessary for accuracy.

The Marlin M60 will shoot circles around most 10-22s if they both come straight from the box.

The headspace on a 10-22 is sloppy (shoots anything).

Chamber too big. (shoots anything)

One action screw. Think pillar bedding. Mine has another bolt horizontally through the stock and the rear hole of the trigger group. Mine has a pillar bedded screw under the barrel about 4"s in front of the receiver. Look up barrel droop.

Terrible trigger. Adjustable sear works wonders.

More than a 16" barrel is a waste and is in-efficient.

Mine shoots 1/2" @ 50 yards. 1# trigger. Yes, you can do the bump and grind and it will not drop the hammer.

Inch pound torque wrench is a necessity.

I tried to send you a PM, but message said you can't receive no more messages...

Anyway, I've been doing research and figured on a Kidd Trigger group. One Stage or Two Stage?? Definitely a new barrel. I had been looking at 24" and 29" barrels... but I didn't know if they would be rigid enough. Gotta do some more research! I think of them long unsupported barrels flapping in the breeze. Would need a long stock too! Only other option might be the 18" or 20" Bull Barrels. But yer sayin' 16" barrel is the best choice. Saves money for use on other parts or projects!

Thumb-hole stock? and a scope... Forget 4 fingers, we need a bottle!

[Charlie Harley, #14153]

My dad has a 10/22 with a heavy after market barrel and a Hogue over mold stock for comfort. It will smack a 6" plate at 200 yards all day long.

 

At 300 you'll have to account for the corals effect. It's not that big a deal as long as you're shooting east-west. When you go north-south that target will zip out of the way so fast it makes your head spin.

[Stump Water]

If you are actually looking for something VERY accurate in the rimfire field, you gotta consider the .17 HMR. Great rifles can be bought from CZ and Savage.

 

 

..........Widder

 

Or .22 Magnum.

[Yellowhouse Sam # 25171]

A gun article some years ago touted the Remington 597 magnum as the most accurate they'd ever tested....sub MOA at 100. I'm thinking the regular 22 to be accurate too.

[Badlands Bob #61228]

The best and cheapest way to shim a scope to get a 22lr out to that range is to cut strips out of an aluminum soda can. I have a CZ 452 bolt action that will do about 3" groups at 200 yards. Part of that may be the operator but a lot of it depends on the wind. A little breeze will throw a 22lr bullet off target by several feet at 300 yards. I think 200 yards is just about maxing out the capability of a 22lr.

[Johnny Dollar]

I built a custom 10/22 from KIDD parts they manufacture from the barrel to the receiver. Fun and easy to do and VERY accurate. The only thing Ruger on it is the magazine it uses.

https://www.kiddinnovativedesign.com/

 

 

 

[Widder, SASS #59054]

JD,

 

Just one word....... B E A U T I F U L !

 

thanks for posting that pix.

 

I have a friend who has 2 special Volquartsen 10/22's, plus a couple others with some custom aftermarket parts.

 

Your's is very nice.

 

 

..........Widder

[Chili Ron]

Howdy,

I believe the aluminum will squeeze down over time.

When a cheap feeler gauge is cut up one knows the thickness of the shims.

Pays yer money an takes yer choices.

Best

CR

[Happy Jack, SASS #20451]

I agree 100% with Johnny Dollar. We shoot outlaw 22lr benchrest here all the time. A KIDD Supergrade will outshoot any other 22lr semi-auto ever built. My wife's will almost shoot with my Annie. Eley Tenex and you are ready to go. Everything else is just a awanbe.

[Carolina Gunslinger]

I'd say take your chances with a target grade 10/22 or put one together from parts. Realistically the biggest problem is the ammunition and the transonic range of the given load. You're in it for the Eley to have any predictable results. If I had to stretch the cartridge that long I'd go for a short bull or bull fluted barrel. 18-20" max. There is a point of diminishing returns to the barrel length with .22 match ammo and eventually the bullet will be decelerating in the barrel. Another advantage is the quicker the bullet exits the barrel the less the shooter can disturb the travel of the bullet. We were taught that the target stuff was still in the longer barrels by the time we experienced the recoil impulse. Ruger makes a bolt action rifle that takes the 10/22 magazines. If I were going out to 2-300 yds with a .22 I'd be a bolt gunner as I'm interested in retained energy as much as possible for consistency. Kimber made some nice bolt action .22's and the Remington 40x is no slouch. I have an H&R single shot that I used for 6" plates at 150 meters. It is short walk long range shooting so invest accordingly.

[Garrison Joe, SASS #60708]

Anschutz bolt action rifle, if you are working out at the max limit of about 150 yards, for a sub-MOA gun in .22 LR cartridge. If you want mag fed, Anschutz biathlon straight pull "bolt" action. A classic Win 52 or Rem 40-X bolt gun would not be too far behind.

 

And those Kidd guns sound like they would tag along pretty well, too. There's a reason that most serious 22 target work is done with bolt guns, still today, not with semi-autos.

 

Going much beyond 150 yards, and the wind drift and drop and lack of energy on target will keep you from doing anything accurately and with at least a little energy left to put on the target. 200+ yards - that's the realm of a centerfire, .22 or larger.

 

Sounds like your ambitions exceed the limits of most modern target arms and ammo.....practically speaking.

 

Good luck, GJ

[Garrison Joe, SASS #60708]

 

What do you recommend for ammo...Mini-Mags, Stingers, Velocitors?

 

OK, you gotta choice to make. Accuracy or velocity. You can sometimes get both, but not often.

 

Here's just the accurate loads in each 22 rifle I've tested (I'll omit the ones that did not group WELL)

 

Winchester 69 bolt action gun - - Fed AutoMatch (bulk), CCI Quiet, CCI Blazer, Remington Subsonic, Federal Champion (bulk)

Savage 63 Bolt -- Winchester SuperX Solids

 

Marlin 39 Mountie lever - - Federal 719 High Velocity Match, CCI Blazer, CCI Quiet, Remington Subsonic

 

Ruger 10/22 Standard semiAuto -- Federal HiPower Solids, CCI Blazer

Marlin 60 semiAuto -- Federal HiPower Solids

 

Overall, the most accurate of these - the Winchester 69 bolt guns made in the 1940s!

 

Each .22, like every other rifle, will have a few favorites and several stinker types of ammo. You just have to try them.

 

What do target shooters prefer? Eley, RWS, Lapua.

Did I test any of these? A few of the lower end Eley - and in these sporting guns, not much better results than the best of the American brands.

 

Of the three CCI lines you mentioned, have seen good accuracy with MiniMags, and usually poor with Stingers. Never tried Velocitors.

 

Good luck, GJ

[Marshal TKD, Sass # 36984L]

Sig 522 is a dead nuts reliable plinker. With heavy barrel in place a Nikon scope and the right Ammo 100 yard groups are good. Have not shot 200 yards to see. I run my 522 suppressed and it is a vermin killing machine. Field rats and mice baited at 50 yards are a blast.

[Red Cent]

Bull barrel (Bentz chamber), adjustable sear, pinned the firing pin, reduced headspace, pinned the rear of the action, pillar bedded the action screw, bedded the first four inches of barrel, torsion screw pushing up on barrel, pillar bedded, torque adjustable, radiused rear of bolt of ease of cycling, replaced trigger return spring with a home made torsion bar made from a safety pin. Still works three years later.

CCI Mini Mag is its favorite and will do 1/2" @ 50 yards 5 shots. I bought the barrel, adjustable sear, rear action pin kit, and stuff from Lowes. Had the rifle for ages. Probably spent $150.00 to get the 1/2". Ain't payin' Kidd.

Oh yeah, the stock is the a factory stock slightly modded.

[Red Cent]

 

Red dot was for Ruger Rimfire Comp. Use a 18x42x40 for serious work. And, the trigger is 2#s no creep with an OT screw.

[John Boy]

They are tough to find, but the reasonably priced take down model 22LR has a barrel that is accurate ! Put a scope on it and your in business at 200 & 300 - wind dependent

Marocchi EXP 64 (Model SM64)