Renegade Roper Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 Is there a tool specifically made to punch out the pin holding the extractor in? We have "modified" a steel punch but it is a pia to use & getting buggered up. Also is there something I am doing wrong to cause SOOO much crud to build up under the extractor (in the groove) causing it not to extract the cases reliably? We use American Select powder w/105 grn bullets that are above the power factor (dont have the exact pf # in front of me). After a couple 100 rounds I swab the carrier & bolt w/G96 w/o taking the gun apart. After 500+ rounds I take the gun apart clean the carrier, springs, etc but dont take the extractor out. I clean it w/G96 and use white lithium grease & gun oil for lubrication. All of my rifles seem to be getting HUGE amounts of crud under the extractor in the groove. 2 have PGW s/s's & 1 is a Cody gun. Any thoughts on what's causing this? (This is not conducive to shooting well on the 2nd day of your state match & I would like to remedy it before TN if its something I am doing wrong since taking the extractor out is a pia.) Thanks Roper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noz Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 I hope to see an answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Muerto Negro Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 The bolt and carrier should be run dry. Clean with your favorite cleaner and stop adding oil and grease. I use Gunzilla. EMN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tex Jones, SASS 2263 Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 Can't tell exactly, but be sparing on the lubrication. Too much is just as bad as too little. There shouldn't be hardly any on the bolt and extractor. Carbon fouling will build up very quckly if there is too much lubricant, especially if it is grease. Taking out the extractor, shouldn't be that hard. A pin punch works in most cases, but the extractor should not require removal very often. By "making the power factor" do you mean above the minimum load for the caliber and bullet weight? If so, then the ammo, most probably, isn't the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spades Hanlin SASS#66204 Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 Hey Roper, I don't know about the other pards here but I don't use any lubes at all for the extractor or firing pin just some Hoppes #9 blow dry. I find any lubes in this area collects more crud than leaving dry after flushing out with the Hoppes.. When I do a pre match clean on the rifles I only soak the bolt in Hoppes and blow it dry.. Don't seem to have any problems with any of the 4 73s including my main match gun. Hope you get it worked out before your match mechanical problems suck!!! Good luck in TN... Spades H. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spades Hanlin SASS#66204 Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 Hey Roper, I don't know about the other pards here but I don't use any lubes at all for the extractor or firing pin just some Hoppes #9 blow dry. I find any lubes in this area collects more crud than leaving dry after flushing out with the Hoppes.. When I do a pre match clean on the rifles I only soak the bolt in Hoppes and blow it dry.. Don't seem to have any problems with any of the 4 73s including my main match gun. Hope you get it worked out before your match mechanical problems suck!!! Good luck in TN... Spades H. Ha!!! EMN is fast at typing too!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colorado Coffinmaker Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 I clean the Carrier Block and Breach Block (bolt) with Break Free. Wipe it down and let the Break Free Residue be the lube. The extractor and firing pin should run pretty much dry for the reasons mentioned above. Oil attracts grunge. Coffinmaker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade Roper Posted September 25, 2015 Author Share Posted September 25, 2015 Hi guys, thx for the responses. I just clean the bolt & extractor w/G96, I dont put oil or grease there. I put grease and/or oil on the springs where they contact the lever ridge, inside & outside the toggles & on the pins, a drop of oil in the bolt/firing pin and on the lifter where it is held by the lever screw. I wipe everything down that isnt getting oil/grease. Sounds like I may be using too much cleaner in between tearing the gun down. I squirt a bunch of G96 on the bolt & carrier (w/o disassembling the gun), scrub w/toothbrush & wipe off w/cotton swabs/rag. I will try just wiping off using a slight amount of cleaner on a cotton swab instead of spraying directly on. Apparently too much of a good thing may not be a good thing. Yes they are .38 cal & we are above the min load. Thx again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hurricane Deck 100366 Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 G96 has a lube component, which is most likely what is allowing the buildup to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade Roper Posted September 25, 2015 Author Share Posted September 25, 2015 HD, It figures...G96 is the only one that smells good. Guess I also need to switch cleaners too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoomStick Jay Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 Yep blowback and lube aren't a good mix. The pin on the bolt is too high for a simple tool. I have a fixture I use at home. I'll show you some tricks at wartrace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bart Solo Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 I was told by a gunsmith I shoot with that compressed air is the preferred method for cleaning the extractor. He didn't advise the use of lubricants on the extractor, bolt or carrier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purly SASS # 57438 Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 Broomstick, I need that trick also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deuce Stevens SASS#55996 Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 You can do the super secret bolt mod that uses relief cuts to allow the gunk to not collect under the extractor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cypress Sam, SASS #10915 Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 Or you could use 158 grain bullets with your same powder charge and not have the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deuce Stevens SASS#55996 Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 Or you could use 158 grain bullets with your same powder charge and not have the problem. That's 50 grains of lead that could go towards another bullet. ( it's a joke FL guys don't tear me a new one) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cypress Sam, SASS #10915 Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 I kind of like a little recoil, but I can't tell much difference between 158 and 105 bullets in my 73 rifle. And I certainly don't like cleaning the action of my rifle every couple a hundred rounds. Anyway I've found the best compromise in preserving the lead supply is to shoot 90 trainers in my 32-20's. Saves another 15 grains of lead! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Rich Posted September 26, 2015 Share Posted September 26, 2015 Shirttail Bess has gone to a little stiffer load and tighter crimp in her rifle to avoid having to scrape out the gunge so often. kR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Whiskey Posted September 26, 2015 Share Posted September 26, 2015 Roper, everyone is touching on " lube or don't lube " and item's of that nature....... I'm thinking there's a possibiliy your extractor may be bent. My question is..... Was there a time with this rifle, that know matter how dirty it got, you were not having this issue ? I only speculate because, I ran into this with StuntGirl Taj's rifle..... I'm not big on cleaning all the time, only before state's and above. Taj jammed up her rifle 2 years ago at Jersey State, after that, it would miss pulling a round out every now and then... So I started cleaning hers alot more, putting an emphasis on the bolt and extractor area, ( pulling pin and extractor, brushing out channel). She would be ok for maybe a match or two, then it would happen again. After she started getting "really aggravated" ( as you are now ), I really got into it... I found that the extractor was bent just slightly enough that if the slightest speck of anything made it's way under the extractor... It would neglect to grab a chambered round. My suggestion... install a new extractor.... I know the level in which you shoot .... You've seen me shoot..... believe me, there are times my rifle and Taj's are absolutely filthy, and they keep on run'n. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marauder SASS #13056 Posted September 26, 2015 Share Posted September 26, 2015 You can do the super secret bolt mod that uses relief cuts to allow the gunk to not collect under the extractor. Is the super secret hand shake required for this info ?? :D But it does sound interesting.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noz Posted September 26, 2015 Share Posted September 26, 2015 Is the super secret hand shake required for this info ?? :D But it does sound interesting.... I too am all a-quiver!! I had a 54 second stage and a 97 second stage at RUKUS IN THE NATIONS both caused by failure to extract. New one installed and it seems to work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purly SASS # 57438 Posted September 26, 2015 Share Posted September 26, 2015 I have been useing a modified extractor with a coil spring. So far it has worked well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade Roper Posted September 27, 2015 Author Share Posted September 27, 2015 Boomstick thanks, I will look you up at TN. Hope your shoulder is better and you can shoot without killing it. Big Whiskey, its 2 out of 3 rifles which is why I think its my surround & drown cleaning method with a slight possibility a tighter crimp helping (but Schwaby shoots the same rounds & has yet to have this problem). Both rifles are only a little over a year old, one has a PGW s/s & the other a Cody. Haven't torn the Cody apart yet but it & the other rifle (that is still running & also has a PGW) the extractor looks like its running uphill. When I get a chance I will take them both apart to clean the extractor groove & will check the extractors to see if they are bent. The one that he tore apart & cleaned had 0.6 grains of gunk in the groove, not sure how many rounds went thru it to get that. One of the PGW's had this issue before but I dont know which one. I am keeping track of when they had the extractor cleaned & how many rounds thru it to see. Just put 30 thru the one he cleaned out today w/no issues. I really think its my cleaning method cuz the issues started after I started cleaning them more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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