Warden Callaway Posted September 4, 2015 Share Posted September 4, 2015 I've been fighting high primers on my C45S loads. This afternoon I picked up two cases and measured the primer pocket depth and got .110-.113. I got a Starline 44 Special case and got .120. .120 should be correct, I'm thinking. .110-113 is well below tolerance. If you have a stock of last issue Starline C45S brass and have a way to measure the primer pocket depth, please measure a few and report back. Thanks, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted September 4, 2015 Share Posted September 4, 2015 These were clean 'pockets' you ck'd? If that's the case-WOW, way out of spec. OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boggus Deal #64218 Posted September 4, 2015 Share Posted September 4, 2015 Warden, any Large Pistol primer pocket should be around .120 deep. If I remember correctly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warden Callaway Posted September 4, 2015 Author Share Posted September 4, 2015 Yes, the pocket are clean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Bullweed Posted September 4, 2015 Share Posted September 4, 2015 How old/new is the lot of cases? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted September 4, 2015 Share Posted September 4, 2015 How many have you found like this? OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pit Bull Tex Posted September 4, 2015 Share Posted September 4, 2015 I measured 20 of mine and they are all .122.I bought them from Miss Cubbie.I don't shoot them just wanted to play with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warden Callaway Posted September 4, 2015 Author Share Posted September 4, 2015 Two I picked up at random that I've been using as dummy rounds that set off an alarm. Most is loaded right now. I pulled out 500 new C45S brass and checked at least 20 and the primer pockets were all .120+/- a thousand or two. I rounded up 10 cases from the same first batch and deprimed them and cleaned the pockets. Two measured .113, one about .115 and the last 7 between .118-122. I took measurements several times each as my equipment is not NASA quality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 Posted September 4, 2015 Share Posted September 4, 2015 Happens. Hint - primer pocket uniformer tool. Must be a reason for them. Good luck, GJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warden Callaway Posted September 5, 2015 Author Share Posted September 5, 2015 Happens. Hint - primer pocket uniformer tool. Must be a reason for them. Good luck, GJ Looked at Grafs website. About $14 for Hornaday primer pocket uniformer. Some must have been ran on a Monday morning after a play hard weekend! If it's going to run as high as 25%, I may as well just put the whole batch through the sizer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widder, SASS #59054 Posted September 5, 2015 Share Posted September 5, 2015 Warden, consider this: as long as those primers are FULLY SEATED (seated to the bottom of the primer pocket), you should atleast be able to shoot them in your rifle ONE time and then after depriming, you can use the Primer Uniformer on those pockets. I doubt you will be able to use them in your pistols. And there is a slight possibility that if used in your rifle, they may not eject well because the cartridge rim won't be sitting flush against the bolt face to help insure a good ejection. I hope I stated that well. ..........Widder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warden Callaway Posted September 5, 2015 Author Share Posted September 5, 2015 I've been fighting and cursing the Dillon for not seating the primers all the way, when in fact it was - with my help - crushing the primers in the hole. I'm wondering what damage it's doing to the primers? I've not experienced any real problem running these through the Cattlemen or Marlin. I'd feel a high primer drag in the press and back it up and squish it again. This is the original brass that I've reloaded at least 10 times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warden Callaway Posted September 5, 2015 Author Share Posted September 5, 2015 Ok, I'm an insomniac. I woke up and kept thinking about the primer pocket problem. I finally got up and dressed and went to reloading bench and deprimed some 80 cases. What got me going was that I figured out a more productive way to measure the pocket depth. Instead of measuring each pocket, I set my digital calipers to .120 and locked it. Then I just had to probe a pocket to see if it was .120 or not. Then I figured out I could load them in a tray an go down the line. Then I figured out if I tipped the tray and had a desk lamp beyond, I could see a little or a lot of light under the caliper frame. I measured on both sides of the primer hole. And the results were, 50 of the 80 were a little to a lot shallow. There are a few marginal in each group. I don't think any were a full .120 deep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warden Callaway Posted September 6, 2015 Author Share Posted September 6, 2015 I had time today to make a run to Grafs and get a Hornady primer pocket uniformer cutter. I got it adjusted for large pistol (comes set for large rifle.) and chucked it in my mini-lathe. I ran 50 cases in about 10 minutes. They look good and measure good. I seated primers in 5 and they looked to be just below the surface of the head. In my 45 years of reloading I've never ran across such a problem. I'm I the only one to have the misfortune to have to deal with primer pocket problems? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted September 6, 2015 Share Posted September 6, 2015 I had time today to make a run to Grafs and get a Hornady primer pocket uniformer cutter. I got it adjusted for large pistol (comes set for large rifle.) and chucked it in my mini-lathe. I ran 50 cases in about 10 minutes. They look good and measure good. I seated primers in 5 and they looked to be just below the surface of the head. In my 45 years of reloading I've never ran across such a problem. I'm I the only one to have the misfortune to have to deal with primer pocket problems? What your have'n to deal with is very sloppy QC on the case makers part. NO-It's not normal at all. You really should give Starline a call. Here's some specs you can look at. http://ballistictools.com/articles/primer-pocket-depth-and-diameter.php OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warden Callaway Posted September 6, 2015 Author Share Posted September 6, 2015 Starline is just 90 minutes west of us. I could collect up some samples and take them down to get their appraisal. The reason I brought this up on the Wire is that it's hard to believe I got all the bad eggs in my basket. I've checked other Starline brass and have not found any bad pockets yet. But this experience has registered with me the possibility of shallow primer pockets by any manufacturer. Several companies make a primer pocket uniformer tool so there must be some need for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widder, SASS #59054 Posted September 6, 2015 Share Posted September 6, 2015 Warden, the MAJOR reason for the primer pocket uniformer is for reloaders who might want to reload 'match' perfect ammo, BR shooters, etc... It insures that each primer sits at the same depth for all your reloads. I used mine exclusively for my 'home defense' ammo in my .45 ACP a few years back. And I also used one when I loaded up my 6mm BR ammo to help insure I got the best accuracy possible. NO, the pocket uniformer by itself didn't give me the reliability I was wanting, but it was part of the process. I also used a flash hole demurring tool from the inside portion of the flash hole. Reloading for accuracy and dependability has many variables and those I mentioned above are just a couple of them. Another good use of the Uniformer is to also clean your primer pockets. The wire bristle tips not only clean carbon but scratch away brass. The Uniformer removes brass ONLY ONCE (the first time you properly use it) and it only cleans away carbon each time after its initial usage. I use the Carbide uniformer that are already made for proper depth. No adjustments are necessary. ..........Widder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warden Callaway Posted September 7, 2015 Author Share Posted September 7, 2015 I am very pleased with how the primer pockets look after cutting them. Nice flat bottom. I may include a uniformer depth cut in my new case prep steps. It always seems that the bottom of the pockets are dished a little - probably from flash hole punching operation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 Posted September 7, 2015 Share Posted September 7, 2015 The reason I brought this up on the Wire is that it's hard to believe I got all the bad eggs in my basket. I've checked other Starline brass and have not found any bad pockets yet. But this experience has registered with me the possibility of shallow primer pockets by any manufacturer. Brass producers make brass in large lots. Sometimes the equipment for, say, primer pocket stamping (swaging) was making a different size brass before a new lot of production is started. Operators or setup mechanics have to typically check the adjustment of the tooling after such a reset. Well, this time they missed the depth check for a while. Quality assurance checking missed the error for a while. I would fully expect that such an occurrence of bad pocket size ONLY occur within one lot. If the factory is stamping out lot after lot of badly dimensioned brass, they are on the road for failure. If they make one lot that they don't catch, it's just a black eye. But even better, if the operator or QA inspector catches the problem after the run has only made 100 cases, they can be scrapped or perhaps even reworked, and it's a minor delay to production. You got a bad lot. Starline MIGHT just want to know which lot number, so they can try to call back any inventory that might not have been sold yet. Let them know. Good luck, GJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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