H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619 Posted August 15, 2015 Share Posted August 15, 2015 We all know that the ".38-40" is really a "40-40." Has anyone ever wondered what kind of performance would have come if Winchester had made the cartridge a "real" .38 with a .357" bullet? I'd guess it would have been, assuming a bullet weight around 150 grains, give or take a few, a quite speedy round. Purely a random speculation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Driftwood Johnson, SASS #38283 Posted August 16, 2015 Share Posted August 16, 2015 Nothing good on TV tonight HK? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Harley, #14153 Posted August 16, 2015 Share Posted August 16, 2015 Hmmm... Black powder would have limited the round's performance to a degree, but it is intriguing. If you want to,play smokeless, there is a wildcat round based on necking the 44 mag case down to .357. Pretty impressive performance based on what I read in American Handloader. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desert Pete SASS #42168 Posted August 16, 2015 Share Posted August 16, 2015 KInd of a 357 Sig?. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tecate Slam 99188 Posted August 16, 2015 Share Posted August 16, 2015 It is called a 357-44 Bain and Davis. I shoot it in a Contender and it is a varmints worst nightmare. It might be a little too hot for SASS. I have not tried any reduced loads. I just say'n. Tecate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619 Posted August 16, 2015 Author Share Posted August 16, 2015 Nothing good on TV tonight HK? Heh, not really, no. But it was a random thought that occurred to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619 Posted August 16, 2015 Author Share Posted August 16, 2015 It is called a 357-44 Bain and Davis. I shoot it in a Contender and it is a varmints worst nightmare. It might be a little too hot for SASS. I have not tried any reduced loads. I just say'n. Tecate Ah, so someone has thought of the idea, all be it in a more modern sense. Intriguing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Bullweed Posted August 16, 2015 Share Posted August 16, 2015 My questions about false cartrdige nomenclature is: why didn't they call the .410 shotshell a 67-gage, like the of rest standard shotgun gages? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clueless Bob Posted August 16, 2015 Share Posted August 16, 2015 I heard about the 357-44 Bain Davis round along time ago and have always been on the look out for it. Had a chance once but things didn't work out at the time, but still looking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trailrider #896 Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 I recollect an article in the April issue of some gun magazine showing a .50BMG necked down to .17 caliber! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Silverfinger, SASS#3444 Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 ..........an' I saw a .50BMG cartridge necked down to a phonograph needle! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Lynchem Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Tom, intriguing question, I often wonder that myself! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadeye George Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 ..........an' I saw a .50BMG cartridge necked down to a phonograph needle! Way to go............. now you have some of the younger members trying to figure out what a phonograph needle is and how much smaller than a .17 it is! My grand daughter came across a box of old 45's and asked what they were. Try explaining a record player to a 10 year old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Springfield Slim SASS #24733 Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 A record player is easy, it is just a giant CD player. Try explaining reel to reel tape machine! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yusta B. Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 A record player is easy, it is just a giant CD player. Try explaining reel to reel tape machine! Or what an awesome game Pong was in 1975 .... :o Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warden Callaway Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 We all know that the ".38-40" is really a "40-40." Has anyone ever wondered what kind of performance would have come if Winchester had made the cartridge a "real" .38 with a .357" bullet? I'd guess it would have been, assuming a bullet weight around 150 grains, give or take a few, a quite speedy round. Purely a random speculation. My guess is it wouldn't have worked out in the era the case was developed because the bullets at that time were solid lead and could only pushed so fast anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phiren Smoke GUNFIGHTER Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 A record player is easy, it is just a giant CD player. Try explaining reel to reel tape machine! Reel to reel is similar to an eight track.......no....it is like a cassette tape......no....I got it it kind of like a floppy disc....oh never mind. Smoke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oddnews SASS# 24779 Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Try to explain to some child why we say we "dial" a telephone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J. Mark Flint #31954 LIFE Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 At the turn of the prior century, into the teens I believe Winchester marketed some high velocity loads for the .38-40 meant for the 1892 Winchester rifle. I've used 140 grain bullets meant for .40 S&W and they really performed about the same as the 180's, just didn't crimp well. Your proposed cartridge would be a .36 WCF or a .36-40 or maybe a .36-38 that would make things easier There is also talk that the .38 is the diameter of the bore from land to land, not groove to groove which is about right, but not a common way to designate cartridges. Making it with modern brass would give you all the detriments of a .45 with none odf the true benefits of a .38 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Hooker Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 ..........There is also talk that the .38 is the diameter of the bore from land to land, not groove to groove which is about right, but not a common way to designate cartridges.............. Used ta be.. That's how the C&B revolvers were designated. Exemplia gratia (e.g.), thirty-six caliber was about that, plus groove depth gave ball size, .375 or so inches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlicLee SASS #16638 Life Posted August 21, 2015 Share Posted August 21, 2015 Jmark-remington came out with a rifle load using 130 grain bullet with 1200 or so fps using smokeless powder to be used in the then new 1892 Winchester rifle. Almost all 38/40's had bore diameter of .40. How would a .38 or .358 work . I bought some of those 140 grain TCFP from Hunter in .401. Worked up a load for rabbit or tried to, actually hit one, it tumbled a bit, then turned, I swear, I had 2 witnesses, turned took a few steps toward us gave me the dirtiest look and hopped away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J. Mark Flint #31954 LIFE Posted August 25, 2015 Share Posted August 25, 2015 I don't think there would be much difference, I think it is likely the smaller .356 bullet would reach the same terminal velocity as the standard 401 bullet would when using Black powder, so it would less recoil and less energy. Don't see it being any better until you get to modern bullet construction and high performance smokeless powders at which point there are better options Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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