Colt Faro, SASS #54579 Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 What are your thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Dave Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 No. But we sure don't need no more either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wyatt Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 We only need one...................GUNFIGHTER!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anvil Al #59168 Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 YES. It is sad that at a World or National Championship match. That has 550-750 shooters. And we think a category with 30-40 in it is just to many. And have some with less than a handful. Most category's at monthly matches are a joke. 40 people and 37 first places. Wish Duelist would have had 50-60 instead or only 17. Would that have meant maybe me not placing?? Sure. And I would be OK with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nasty Newt # 7365 Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 Probably, but I'm past fretting about it. I can see both sides of the issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michigan Slim Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 Doesn't matter to me. Would come in second with only me in the category! LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Four Bucks #36386 Life Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 I am of two minds on this. More competition would make winning more meaningful but is that all that matters? If a monthly has 40 shooters and 37 first placers...does it really matter? Were they having fun? Did it affect your fun? While it may dilute the big picture of competition, I think we have A LOT more participation because of the categories available. I usually shoot one of several BP categories, which tend to be smaller. But they are fun to shoot and that's why I play this game. Sure, I like winning...and if you don't think you can be proud of a victory in a small category, try shooting against Lefty Eastman or Silver City Rebel or Preacher Kid or many of the other fine BP competitors. Competition is where you find it. So...after a lengthy stint on the soap box...no, I don't think there are too many but like Grizzly Dave...I don't think we need to continue to expand either. Just my $4 worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bart Solo Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 The whole purpose of multiple categories is to give more people an opportunity to win. To the extent a category has enough shooters to make for a real competition, I am all in favor of the category. The alternative would be handicapping as in golf or bowling. Do we really want to handicap cowboy shooting? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doc roy l. pain Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 I think there have been ever since we did away with modern and started adding all the age catagories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 Yes. OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anvil Al #59168 Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 I am of two minds on this. More competition would make winning more meaningful but is that all that matters? If a monthly has 40 shooters and 37 first placers...does it really matter? Were they having fun? Did it affect your fun? While it may dilute the big picture of competition, I think we have A LOT more participation because of the categories available. Just my $4 worth. That can go both way. If it does not matter. Just there for fun. Then why would having more in one category matter. Would you still not have fun. I don't think we have more show up just because there is more category's. If they are only showing up because they can win a category of one or two. What does that tell you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bull Shooter Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 All the different categories are fine. Just like little league baseball for kids. Kids only want to keep playing if they win. So let every Cowboy win something even if they were the only one in the class. I like to do good in my class, but overall is all that matters to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deuce Stevens SASS#55996 Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 No, My why is simple, we are not a professional shooting sport. It is and always has been entertainment. Yes you can compete at a high level. But at the end of the day 1st. and 100th. place leave no richer. As a match director I'm willing to do what makes my customers happy, and that includes letting guys get together to make a sub category. The largest membership influx in this game was based off of folks getting to lose themselves for a few days while putting some ammo downrange and enjoying fellowship with like minded folks. I've never cared what other shooting sports have thought of us for that matter either. When you realize your results can be altered by how well 3 people can see and hear it really puts it in perspective for me. That being said I would not want to see 20 more categories but I think our current system covers the bases nicely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheyenne Culpepper 32827 Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 No, My why is simple, we are not a professional shooting sport. It is and always has been entertainment. Yes you can compete at a high level. But at the end of the day 1st. and 100th. place leave no richer. As a match director I'm willing to do what makes my customers happy, and that includes letting guys get together to make a sub category. The largest membership influx in this game was based off of folks getting to lose themselves for a few days while putting some ammo downrange and enjoying fellowship with like minded folks. I've never cared what other shooting sports have thought of us for that matter either. When you realize your results can be altered by how well 3 people can see and hear it really puts it in perspective for me. That being said I would not want to see 20 more categories but I think our current system covers the bases nicely. +1000000 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nichols Creek, SASS #77627 Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 I think all categories should at least include a senior division. Sr frontiersman, Sr FCD, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anvil Al #59168 Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 No, My why is simple, we are not a professional shooting sport. It is and always has been entertainment. Yes you can compete at a high level. But at the end of the day 1st. and 100th. place leave no richer. As a match director I'm willing to do what makes my customers happy, and that includes letting guys get together to make a sub category. The largest membership influx in this game was based off of folks getting to lose themselves for a few days while putting some ammo downrange and enjoying fellowship with like minded folks. I've never cared what other shooting sports have thought of us for that matter either. When you realize your results can be altered by how well 3 people can see and hear it really puts it in perspective for me. That being said I would not want to see 20 more categories but I think our current system covers the bases nicely. I do see that point. But to me. The entertainment is there. Don't matter if I am going against one other shooter. Or 300. It's still the same entertainment to me. Would just like to see the competition part mean a little more. I don't think that would take away from the entertainment part at all. Now some category's are VERY competitive. And the race for overall is at all the big ones. But there are times I just wish there was more to it in other category's. Including mine. It just that if we could stop adding at this point. But seems they keep wanting to add even more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Dan Troop 70448 Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 No matter what category I enter, and at my age, I have many to choose and enjoy myself in. When the match is over, a simple monthly, annual, state or above, I look at were I stand amongst all the shooters. In CAS, you can have your cake (category), and frosting (overall standing) also. Seeing shooters walk up and away when called for an award is priceless. MT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anvil Al #59168 Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 I guess my thinking is. If you have a pie. And it is only so big. You have some pieces that are just about the right size. And others that are REALLY THIN. Don't think you should cut those that are just the right size to make them smaller. I think you stop cutting pieces to make those REALLY THIN slices bigger. And lets face it. We got some REALLY thin slices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckshot Frank Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 Yes. I just look at what place I came in overall. I couldn't care less about what place I finished against other 41 year old males with first names that begin with the letter F. Equipment and shooting style categories make sense. I can live with gender based categories. Having categories for juniors make sense. If you really want a category for old timers, fine. Categories for every age bracket in ten year increments is a bit much, especially once combined with gender and equipment categories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deuce Stevens SASS#55996 Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 I guess my thinking is. If you have a pie. And it is only so big. You have some pieces that are just about the right size. And others that are REALLY THIN. Don't think you should cut those that are just the right size to make them smaller. I think you stop cutting pieces to make those REALLY THIN slices bigger. And lets face it. We got some REALLY thin slices. So on the flip side, if more categories are added will you stop playing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chili Pepper Pete 11917 Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 Name me an easy category to win at EOT or Winter Range? It seems to me that at most major matches there are at least two or more really good shooters in every category. These good shooters are shooting for first place in that category or overall, not just to get a buckle. Don't get me wrong that its great to get a buckle but not always the end goal of better shooters. If we reduce the number of categories all we are doing is moving more good shooters into fewer slots. I personally am OK with that, but what categories are you going to eliminate, who gets to decide and really what is the point? This is a game that we all choose to play, SASS and club match directors are selling us entertainment in the form of a shooting contest. The more people that go home happy the more successful the match. More people come back and play again. The cost of the extra awards is absorbed into the match fee's, We the shooter pay those fee's so in effect we are paying for the chance to win an award that otherwise we might not win. So what does it really matter how many categories there are? Just my thoughts on a beat to death topic, Best regards, Chili Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anvil Al #59168 Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 So on the flip side, if more categories are added will you stop playing? Where did I say that?? Did not say that in anyway. At monthly's all I look at is overall. Category's don't mean anything there. Just don't want to see it get to that point at the big ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shooting Bull Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 As a shooter I couldn't care less. I enjoy competition. And when I say that I mean it in the truest sense of the word, I want to COMPETE. I want to compete against the very best in my category. Win, lose or draw, if I'm in there mixing it up with some good shooters I'm the happiest camper you can imagine. Having been a club president and match director in the past I can certainly see why this discussion comes up so often. Trying to heard that many cats while constantly listening to complaints (Yes, no matter how great the match is there are ALWAYS complaints) is a full blown nightmare. People that can do that year in and year out simply for the satisfaction of seeing the happy faces of the competitors are about the most rare breed on the planet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widder, SASS #59054 Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 Just off the top of my head, I will say no. WHY? because if you start eliminating or restricting categories, you just might start stepping on some female toes. And ifn you step on some female toes, then ole hubby might not be traveling to as many matches because the Bunkhouse Boss has been derailed with category restrictions she don't like. Anyhow, thats just my thoughts. I don't have any statistics to base my feelings. Just my gut feeling. ..........Widder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Sage, SASS #49891 Life Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 Our monthly shoots don't have categories, don't give out awards either. Annual shoots is a different matter. Categories....bring em on! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knot Hardly Dunn Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 Just for what it's worthy I think there are 34 categories currently. Winter Rqnge had about 800 shooters and the awards went 10 deep in each category. My math says that 400 folks went away with no award. The must have come for something. Just maybe it was for the fun and seeing your friends old and new. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckshot Frank Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 The cost of the extra awards is absorbed into the match fee's, We the shooter pay those fee's so in effect we are paying for the chance to win an award that otherwise we might not win. So what does it really matter how many categories there are? Best regards, Chili It might not matter at State matches and above, but the cost of all of those awards becomes a huge deal for annual matches at smaller clubs. If you have to make/buy 60 awards (because you never know who is going to show up at the last minute, and you better have an award for them), you are looking at passing a $600 cost off onto the shooters. If you expect to get 40 shooters, that's $15 per person. Adding that $15 might make the difference between drawing 50 and only drawing 30 because it costs too much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bull Shooter Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 I could be wrong, but I believe WR had a little over 600 shooters. I could look it up, but I see your point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anvil Al #59168 Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 I could be wrong, but I believe WR had a little over 600 shooters. I could look it up, but I see your point. Think you are right. A down year for them. Some might have been waiting to be sure and go next year. Anniversary year. This going to be big in 2016. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 At the club level a lot of clubs don't really care. (There are some clubs that really do care and are very competitive at the club level.) However, when you start getting to higher levels (State, Regional, Divisional, National and World) and there is supposed to be actual competition in order to "win" a category, the category system is often overloaded. There are 34 SASS categories. On top of that there has been a trend to add the so-called "unofficial categories." (For example, Senior Gunfighter, Silver Senior Duelist, etc.) If we aren't going to have competition then we really don't need any categories. We can all simply show up and shoot and, hopefully, have fun. This would also save a lot of time because we wouldn't need to keep score and that would eliminate disputes over spotting and procedurals as well. If infinite categories and de-emphasizing or eliminating the competitive aspect of SASS is what the memberhsip wants we can do like the soccer moms and simply give a prize to everyone that shows up. This is sort of like Rank scoring. It is a never ending unresolved issue that some people get really passionate over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 I could be wrong, but I believe WR had a little over 600 shooters. I could look it up, but I see your point. There were a "little" over 700 registratiions. 685 completed the match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widder, SASS #59054 Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 Colt, what are YOUR thoughts? ..........Widder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Dave Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 This horse is so dead it ain't even good fer dog food no more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shooting Bull Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 Colt, what are YOUR thoughts? ..........Widder He gave you a full pot and spoon, now you want him to STIR it too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anvil Al #59168 Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 This horse is so dead it ain't even good fer dog food no more. He gave you a full pot and spoon, now you want him to STIR it too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.