The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted June 30, 2015 Share Posted June 30, 2015 Slick McClade sells an excellent after market extractor. They have worked flawlessly in every gun I have put them in. http://www.slickmagicguns.com/SlickMercantile.html Looks like the same extractor sold buy Wild West Guns. Not sure- http://www.midwayusa.com/product/1800161270/wild-west-guns-ejector-marlin-336-444-1894-1895-steel?cm_vc=ProductFinding Was think'n this would be a good way for JJJ to go also. OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jittery Jim Jonah, SASS #64913L Posted June 30, 2015 Author Share Posted June 30, 2015 Wondered why you never call'd. Use'n DJ's extractor may, or may NOT fix a thing. You have to 'fit' the extractor for each bolt. OLG As of now We still intend to visit tomorrow..... I gots a dr. appointment in the morning, and by then I hope to have both extractors out so's w can gitt'er fixed. Gonna try putting Deja's extractor in my rfile bolt and see if it will still work. That will give an idea of where to go with my extractor. I'll call in the morning pard..... lookin' forward ta meetin' face ta face! JJJ-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jittery Jim Jonah, SASS #64913L Posted July 1, 2015 Author Share Posted July 1, 2015 OOPS..... double tap... JJJ-D :ph34r: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jittery Jim Jonah, SASS #64913L Posted July 1, 2015 Author Share Posted July 1, 2015 I removed BOTH extractors today and it is clear that the replacement extractor is completely stock and in serious need of work! Deja's has been modified and doesn't even look like the same extractor! Here are pics of both>> http://s7.photobucket.com/user/jitteryjim/media/Marlin%20Trouble/Extractor2_zpscaaud6vz.jpg.html?sort=3&o=0 JJJ-D :ph34r: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 I removed BOTH extractors today and it is clear that the replacement extractor is completely stock and in serious need of work! Deja's has been modified and doesn't even look like the same extractor! Here are pics of both>> http://s7.photobucket.com/user/jitteryjim/media/Marlin%20Trouble/Extractor2_zpscaaud6vz.jpg.html?sort=3&o=0 JJJ-D :ph34r: YUP-That right extractor is aftermarket, for sure. OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jittery Jim Jonah, SASS #64913L Posted July 2, 2015 Author Share Posted July 2, 2015 UPDATE..... Visited with Lumpy today and we swapped out the extractor with one that works! Thank you Lumpy, and Widder for helping as well..... Gonna live fire just ta be sure our changes work as it appears they will..... YIPPEE! JJJ-D :ph34r: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widder, SASS #59054 Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Good news JJJ. Glad everything appears to be working much better and thanks for keeping us updated thru your situation. SALUTE to Lumpy for lending a knowledgeable helping hand and volunteering his services to help out a Pard in need. We talk occasionally on the phone about Marlin 'stuff'. I would recommend his helping hand to anyone. He's genuinely a good feller to talk with on the phone. ..........Widder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 3J(JJJ) you are more than welcome. Easy fix. Don't forget to make the adjustment of the COAL to your ammo. Keep us post'd. OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jittery Jim Jonah, SASS #64913L Posted July 2, 2015 Author Share Posted July 2, 2015 UPDATE...... I visited Lumpy yesterday and we swapped out the existing extractor with one of his modified ones. Lumpy had never seen an extractor as large as the one that another gunsmith put in.... The rifle worked great with shorter rounds than I have been using so we figured I could just shorten the rounds a bit.... Today I tried that and found that since Lumpy is using .38SP cases and I use .357 cases I cannot seat the lead to the length of his rounds (1.475) and get any kind of crimp. I ordered a Slick extractor and will see what happens with that one. It is very frustrating that I can't get an extractor to feed what the rifle once fed with no trouble at all, at least we now know where to concentrate our efforts. More to come I am sure! P.S. Good thing I have a boatload of .38SP cases as well! JJJ-D :ph34r: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 JJJ-Before you go mess'n with the extractor. I say this, because the .38 Special ammo I gave you load'd at 1.475" COAL work'd so well in BOTH yours, and DJ's rifle(and every rifle I have ever used it in ) Load some of those 357 mag cases to 1.575" COAL(that the COAL of factory .357 Mags I have on hand) and try that. IF 'no-joy', then do the following...... BUY a BUNCH, of .38 Special cases and never have any concern again https://www.starlinebrass.com/brass-cases/38-Special-Brass/ $130.00 for 1K is a good deal for new 'brass'. BTW: The extractor I installed, was a stock early stamped/rolled formed Marlin extractor. Let me know- OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jittery Jim Jonah, SASS #64913L Posted July 4, 2015 Author Share Posted July 4, 2015 UPDATE #3 I went to the range this afternoon with rounds resized to 1.5 from 1.54 and tried this. (Couldn't go any shorter with the .357 brass and bullet without crimping problems). Deja's rifle ate them just fine but my rifle would not feed a one cleanly. It was much worse than the rounds at 1.54. We then tried some .38 cases at 1.475 which is what we tested at Lumpy's without firing. Both rifles cycled them fine although mine hung up just a tad on one round but went in OK. So at this point it looks like we will hafta go to .38 cases after almost 10 years cuz of the replaced extractor. Gonna try the .357 again when I get the Slick extractor. So there ya have it pards... JJJ-D :ph34r: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badger Mountain Charlie SASS #43172 Posted July 4, 2015 Share Posted July 4, 2015 I love it when it all comes together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted July 4, 2015 Share Posted July 4, 2015 UPDATE #3 I went to the range this afternoon with rounds resized to 1.5 from 1.54 and tried this. (Couldn't go any shorter with the .357 brass and bullet without crimping problems). Deja's rifle ate them just fine but my rifle would not feed a one cleanly. It was much worse than the rounds at 1.54. We then tried some .38 cases at 1.475 which is what we tested at Lumpy's without firing. Both rifles cycled them fine although mine hung up just a tad on one round but went in OK. So at this point it looks like we will hafta go to .38 cases after almost 10 years cuz of the replaced extractor. Gonna try the .357 again when I get the Slick extractor. So there ya have it pards... JJJ-D :ph34r: Bring'em both back out to me and I'll see if the extractor needs fitting, thanks to Marlin's 'generous' tolerances in manufacturing. Bring DJ too-She keeps you out of trouble(for the most part ) I have one stock extractor we can try also........ OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jittery Jim Jonah, SASS #64913L Posted July 7, 2015 Author Share Posted July 7, 2015 UPDATE.... The extractor installed by Lumpy was an old roll formed extractor that worked fine. Today I swapped out this one for the 'Slick' extractor. The rifle still will not feed .357 cases but feeds .38Sp just fine. I put the older 'Lumpy' extractor back in.... Here are pics of the slick extractor, interesting shape. http://s7.photobucket.com/user/jitteryjim/library/Marlin%20Trouble?sort=3&page=1 JJJ-D :ph34r: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 The bottom edge and nose of that extractor are way to sharp. They need to be round'd and polished so the cases's rim slides freely under the 'hook'. Those sharp edges are grab'n the case rim, and dig'n in like a knife edge. That's what's stop'n the round from chambering. Bring it and rifle and you 2 back out to our place, and lets see what can be done. Widder-What's your thoughts on this? OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 Widder-PLEASE do some house-keep'n. OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widder, SASS #59054 Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 Howdy Lumpy and JJJ. Originally, that 1-piece Extractor from Slick was alittle beefier. With luck, I was alittle involved in testing the original. During some initial testing, it was decided to make it less beefy and more suitable for that little hole it sits in with alittle movement allowed. I actually use one in my main match .32 but, I have slightly tweaked it, just like I do about everything on my rifles. The Extractor should be able to move back and forth inside that hole with minimum finger pressure. Actually, it should move backwards and the spring should move it forwards again. If you are having troubles with one type cartridge (.357) and not another (.38), it would be worthy to consider the info Lumpy has provided about that sharp tip on the hook (beak). In my experience, alittle kiss from a diamond file just might be enough to knock off a burr or sharp edge and allow proper feeding. Obviously, Lumpy has some good experience with this, plus he has some spare Extractors. You might want to let him check it out again. Hope everyone is doing well. ..........Widder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jittery Jim Jonah, SASS #64913L Posted July 8, 2015 Author Share Posted July 8, 2015 Thanx pards..... Nowhere else could I get so much good info and experience! Since I have a shoot this weekend I will use the rolled extractor, then I will work on the slick extractor. It is a one piece and it moves laterally very easily. I will try the in/out movement when it goes back. I do have very fine gunsmith files so I will work on the extractor and do more testing..... Won't be for a few days tho since I am running a BB gun range for a BSA district day camp this week... JJJ-D :ph34r: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 Offer still stands-Your more than welcome to come out before the weekend also. I have other extractors to try- JJJ-I would wrap that file with some 400 wet or dry and wet it with WD-40 to keep the pours open. Use that on the bottom edge and nose of the hook. OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 JJJ-What's the latest?? OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jittery Jim Jonah, SASS #64913L Posted July 13, 2015 Author Share Posted July 13, 2015 UPDATE!!! Went to RRBar for a 6 stage shoot today. It was a great day, not too hot and a great lunch! Nothing better than being able to have lunch in a large cool clubhouse! Anyway, to the subject at hand..... I did NOT have much luck with my marlin today. First round on the first stage caught..... so did two others out of 10. The next stage was the same thing on the first round and I had one round ejected when I tried to get the 7th round in.... Out of 6 stages I had one stage where there was no trouble. This is with the .38SP rounds. I was using the older round formed extractor. Tomorrow I am going to work on the Slick extractor and modify it slightly to see if I can get that one to work.... Deja's rifle handled the shorter rounds no trouble... AND it's gonna be awhile before I can get my hands on the latest Marlin I bought cuz I hafta get a new updated CA driver license showing my CURRENT address before I can do the paperwork.... I am just hoping I can get a rifle that works before the Divisional in October... JJJ-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Dang Was this with the .357 mag ammo? Your more than welcome to come over, and lets look it over again. I have other extractors to try. They were both work'n so well, when we did the cycle testing with Ima's .38 ammo, at 1.475" COAL. Give me a call- OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jittery Jim Jonah, SASS #64913L Posted July 14, 2015 Author Share Posted July 14, 2015 It was with .38SP ammo. Gonna modify the slick extractor tomorrow and go try it out.... JJJ-D :ph34r: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted July 14, 2015 Share Posted July 14, 2015 What was the COAL of that .38 ammo? Just lost as to WHY it work'd so well here. Now it's act'n up again-- Did you use the ammo I gave you? How did it work for live-fire in your rifle. OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jittery Jim Jonah, SASS #64913L Posted July 15, 2015 Author Share Posted July 15, 2015 Between 1.472 and 1.482. This is because of the mixed sources the brass came from and different makers. I sure hope I don't hafta recut all this brass too... JJJ-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jittery Jim Jonah, SASS #64913L Posted July 18, 2015 Author Share Posted July 18, 2015 UPDATE 7/16/15 I went to see Lumpy again and had a great visit! We tried I think about 4 different extractors and 3 different ejectors with not much luck..... Then we tried an OEM stock unmodified extractor and it appears to work! We fiddled with it just a bit and got it working about 99% with .38SP rounds ONLY..... Longer .357 rounds still won't feed correctly and slightly shorter ones were not much better. I took it home and live fired about 50 rounds through the rifle. The .38's fed just fine! Not so much the longer ones. THEN IT HAPPENED...... Several of the expended casings would not eject properly! They literally rotated 180 degrees and stayed on the carrier! It appears the ejector does not have enough tension to propel the shell out..... So the sage continues.... Oh, and Brownell's has extractors, ejectors, and ejector springs in stock! ( as of this morning 7/17/2015) JJJ-D :ph34r: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yul Lose Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 WOW, never had any of those issues with any of my Lightnings, go figure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACKFOOT SASS #11947 Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 Not ejecting? Could this possibly be OID? Just a thoght, Blackfoot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boon Doggle Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 WOW, never had any of those issues with any of my Lightnings, go figure. Ouch! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yul Lose Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 Ouch! Wasn't trying to stir things up, just stating a fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 WOW, never had any of those issues with any of my Lightnings, go figure. Go play in your sawdust---- OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 Not ejecting? Could this possibly be OID? Just a thoght, Blackfoot "OID"? JJJ and I are now convinced that this rifle is cursed. I have never had this much trouble get'n one to run 'rite'. He's come'n out again and we are head'd to the range for live-fire test'n---I'm also bring'n a BIG sledge hammer OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badger Mountain Charlie SASS #43172 Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 Sounds like a cutting torch would not be out of order. OR, maybe JJJ needs to slow down his cycling action. Ten rounds on target in three seconds is a bit over the top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACKFOOT SASS #11947 Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 OID===operator induced difficulty Blackfoot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace_of_Hearts Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 It appears the ejector does not have enough tension to propel the shell out..... The cases on a Marlin are ejected when the case is pulled back against the ejector. The ejector does not move inside the rifle. Tension on the ejector makes little difference in ejecting the case. Two obvious problems that cause cases to not eject.... 1 - Weak extractor 2 - Short stroking the lever 3 - cases falling off the bolt face. It appears, from the photos, that the bottom "shelf" on the bolt has been removed. This "shelf" holds empty case in position on the bolt face and keeps it from falling off the face of the bolt during extraction and lines up the round to feed into the chamber. Without the "shelf" the round will have a tendency to tip up and hang up on top when trying to chamber. You can relieve some of that problem with judicious relieving the sharp lip on the upper portion of the chamber entrance OR switch to truncated cone bullets. Has this rifle been converted to Widdermatic? It doesn't look like it has as the rounds are trying to feed relatively level. A Widdermatic gun is modified to feed at an angle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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