Roger Rapid Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 Anybody have any successful Trail Boss loads for a 45-70 pushing 405g bullets in a Springfield trapdoor? Please PM me - don't post data here... Thx. …RR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boon Doggle Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 All the data for Trail Boss can be found at: http://www.hodgdon.com. You might want to consider a 350g bullet for that rifle, with loads at the upper end of the recommendations. It could prove a little more comfortable to shoot. What ever you decide on, stay within the published limits for that particular powder. For your safety and the safety of others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sedalia Dave Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 Everything you need to know about loading Trail Boss for ANY cartridge can be found here. Accurately measure your case volume per the instructions, calculate the load, and have fun. TB is very sensitive to excessive case volume and will give poor and possibly dangerous results if you go below the minimum or maximum loads. Even full loads of TB in the 45-70 are mild. I would start at about the mid point between min and max and see how well your load patterns. If the load does not pattern well then up the charge 0.5 gr and try again. Once you have a load that gives a good pattern you can tweak it up or down to find your rifles sweet spot. My experience with an 1874 Sharps was that it needed a load almost at maximum to get the bullet to stabilize and hold a good pattern. YMMV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 Unique powder works very well for .45-70 'lite'- OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619 Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 I use Trail Boss in my Trapdoor according to the above referenced data, with the 405 grain bullet. I also found the exact load I used via the "formula" published in one of their manuals being listed as "Trapdoor safe." It makes for a very managable recoil in both an 1873 Trapdoor carbine, and a 20" Winchester 86. (Compared to the very stout and uncomfortable Remington factory load that is listed as Trapdoor safe." Traoll Boss is very useful for this caliber, and many others. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michigan Slim Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 I use the minimum listed charge of Varget for a 340 grain bullet (boolit) in my 74. My 14 year old daughter shoots those loads too. I also use an over powder card for both my 777 and Varget loadings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 I use the minimum listed charge of Varget for a 340 grain bullet (boolit) in my 74. My 14 year old daughter shoots those loads too. I also use an over powder card for both my 777 and Varget loadings. I sure hope you don't have any airspace with that card and Varget. Dang good way to 'ring' a chamber. OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michigan Slim Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 No more than any other smokeless load I shoot. I seat the card stuck to the bullet. No air space with 777. Slight compression as per the manual. Maybe a more accurate description would be an under bullet card? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Attica Jack #23953 Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 I tried using Trail Boss and 300 gr. bullets in both my Marlin lever gun, and my Sharps. I didn't like it, went back to my old Hodgdon 4198 and 405 bullet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michigan Slim Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 It was a great round to play with at shorter ranges and new shooters but to go 300 yards it had an arc like a basketball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Rapid Posted February 12, 2015 Author Share Posted February 12, 2015 Thanks all - Hodgdon site had what I needed for TB loads, but I couldn't find data previously. RR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michigan Slim Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 A ton of info there. They used to have a great Cowboy manual too. Still on the web. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Rapid Posted February 13, 2015 Author Share Posted February 13, 2015 Just an FYI --- Just tried Hodgdon's mid-range load for 45-70 with 405g bullet in original Springfield trapdoor. MV was 1020 (average of 5 shots) compared to 1370 from Pinnacle loads, and bench-rest groupings at 100 yards were modest (15"-18" and to the right) compared to results from Pinnacle (8"-10" groupings and pretty much dead on). …RR (Thanks all for pointing me to load data.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace_of_Hearts Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 You will find that shooting a spitzer bullet in a single shot will give you surprising accuracy at longer distances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dubious Don #56333 Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 I too was dissappointed with TB in 45-70. While the maximum loads performed better, they still weren't what I wanted. Accurate 5744 works much better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sedalia Dave Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Just an FYI --- Just tried Hodgdon's mid-range load for 45-70 with 405g bullet in original Springfield trapdoor. MV was 1020 (average of 5 shots) compared to 1370 from Pinnacle loads, and bench-rest groupings at 100 yards were modest (15"-18" and to the right) compared to results from Pinnacle (8"-10" groupings and pretty much dead on). …RR (Thanks all for pointing me to load data.) Your 45-70 should be shooting MUCH MUCH tighter groups than what you posted. Something is not right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Attica Jack #23953 Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Roger Rapid...those are not groups, maybe a shot gun blast. Both my Marlin and Sharps regularly shoot 3 inch groups at 200yds. shooting off of sticks. Check the bullet diameter and maybe slug your barrel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michigan Slim Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Even a trapdoor with it's open sights and an only decent barrel should group the size of your palm at 100. Wish you were closer so I could beat, uh look at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Rapid Posted February 13, 2015 Author Share Posted February 13, 2015 Gents… regarding the size of the groups, I'm sure it's much more about me than about the Springfield. I think both and I the gun could do better if I was a bit more patient and took a bit more time. I have a really nice regular (i.e. not CAS) range about a mile from the house that I often run to with a handful of rounds and a crono (as I did yesterday) just to check the effectiveness of some loads. I do agree that if I put more into it, both me and the Springfield would do much better… R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sedalia Dave Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 When working up loads keep an eye on the holes the bullets make as they go through the target. A lot of these old 45-70 guns and their reproductions have slow twist rates (my 1874 has a 1:18 twist) and lighter bullets don't stabilize well of they are going too slow. My testing of TB with 350 gr bullets resulted in unstable bullets and oblong holes in the target unless I had almost af full load of TB. The heavier bullets do better because the ratio of length to diameter is better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Sarge Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 My trapdoors prefer bullets in the 500 gr range. You might need to check your bore because I have one that only groups with .459 bullets. I can't help with the Trail Boss data. I use BP in mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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