CCW at the range

[Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L]

Our fairly large club (1,200+ members & 135 acres) in Illinois has addressed the concealed carry issue by stating that no loaded firearm may be present on the line - anywhere. If you come to the line, your CCW must be left in the vehicle or unloaded and placed on the line in a safe condition. We have 600yd, 25yd & 50ft indoor ranges, a myriad of outdoor competitive pistol and rifle ranges, and our "Cowboy Town" which is also used for other action type shooting. This is from the same people who marched in favor of the newly adopted law permitting this, and who would boycott a restaurant or store who had a no guns policy.

 

I feel there is a better way to construct a CCW policy, so they told me to write a new rule and submit it to the board.

 

I'm starting with "All properly licensed concealed carry guns must remain holstered or secured and may not be touched or handled while others are present unless training on a designated range. If your firearm becomes no longer concealed, you must remove it and place it in your vehicle or treat it as any other firearm and made safe. A Match Director, at his discretion, may temporarily suspend the carrying of loaded holstered firearms on a range that is reserved for a match or special event. Open carry away from a designated shooting line is prohibited"

 

I know I'll need to add a provision for match directors at organized events so they can have restrictions, but the argument is that a loaded gun is unsafe, no matter where it is. They dismiss my argument that it is no more dangerous than walking down the street or into the ice cream parlor with a gun on your hip or in a shoulder holster.

 

Please do not turn this into a gripe session. I would like to find out how your club addresses this issue and maybe receive some constructive language that would fly.

 

Thanks,

 

CR

[Turkey Creek Red, SASS # 22854]

CR,

 

At our range we have similar verbage to include " if your firearm becomes no longer concealed, you must remove it and place it in your vehicle".

 

Red

[Marlin Buckhorn,SASS 51727]

CR

 

Where did they build that 600yd indoor range. Want to try my derringer on that one.

 

Your friend,

Marlin

[Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L]

CR

 

Where did they build that 600yd indoor range. Want to try my derringer on that one.

 

Your friend,

Marlin

Can't believe you haven't seen it yet

[Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L]

CR,

 

At our range we have similar verbage to include " if your firearm becomes no longer concealed, you must remove it and place it in your vehicle".

 

Red

I like that language - Thanks

[Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217]

Hi Rick,

 

All I know is that there is, at Diamond Dick's Cowboy Town, a sign you see just before you leave the premises. It reminds CC holders to reload their guns. I could not find anything in the by-laws or on the range's Website about it.

 

Regards,

 

Allie

[Korupt Karl]

It is a growing concern. I would like to see a rule at most ranges that only committee members and law enforcement be able to carry. I would further state that no one be between the LT through the UT with a CCW regardless of who they are.. Just my too scents.

 

KK

[Tarheel Rifleman, SASS # 23477]

Here's the language from our club's safety rules.

 

"6.8 Members may carry a loaded holstered sidearm. A Match Director, at his discretion, may temporarily suspend the carrying of loaded holstered firearms on a range that is reserved for a match or special event."

 

"6.12 With the exception of holstered or legally concealed firearms, all firearms must be unloaded and made safe before they are removed from a vehicle, or removed from the firing line. It is suggested that prior to arriving at the range, shooters verify whether or not their firearms are loaded and arrive with unloaded firearms already made safe."

[Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L]

It is a growing concern. I would like to see a rule at most ranges that only committee members and law enforcement be able to carry. I would further state that no one be between the LT through the UT with a CCW regardless of who they are.. Just my too scents.

 

KK

KK,

 

I'm not sure about the first part, but I intend to submit language giving match directors authority to control CC guns for a given competition. The first part implies that you're not qualified to have a loaded gun, which is contrary to what the permit says. The Illinois boys have fought long and hard to confirm the right to carry.

 

CR

[Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L]

Here's the language from our club's safety rules.

 

"6.8 Members may carry a loaded holstered sidearm. A Match Director, at his discretion, may temporarily suspend the carrying of loaded holstered firearms on a range that is reserved for a match or special event."

 

"6.12 With the exception of holstered or legally concealed firearms, all firearms must be unloaded and made safe before they are removed from a vehicle, or removed from the firing line. It is suggested that prior to arriving at the range, shooters verify whether or not their firearms are loaded and arrive with unloaded firearms already made safe."

More good stuff - Thanks Check the original post for updates.

 

CR

[Springfield Slim SASS #24733]

Seems counter to what we believe to have anti-gun laws at a range. Gun guys bitch and moan about stores and restaurants that have "no CC guns allowed", but then do the same thing at their range.

[Henry T Harrison]

Run don't walk from that range, I did when the club I belonged to for over 30 years instituted that crap. My carry gun stays on me and stays loaded

[Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L]

Hi Rick,

 

All I know is that there is, at Diamond Dick's Cowboy Town, a sign you see just before you leave the premises. It reminds CC holders to reload their guns. I could not find anything in the by-laws or on the range's Website about it.

 

Regards,

 

Allie

Reminds me of the scene in Silverado when Emmet (Scott Glen) was practicing and shot all his guns dry, then got bushwhacked.

 

CR

[Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L]

Run don't walk from that range, I did when the club I belonged to for over 30 years instituted that crap. My carry gun stays on me and stays loaded

We are in negotiations. The annual meeting is looming, and I'm sure there will be a loud response for those who are just discovering this new policy. I am trying to be a conduit for changing the language to something less onerous.

 

CR

[Bad Hand]

Run don't walk from that range, I did when the club I belonged to for over 30 years instituted that crap. My carry gun stays on me and stays loaded

Do you show empty at the unloading table?

[Henry T Harrison]

Do you show empty at the unloading table?

[/quote

Apples and oranges My cowboy guns are not my ccw guns If I go to the range to practice or sight a gun in my ccw is loaded

[Grizzly Dave]

The safest place for a gun in on your hip.

 

Any gun I am going to shoot at the range on a given day will be unloaded and conform to the cold range mandate. Now as to a CCW that won't be used that day, don't ask, I won't tell.

 

edit to the OP

you could add in the verbage that any CCW to be used, or one that has left concealment must be made safe to adhere to cold range policy and may not be re-concealed loaded until shooter has left the range. That may pacify some folks, but honestly, which is safer, loading, chanbering a round and holstering on a controlled firing line, or behind the wheel of your vehicle?

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

Don't ask-Don't tell.

It's call'd "concealed" for a reason---

OLG

[Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971]

The range that I am an officer of prohibits carrying of loaded guns by both CCW permit holders and LEOs - no exceptions. Member guidelines do not address loaded handguns left in vehicles. Those wishing to practice with their carry guns are told to bring the unloaded to the range and reload them after they leave the range. The range is not anti-gun. We just need to comply with the requirements of our insurance policy.

[Echeconnee Drifter]

I'm not a big fan of requiring CCW guns to be unloaded on ranges, but I can understand if there are insurance concerns and the like.

 

I like your idea of "unconcealed, put it in the car" as a decent compromise.

 

Every so often I'll go to my local range, setup, then draw my pistol from concealment, aim, and fire. Practice makes perfect, and I am a firm believer in practicing that particular skill set. I'm not sure how you can practice that if concealed firearms aren't allowed on the range.

 

How about some verbage such as "concealed firearms on the range must remain holstered at all times, except when at the firing line and using the concealed gun." If your range has some provision like "only one loaded firearm at a time", you can waive that requirement for concealed firearms for as long as they remain concealed and holstered. Any use of the CCW gun at the range should result in it being treated like any other firearm. Once you're no longer using it, it should be put away safely and not brought back out.

[Toranado, SASS # 58447]

This similar topic was brought up at my club when Illinois decided to go CCW. Some "odd" leaders wanted to ban CCW on club property until common sense prevailed and the question was posed as does a Gun club want to be the first in Illinois to post a no CCW sign??????

 

Here's kinda where we settled.

Loaded firearms are not permitted anywhere on the property without a Concealed Carry
License, except on the firing line.
4. Concealed Carry Firearms are prohibited while participating in any match (IDPA,
USPSA, Multi-Gun, PPC, Cowboy, etc). CC Firearm must be unloaded and cased.

 

So basically if your participating in a match, keep your CCW in the car. If not, fine if in concealment (and your a CCW card holder)

 

Again your a GUN club and if we say their not safe there, then wait till the anti's get ahold of a rule that a gun club says CCW is not safe at a GUN CLUB. We came to far to get where we are to not support.

[Michigan Slim]

I unload my Derringer when I get to the range and load it when I reenter my vehicle. My 1911 stays in the vehicle -loaded. I do not have an issue with a cold range, outside of my vehicle.

[Spittoon O Tool SASS #62053]

What are the hazards, concerns, issues with someone who has a licensed CCW being on the range grounds?

 

Spittoon

[Jefro, SASS#69420]

From the BGC

A. BGC is a COLD RANGE. Firearms must be UNLOADED and in SAFE (actions open, magazines removed) position prior to removing them from vehicles, during transportation around the club facilities or between shooting postions, and prior to leaving the firing line. DO NOT walk around BGC with a loaded firearm.

 

B. SAFE LOADING AND UNLOADING AREAS of range-Each range area has a designated "safe" area for loading, unloading, cleaning and dealing with firearm malfunction.......

 

C. CONCEALED CARRY-BGC is a "COLD RANGE". This means that firearms must be UNLOADED and in SAFE (actions open, magazines removed) position prior to removing them from vehicles, during transportation around the club facilities or between shooting postions, and prior to leaving the firing line. DO NOT walk around BGC displaying a loaded firearm.

 

Personal concealed carry while on BGC property is permitted by those who are currently licensed for concealed carry in NC or another state with NC licensure reciprocity. We ask that those choosing to carry concealed while at BGC do so in a discreet (concealed!) manner and require that any CC firearms not being actively trained with remain either locked in your vehicles or safely holstered and out of sight to avoid any confusion over the cold range rules and determining who may or may not be CC permitted.

 

 

Open Carry of firearms-Although it is permitted in the state of NC, in the interest of uniform enforcement of COLD RANGE rules, OPEN CARRY of a loaded firearm is NOT allowed on the grounds of BGC (ie: openly dispalyed loaded firearms are permitted only on an active firing line).

 

Jefro Relax-Enjoy

[Happy Jack, SASS #20451]

At my range we only run a cold range for those matches that require it. (SASS, IDPA, USPSA, 3gun). IF you have a concealed permit and your firearm is concealed that is fine. Only the firearms actually being used during the match need to comply with the "cold range" rule. For our other programs such as military taining, etc. we run a HOT range.

[Noah Cash]

At our range If the R/O can see it it must be cleared and tabled open when the range is cold. If it IS concealed as it should be it is a " NO CALL". Dont touch it during the cold range. We do not allow drawing from a holster and firing, unless at a match or event that requires it. The general public shooting must be off the table.

[Blastmaster]

interesting and never thought about it.

 

Take Concealed gun off at car and strap on two unconcealed guns on at a SASS match. When finished with SASS, then put concealed gun back on at car and drive away.

 

I don't need a concealed firearm in waist band to push out my gun belt/holsters or SG belt for an gamey advantage.

 

Nothing like seeing like minded pards doing the same thing at the trunk of their cars (exchanging fun guns for serious/business guns).

 

For spectators, if I can see their firearm, then it isn't concealed and thus,,,, move on or take gun off and store in vehicle. But wait, hardly any visitors to make an issue out of.

[Red River Ray SASS#33254]

I am with Springfield Slim. I get e mails from grass roots NC weekly about. This an that restaurant that has NO CCW weapons allowed posted they want everyone to call an demand it be changed.

First thing I see entering my clubs range. NO CCW allowed COLD RANGE.

That's got to be the stupidest rule there ever was. If one would dig just a little into it I promise an idiot will be found with pin in hand!!!!!

 

 

RRR

[Henry T Harrison]

If we claim it's safe to carry a loaded gun into Kroger and then say it's not safe or allowed at a shooting range isn't that the height of hypocrisy? I bet the anti's are laughing their asses off over this.

BTW I always carry my ccw gun lying on a table, yes I do so it's the best way to practice.

I sure am glad I have my own range

[Houston CAS]

Seems counter to what we believe to have anti-gun laws at a range. Gun guys bitch and moan about stores and restaurants that have "no CC guns allowed", but then do the same thing at their range.

 

Exactly.

[Flush Draw]

I admit I am in the 'that's stupid boat'

Its called concealed for a reason and of all the places to not be able to conceal! I wish you the best of luck with this Cowboy Rick!

[Fast Enuff]

Our range has some very strict rules, and even they are very sensible about CCW.

 

They welcome you to carry your concealed weapon legally per state laws, but it must stay concealed. If at any time it stops being concealed, all range rules apply to the gun.

 

We have 5000 members. No one feels uncomfortable with this. Heck, I'd be willing to bet around 50% of the people around me on any given day there are carrying while shooting their other firearms.

 

Far from being uncomfortable... it's about the safest place to be in the whole state.

[Gunner Gatlin, SASS 10274L]

Seems counter to what we believe to have anti-gun laws at a range. Gun guys bitch and moan about stores and restaurants that have "no CC guns allowed", but then do the same thing at their range.

 

My thoughts as well

 

GG ~

[Straight Arrow Hombre]

I'm very fortunate to belong to a club with sensible rules and sensible folks in the rule making positions.

[Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L]

I'm very fortunate to belong to a club with sensible rules and sensible folks in the rule making positions.

 

 

 

My thoughts as well

 

GG ~

 

 

Seems counter to what we believe to have anti-gun laws at a range. Gun guys bitch and moan about stores and restaurants that have "no CC guns allowed", but then do the same thing at their range.

 

Exactly why I'm lobbying to get the rules changed

 

CR