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Don’t understand the restriction on loading data


Nickel City Dude

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I recently posted in a thread and included my loading data. I was politely told that it is against the rules on the SASS board to post this kind a data. I was told that some people might get there data wrong and this could lead to problems for others that might want to use the data. I edited my post because I wouldn’t want to break any rules but I have to respectfully disagree with this rule.

I belong to several boards such as Shotgunworld.com and N-SSA.org and we are always exchanging loading data such as powder charges and settings on our presses and the like. In fact Shotgunworld.com has an entire forum dedicated to reloading. I don’t understand why this board doesn’t have a section solely devoted to reloading so we can help each other out with recipes and other reloading data along with helpful tips on the presses we use. If we can be trusted with guns then we should be trusted with information. I should think that there is enough intelligence among us members to understand and use loading recipes and data responsibly.

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If this were a private forum it might be allowed, but it's not. Pretty much anything you type can be viewed by anyone; except for PM and a couple of private areas.

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NCD,

 

its just one of those guidelines we have to adhere by.

 

We don't own this website or forum. It belongs to The Wild Bunch and they have established certain guidelines which they have deemed appropriate.

 

That being stated, it DOES NOT prohibit you or me from sending loading data to each other via a PM (Personal Message/Private Message), which is available as a part of this website.

 

The Wild Bunch has just ask us NOT to post load data on the open forums.

 

I must also say that doesn't prohibit anyone from stating they use Clays powder and prefer a 158 grain bullet. The Wild Bunch just doesn't want us to list specific load data, thats all.

 

 

..........Widder

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If this were a private forum it might be allowed, but it's not. Pretty much anything you type can be viewed by anyone; except for PM and a couple of private areas.

 

Shotgunworld.com and N-SSA.org are not private boards either. They are open to the public to view all that is posted there. You have to register to post but you can read all the posts as a guest which is the same setup we have on this board.

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Some of the things that got loading data restricted.

 

1. In the past a lot of reloading in cas was done below published manufacturer recommended data.

2. Cowboys are prone to mistyping and abbreviating things that should be spelled out.

3. Threads were being retyped on other threads and typed incorrectly.

Example would be 5.5 grains would be typed 55 grains or .55 grains.

4. There was in the past a couple of years where there were several cylinders and top straps removed upon discharge at the range.

Don't remember ever hearing what the cause was. Just speculation

 

When the SASS Forum was first started, one of the first restrictions was, "No Loading Data on the Forum" and This is a family sport and forum, conduct yourself accordingly.

 

Using the argument that "they do it over on the other forum(s)," will not fly here.

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I don't agree with the restriction-But, it's not 'my-house' either---

 

LG

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What Cliff Hanger said.

 

One word: Liability. When your name is on the dotted line of the potential lawsuit, you get to make the rules.

 

You can thank our ligitious society and our glut of lawyers.

 

Tort reform is badly needed on so many fronts, this is one, medical is another....

 

Harvey

Who has run a not-for-porfit corporation and been to court.

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Using the argument that "they do it over on the other forum(s)," will not fly here.

 

So what you are saying is that experience on other boards should not be considered here? So if on the other boards they found that there was a problem no one should use that knowledge? By the same token why can’t we look at other board and learn from them? Having loading data on other boards has not been a problem, so why not here? Are there any documented cases where loading data on this or any other board has been directly related to a problem?

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NCD,

Whether or not YOU agree or disagree is immaterial. The powers that be at SASS determined load data pubically traded, is a liability they could do without. The rule is what it is. Just live with it and enjoy the wire within it's guidelines.

 

Coffinmaker

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NCD,

Whether or not YOU agree or disagree is immaterial. The powers that be at SASS determined load data pubically traded, is a liability they could do without. The rule is what it is. Just live with it and enjoy the wire within it's guidelines.

 

Coffinmaker

So this is akin to ebay’s restriction on guns and gun parts and paypal’s attitude about using there service to pay for guns or gun parts. They have there rules and we have to abide by them weather they make sense or not?

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So what you are saying is that experience on other boards should not be considered here? So if on the other boards they found that there was a problem no one should use that knowledge? By the same token why can’t we look at other board and learn from them? Having loading data on other boards has not been a problem, so why not here? Are there any documented cases where loading data on this or any other board has been directly related to a problem?

That's about the size of it, if you want to post loading data on all those other boards, have at it. The owners here have decreed that loading data can't be posted. Their forum their rules, live with it.

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So this is akin to ebay’s restriction on guns and gun parts and paypal’s attitude about using there service to pay for guns or gun parts. They have there rules and we have to abide by them weather they make sense or not?

Like has been said-It's not 'your-house'. :rolleyes:

You can share load data via PM.

No one forced you to sign up on this forum- ;)

LG

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So this is akin to ebay’s restriction on guns and gun parts and paypal’s attitude about using there service to pay for guns or gun parts. They have there rules and we have to abide by them weather they make sense or not?

 

NCD,

 

I don't know about ebays restriction and such. But this I do know: This website is own by the Wild Bunch. Our SASS dues/membership does not give us ownership. If and when we refuse to play by the Wire rules/guidelines, a Moderator can ban us. Its a freebee for us to converse with one another about things we like and things we dislike.

 

The Wild Bunch doesn't have to explain to any of us WHY they have certain rules/guidelines for Wire usage. Its their house.

 

 

..........Widder

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So this is akin to ebay’s restriction on guns and gun parts and paypal’s attitude about using there service to pay for guns or gun parts. They have there rules and we have to abide by them weather they make sense or not?

Uh............yes.

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So this is akin to ebay’s restriction on guns and gun parts and paypal’s attitude about using there service to pay for guns or gun parts. They have there rules and we have to abide by them weather they make sense or not?

 

Ya know, You are free to start your own forum and do exactly what you wish with it, kind of what the wild bunch is doing with their forum. Not sure why you are so irritated about their rules.

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There are always gonna be some rules that we may not understand or even disagree with. But, thems ARE the rules, and we function well with them. Nothing wrong with saying, "I disagree with rule X and think it should be change," but you still need to be respectful of the fact that it IS the rule and abide by it.

 

When the time comes to discuss various rules and such, you can advocate for a change you want. I am sure that most of us, if pressed, could come up with *something* that we would like to see be different, but in the end accepting the things as they are does work. When discussing rule changes, they need to be very carefully considered, especially if there is any safty concern to them, either real or assumed.

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On the flip side of posting loading data not touched on yet. I do not know you. So as yet, I do not trust you Nickel City, and, Dude, there is no way in heck I'm using your data. Call me odd, but there it is.

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The whole thing comes right down to LIABILITY. As an example of what could happen.

Joe Smo posts a load data with a typo as stated earlier........55gr instead of 5.5gro

A reader of the forum who is not a member of the forum and new to reloading, uses the load data.

His gun blows up in his hand and he looses a couple fingers.

Now he gets a lawyer and sues both the forum owner and the guy who posted the data.

That can get very costly for the forum owner thus shutting down a good forum.

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I do have one observation. There was a time that load data was allowed to be posted and I remember seeing a suggested load for .38-55 that far exceeded published maximum loads. But, several other members caught the mistake and posted, pointing this out, kind of a peer review. Now those same load suggestions go by private message with no chance for others to catch and "red flag" the bad data.

 

I would certainly caution against using any load received by PM unless it can be found in the permissible range in published data.

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I do have one observation. There was a time that load data was allowed to be posted and I remember seeing a suggested load for .38-55 that far exceeded published maximum loads. But, several other members caught the mistake and posted, pointing this out, kind of a peer review. Now those same load suggestions go by private message with no chance for others to catch and "red flag" the bad data.

 

I would certainly caution against using any load received by PM unless it can be found in the permissible range in published data.

Excellent advice............

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Why would you ask for or post loading data in the first place. They're is so much info out there from the powder companies about low to high limits why would you take a chance on someone's loading formula if you don't even know them?? :wacko: Rye

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On the flip side of posting loading data not touched on yet. I do not know you. So as yet, I do not trust you Nickel City, and, Dude, there is no way in heck I'm using your data. Call me odd, but there it is.

Yep!

 

With that thought, how about being the TO and you are standing very close to that newbies guns with newbie reloads that he got off the internet? KABOOM!

 

Reloading CAS loads is about as simple as can be. There are numerous manuals by bullet/powder companies that list max/min loads for all the CAS legal ammo. Pick one. Accuracy and power factors are not very strict in this game so about anything within the manuals will work.

 

If one can not follow a simple rule of not posting reloading data on the Wire, then I can only imagine what other rules will not sit well.

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On the flip side to this, even though we cannot post the load data here, being able to talk to Pards over PM about load data is still very helpful here, heck I still have PM's from Lumpy Grits and Michigan Slim about 44 mag loads that I save in my Inbox, and use the data quite frequently for 12 ga, 44 Mag, etc. (seeing as how my wife Dixie Roase shoots nothing but 44 Mags).

 

BD

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So this is akin to ebay’s restriction on guns and gun parts and paypal’s attitude about using there service to pay for guns or gun parts. They have there rules and we have to abide by them weather they make sense or not?

I would not use data posted by you. Reason: you might make a mistake in spelling weather (whether) you like it or not. One or two letters can change the whole meaning of a post. kR

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You would think it would be a simple matter; you use a load posted on a message board without doing due diligence and checking to see if it's a safe load and disassemble your gun by sudden, rapid means it sucks to be you. No liability on anyone but the user who caused his own trouble by being foolish.

 

But that's not how the world works.

 

Which is why some places do not allow loading data to post on forums that can be read by the public (which of course means us too). One less thing to worry about.

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I always take into account the veracity of the poster before following any advice on this board. As has been stated, this is simply the rule that the PTB have inacted. The reasons are not ours to know. I will point out though that it's ironic that this board owned by the WB does not allow posting of data, the sister board "Wild Bunch Forum" has no such restriction.

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As the original poster I want to make it clear that even though I don’t agree with the rule I will abide by it. (at least until it is changed).

The only reason I posted about this in the first place is that this rule sounded to me to be an unnecessary rule and I wanted to get the opinions of others on the forum about it. My world won’t come to an end if I can’t post loading data I was just making a point. Happy trails to all that contributed either way to this thread.

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Way I see it is if someone asks me to not smoke cigars in their house, I shouldn't smoke cigars in their house. Heck, my own wife won't allow me to smoke cigars inside "our" (read her) house. If I wish to keep peace in the family and a warm bed at night, I smoke cigars outside the house.

 

Since this forum isn't my house, but belongs to someone else, I have to obey their house rules and not smoke cigars in their living room. The owners of this website and the folks who set the rules have stated no specific load data to be shared and that's their rules. I have 2 choices, respect their rules or go elsewhere where I can smoke cigars inside. I kind of like the Pards here so, I obey.

 

Guitar Slinger.

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Interesting thread - as was mentioned before - there are TONS AND TONS of reloading data available for free (basically) from manufacturers.

 

Follow those recipes and you will be a safer shooter and reloader.

 

- BB

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Howdy,

This is a rule from day one. No reloading details. General info ok.

Just like all classifieds have prices, no auctions.

Could have auctions, could have reloading info could have five strikes in baseball.......

Best

CR

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