Mad Dog Jack, SASS #77862 Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 I was watching Fox News ( Outnumbered) this am and they had a piece on how the government put race and ethnicity boxes on the form filled out to buy a gun.Anyone bought a gun recently enough to see this? Nobody on the show had any concrete info on the why, they just pointed out its existence and their confusion. Anyone? There is more, see post 31 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 Saw that too-- I ASSume, it's on the 4473 form. Can any FFL's out there confirm this? LG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alpo Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 It's a big to-do about nothing. As long as I've been filling out 4473s, from '75 on, one of the questions has been "RACE". What they have done now is added a sub-block - Are You Hispanic---Yes or No. Question 10 is now 10a (Hispanic) and 10b (Race). https://www.atf.gov/files/forms/download/atf-f-4473-1.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alpo Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 Wonder if Zimmerman might be the cause of that? 'Cause, you know, he was a "White Hispanic". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ya Big Tree Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 Form 4473 Line 10a. Ethnicity: Hispanic or Latino or Not Hispanic or Latino Line 10b. Race: American Indian or Alaska Native, Black or African American, Asian, Native Hawaiian or Other Pascfic Islander, White. Those are your boxes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irish ike, SASS #43615 Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 I always check other, and write in "American". But I'm weird. Ike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jittery Jim Jonah, SASS #64913L Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 AND if you don't answer these two new questions added by the Obama adminstration the FFL dealer gets fined! JJJ-D :ph34r: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tascosa, SASS# 24838 Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 Whats next? Whether we eat meat or are a veggian? But those race questions have been there since I bought my last firearm..way back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cat Brules Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 hispanics don't have a spot on the census form. therefore, they are white by definition. many mexicans don't like that, so under race they stated, "put me down as "mexican." la raza and all that crap anyway, even asking the question is racist. can one be racist if they are not speaking ill of someone's race, but rather their ethnicity? would that person be called an ethnicist? (hmmm. i might have that backwards...that might be the la raza jerks.) Geez, Mad Dog, I believe I'll have another beer and think this one over a bit more. Maybe I'll text Eric Holder and see what he thinks? He still has my lawn mower, anyway. Lesseee, what if I.........? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Scatterbrain Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 I have seen this from time to time on various forms in the military, and on some job applications. First a yes/no question as to your hispanicness, then a multiple-choice ethnicity question. Apparently there is a difference between white hispanics and, Idunno, normal whites? Regular whites? Standard whites? Just more racism in the name of stamping out racism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alpo Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 hispanics don't have a spot on the census form. therefore, they are white by definition. many mexicans don't like that, so under race they stated, "put me down as "mexican." la raza and all that crap anyway, even asking the question is racist. can one be racist if they are not speaking ill of someone's race, but rather their ethnicity? would that person be called an ethnicist? (hmmm. i might have that backwards...that might be the la raza jerks.) Geez, Mad Dog, I believe I'll have another beer and think this one over a bit more. Maybe I'll text Eric Holder and see what he thinks? He still has my lawn mower, anyway. Lesseee, what if I.........? Really? 'Cause when I was a Census Taker, in 1980, "Latino" was one of the blocks. I remember distinctly, as I asked this one old gentleman what his race was, and he said, "Mexican", and as I was checking the block I said, "Latino", and he corrected me sharply. "No. MEXICAN!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hacker, SASS #55963 Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 This is not exactly new. Please note that at the bottom of the form it does state Revised April 2012. It was not like that on the previous form version. New circa April 2012. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Bullweed Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 Buy pre-1899 guns and stay off the grid. No questions other than are you who you say you are and do you have the money. If the guns are wisely bought and cared for they go up in value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hacker, SASS #55963 Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 Buy pre-1899 guns and stay off the grid. No questions other than are you who you say you are and do you have the money. If the guns are wisely bought and cared for they go up in value. Not all purchases are on the grid now.....Assuming that the NICS system doesn't keep track longer than permitted by law and that the ATF or other LEO doesn't visit the store where you bought the gun and/or did the background check. Of course that is for those where background checks are required. Some states don't require a background check for person to person in state transfers. CO does. There are also those 80% finished lower frames. They appear not be on the grid either. (note appear) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Dog Jack, SASS #77862 Posted September 19, 2014 Author Share Posted September 19, 2014 Well, it's been awhile since I filled out a 4473, but I do recall the race question. Wonder why, and why now, the Hispanic/ Latino- non Hispanic/Latino breakdown other than just because they could.... But then mine is not to wonder why, mine is but to do or die, I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGT. QUINCANNON, SASS #32999 Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 I always check "Other", and write in, "North Atlantic Islander". Gets 'em thinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodo Posted September 20, 2014 Share Posted September 20, 2014 I check other name put Atlantic Islander let him figure that one out! Which is actually true! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hacker, SASS #55963 Posted September 20, 2014 Share Posted September 20, 2014 AND if you don't answer these two new questions added by the Obama adminstration the FFL dealer gets fined! JJJ-D :ph34r: It really is only ONE new question. Ethnicity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Mo Hare, SASS #45984 Posted September 20, 2014 Share Posted September 20, 2014 Arabs are Caucasian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoken D Posted September 20, 2014 Share Posted September 20, 2014 I have to check "White" and "African American". Heritage goes back to Africa. 30% of the folks from there have my skin color, oh well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hacker, SASS #55963 Posted September 20, 2014 Share Posted September 20, 2014 Arabs are Caucasian The options for 10b don't include caucasian. It includes American Indian or Alaska Native, Black or African American, White, Asian OR Native Hawaiian or other pacific islander. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rye Miles #13621 Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 The problem is Hispanic is not a race!! They just figured that out and added hispanic or non-hispanic to hook up with the race you are. How Hispanic got to be a race was a left wing liberal idea to get more democrat voters! I have a cousin who married a guy who's family was from Spain. He is a USA born Spanish American, now he's Hispanic! OY!!!!! BTW he's got blue eyes and light brown hair! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hacker, SASS #55963 Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 That is why 10a Ethnicity looking at Hispanic or latino Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poet Jones 99980 Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 The problem is Hispanic is not a race!! They just figured that out and added hispanic or non-hispanic to hook up with the race you are. How Hispanic got to be a race was a left wing liberal idea to get more democrat voters! I have a cousin who married a guy who's family was from Spain. He is a USA born Spanish American, now he's Hispanic! OY!!!!! BTW he's got blue eyes and light brown hair! Yup. It's just a made up term to lump all of us with spanish speaking background into one pile. They should just put African American or European American or Asian American....or better yet...American or not. Not American? ...no gun for you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Scatterbrain Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 White is not really a race either, or at least nobody can agree who is and is not white. And what diff does it make anyway? If you are not prohibited then you are not prohibited. Why does the govt so desperately need to know your ethnicity, when that same question is specifically prohibited in other contexts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alpo Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 I think y'all paranoia is running rampant. The purpose of the 4473 (just ask any ATF agent, and they'll agree with this) is to allow the cops to track down the purchaser of the gun used in the crime. They call Ruger, Ruger says they sold it to Davidsons, Davidsons says they sold it to Sports South, Sports South says they sold it to Gun Fun, and Gun Fun says they sold it to Alpo, and here's his description. They go to the house to talk to me, and Amarillo Slim answers the door (I hope I'm remembering his alias correctly). He says that he is Alpo, and what do they want. They say, "Well sir, I can see that you might be 250 pounds, but according to this, Alpo is 5'11", just under 60, and white. You appear to be 7-foot or more, closer to 70, and black." (I'm pretty sure that Amarillo Slim is Kareem Abdul Jabbar) Something is not right here. The cops just want to know they are looking for a 6-foot tall, 180 pound, 30 year old white guy, when the 5-foot tall, 260 pound 50 year old Japanese dude answers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pay Dirt Norvelle #90056 Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 I am half Mexican so I guess I put white the first time and the next time I buy a gun I put Hispanic. The makes it even-right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramblin Gambler Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 The race question is not new, it's been on the form since it came into existence (assuming it came into existence with the brady act). From the first time I saw it, I couldn't believe no one raised a stink about it. When they called for the authorization, the initial yes or no was given based on your name and race only. Well, maybe also your height and weight. I bought 2 guns within a year after that act passed, and talked to both dealers about the process. Both told me that other races were getting denied or told to wait at a much higher clip than whites. One told me that if a customer was mixed, or unsure he advised them to check white and things went a lot smoother. I have expected fireworks from that question on the form for a long time, but I expected it from people like the ACLU and NAACP. Now, I'm disappointed that when the fireworks came, it came over something so dumb as adding a column for hispanic. Race and SSN were originally optional (I think SSN still is), but the dealer had to make his best guess and fill in the race if you refused it like I did. I always write in 'Native American' when asked my ethnicity, and if it's not an option, leave it blank (this is on any form, not just the 4473) but for those of us who do that, be aware that the dealer is supposed to fix it. Or, so I've been told by dealers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hacker, SASS #55963 Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 I thought Kareem was Trinidad Slim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alpo Posted September 24, 2014 Share Posted September 24, 2014 Could be. I read an article about him, in some magazine (Gun of the Old West?) several years ago. Had a pic of him dressed up. Looked like he belonged in Buffalo Bill's Wild West. FANCY cowboy clothes. But, like I said, SEVERAL years ago. I'm surprised I remembered "Slim". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Dog Jack, SASS #77862 Posted September 24, 2014 Author Share Posted September 24, 2014 But WAIT! There's more. Saw some more reporting on Fox about this. Sorry can't link to it...but they did say some questions about race have been there since 1968 and the ethnicity (10A) part was added in 2012, "quietly". Also that questions about race and ethnicity were "forced" on. ACLU is involved and a bill to remove the questions has been proposed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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