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Painted Filly

How to Make Current Dresses/Blouses Ok for B-Western?

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What prevents that on day 2?

Hi Tyrel,

 

It could be done. However, that doesn't help for compliance of other (non costume restrictive) categories, like FC. The intent of my suggestion was to make category adherence uniform for all categories. Besides, see my previous post from the RO II booklet.

 

Regards,

 

Allie Mo

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How about this? "Ladies may wear skirts, split skirts or dresses. The bodice of the dress must conform to the same rules as the shirts do. They must have a defined waist. Mexican clothing is not allowed"

 

That is pretty simple I think.

 

As a TO, I can judge someone based on that.

 

However, you may want to specifiy what type of Mexican clothing is not allowed, or, does this mean that highly decorated bolero jackets and such with an appropriate shirt underneath would not be allowed...Thinking ala Cisco Kid or Three Amigos...or perhaps that is the intent???

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This has gotten so out of control it is unbelievable. So I am going to put my 2 cents worth in.

I do not shoot the B-Western category. But if you are going to shoot in a costume category you better be ready to follow the rules that are laid out for the category. If you want to put a drees in the category then make sure that it meets all the requirements of the ladies shirt and skirt. But make sure it it fancy and blingy. If you don't agree with that then shoot another category.

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The ROC is open to suggestions from the self-appointed BW experts here on the WIRE.

...within the following parameters:

BW-STYLE DRESSES ARE LEGAL

DEFINITION/DESCRIPTION

 

Let's see if you can come up with an easily understood, short amendment to the current rule.

(something better than the shield/bib shirt statement...PLEASE!)

 

REF: THE OLD CORRAL b-westerns.com

Make it so the dress has to comply the same as the Ladies B-Western Shirts and Skirts and that should fix the problem. The Pictures on the above are good examples. Use common sense,

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Is it safe to say that the following are indicitive of what you are saying.

 

file_465.jpg

 

jalisco-mexico-dress02.jpg

I don't think the first one even comes close to being B-Western. The second one doesn't either. It

's Mexican

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Jack,

 

Those are very pretty. One has embroidery, the other has trims and fringe. They are both flashy and fancy.

 

I wonder, is a Spanish Senorita (the persona I can see wearing these) BW? :unsure: I think, if not, maybe it should be stated that Mexican costumes are or are not allowed. I've known a couple of male BW shooters wearing the following type of costume. If it's okay, then so should the lady's be okay. They sure add sparkle.

 

I honestly never gave the appropriateness of Mexican or dresses any thought before recently.

 

boy1b.jpg

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I likethis couple

 

faeddae7ab9e21bf1668b8436f238f8d.jpg

 

Some of these photos... It is hard to tell if it is a dress or a skirt and shirt. Especially with the decorative belts many of them had.

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Following the rules is a good thing, the right thing to do.

 

But likewise, those enforcing the rules must enforce those rules as written.

 

As we have seen in the life of this thread on the subject of dresses, some thought they were not allowed, others had no reason to believe that they were not allowed. The ROC determined that yes they are allowed and issued a correction of an oversight ruling.

 

Some have a definition of 'B-Western Style' that indicates that anything Mexican is not B-Western style. I just searched the handbooks and find no definition of 'B-Western Style.' Likewise I searched the internet and find no published definition.

 

I caution people, especially those in a position to be enforcing costume rules, not to hold people accountable for your own personal definition of what B-Western Style is. Just as we have seen with the issue on dresses, one persons understanding may well be contrary to another person's.

 

Perhaps those who hold to a very specific definition should lobby the TGs to pass a definition that can be published in the handbooks so that it is clear to everyone just what is meant within the confines of SASS B-Western costuming by the term 'B-Western Style.'

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Patsy Cline had some nice ones. Again, some were one piece dresses while others were shirt and skirt. Really hard to tell.

 

This red one does not have a well defined waist from its cut, but does use a belt to gather the dress in. You remove the belt and the dress is going to hang pretty straight until the flare at the end.

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Patsy Cline had some nice ones. Again, some were one piece dresses while others were shirt and skirt. Really hard to tell.

 

This red one does not have a well defined waist from its cut, but does use a belt to gather the dress in. You remove the belt and the dress is going to hang pretty straight until the flare at the end.

IMO, a defined waist exists due to the belt. If I got asked to call it. I'd say okay for BW.

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IMO, a defined waist exists due to the belt. If I got asked to call it. I'd say okay for BW.

 

IF the rule is written including that a dress must have a defined waist. Otherwise, heck yeah I would say that's BW

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I must be living under a rock, I haven't seen a problem anywhere I've shot, with BW that is, except for the occasional 73 rifle...

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PBCC, I realize that part of their concern may be that they are encountering dress that may be inappropriate per the rules. But I agree that those should be dealt with on a case by case basis at the range based on the rules.

 

Don't write more rules when you can deal with the issue by enforcing the existing ones.

 

Otherwise, when you exclude one thing, you may find someone else comes up with something creative that you hadn't thought of yet and now you're making more exceptions.

 

Blue%20Dancer-natural%201.JPG

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that does not, unless it is an exact copy of a silver screen outfit, and then Mocs couldn't be worn....

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that does not, unless it is an exact copy of a silver screen outfit, and then Mocs couldn't be worn....

Exactly. And you can deal with it by enforcing existing rules and not havin to make more exceptions.

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YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!

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I must be living under a rock, I haven't seen a problem anywhere I've shot, with BW that is, except for the occasional 73 rifle...

Hey PB,

 

You said it, I didn't. :o;)

 

I have seen costumes I thought were inappropriate. The one lady I told that her lace up boots were specifically excluded, immediately bought appropriate boots. This was after the match. I didn't know her category at the match until awards were announced and she had left the day before.

 

There was another man whose costume was no way flashy and fancy by anyone's definition. I did not know his category until awards. I later (at another match) told him what I thought of his costume. He argued with me. The story is longer than that.

 

There may have been others, I just never knew their category. I've not made it a habit of asking what category people are shooting.

 

It has always been my understanding things like this had to be brought up during the match.

 

Regards,

 

AM

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Had a world champ in BW tell my wife her boots was not legal because they

did not have pointy toes and did not have leather soles. :unsure::blink:

They quickly learned they was wrong.

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they do have to be brought up before a contestant shoots,,,,, if they git thru without complaint, oh well,,,

 

I have had one, tho he wunt git away with it again, and the MDs had approved him, in error..

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The problem when parameters aren't clearly defined is that there will be many that will live in that grey zone.

Plaid shirts with snaps applied.

Plain Denim shirts with snaps.

Peasant blouses

Tank tops with blingy vests over the top of them.

Boots with 3 conchos

Vaquero outfits with ruffled shirts

Wrong guns

Lace up boots (My feet hurt)

Not wearing spurs (men)(Had a doctor's excuse believe it or not)

Not wearing a hat (women)

 

Tonto is not B-Western and neither is Gabby Hayes. And for that matter neither is the Cisco Kid.

 

All are some of the things I have seen at MAJOR matches. The sad part is that you do not even know these people are competing against you till you get home and see the scores.

 

Now you are trying to stretch the rules to be more inclusive in a category that in many cases it though of at a match by match directors as "just a costume category".

 

While your on the defining rules wagon. Make it a MDQ to show up improperly dressed in ANY CATEGORY. It is bad enough when people shooting B-Western show up without spurs but when they walk up to receive an award in a baseball cap it downright P------s me off.

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Tonto is not B-Western and neither is Gabby Hayes. And for that matter neither is the Cisco Kid.

 

Sorry about that. I just found the Cisco Kid in Pale Wolf's cited source for making this B-Western thing, the Old Corral, so I must have been mistaken.

 

http://www.b-westerns.com/cisco.htm

 

He's wearing shoes, not boots. Not legal.

 

wt_cisco_shoes.jpg

 

 

Thanks for setting me straight.

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I didn't say it wasn't "legal" or couldn't be made legal.

 

It just isn't B-Western

While you're at it you can put Zorro on that list too.

 

 

May Roy and Gene rest in peace.

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Patsy Cline wasn't in any B-western pictures that I know of. But sure looks appropriate.

pc010.jpg

 

flashier than Hopalong Cassidy, too. (whose shirt, I dare say, would not qualify for the category)

 

hopalong2.jpg

I do love me some Gene Autry, though. Sure ain't one of his flashier outfits, but looks like it meets the requirements

 

gene-autry_thumb.jpg

 

What's your point?

 

I thought we were supposed to be talking about dresses...

 

7f8ad08fd5be7dcc45d9054946cbd5b3.jpg

 

You know, you can find Lilia Smitty dresses like the red one above average price $40-50. Ebay has some as low as $10!

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Ok

On face book a shooter in b western was photographed wearing a simple Levi denim shirt

At a large shoot

Git out of here

No/no/no for cryin out loud

And I used to live in those shirts for work

NOT----------B Western CAS

90% of the rules are written for 10% of the perps

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The problem when parameters aren't clearly defined is that there will be many that will live in that grey zone.

P------s me off.

CAS has changed a bunch

When I started, if it was in the gray zone 95% of cas shooters did not go gray zone due to B Weatern type ( Roy, hoppy, Lone Ranger cowboy code) proudly stated in their publications

 

That % seems to has dipped a bunch in this new world order

 

I worked with clearly defined building codes for three decades, nothing can be clearly defined enough these days

Intent / right brained / left brained / lowered up thinking? Etc

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Quote from ROII

"
Also, costumes that depict leading role characters in B–Western movies are allowed
as long as the costume is complete with all accessories, but the costuming must still
adhere to the boot, leather, spur, hat, and firearm requirements above. John Wayne,
spaghetti western, and townsperson characters are not acceptable.
Failure to comply will result in a penalty for not adhering to category guidelines. The
first offence is a procedure, the second offence in the same match is a stage
disqualification, and the third offence in the same match is a match disqualification. "
From this I see the Cisco Kid and Hopalong Cassidy, Lash LaRue and many other leading B-Western characters that did not have all the flash do make the B-Western cut AS LONG AS you are wearing the COMPLETE outfit. Supporting characters like Tonto, Gabby Hayes, Smiley Burnett, ect would NOT even though they were a mainstay of many B-Western serials.
Wearing a black hat, shirt and jeans and claiming to be Hopalong would not cut it. You would have to be dressed as his double to be considered as meeting the requirements.
JMHO

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You got it, Dave!!! And I would HIGHLY suggest that if anyone is going to do this they bring a picture of whom they are dressing as. I have seen this done at EOT when I helped with the Costume Contests there. It was so cool.

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Guest Maker-Wright

This thread compels me to say Thanks to Sonora Blaze...

 

In my opinion, around here (Colorado) Sonora is the example of what Ladies B-Western costuming should be. At every match I've seen her attend, she is always dressed head to toe in beautiful, colorful skirt/shirt outfits. Sonora color-coordinates everything in her outfits... boots, gunleather, hat, etc. B-western is supposed to be about "Flash", and Sonora's outfits are always bright, delightful, and exemplary.

 

Because B-Western is intended to be a costume-emphasized category, and seeing someone (like Sonora) who does B-Western right adds so much character to any SASS event, It disappoints me that so many others seem to just do the minimum for B-western (possibly so they can squeak into a less-populated category in hopes of placing better?)

 

Thanks Sonora!

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Ok

On face book a shooter in b western was photographed wearing a simple Levi denim shirt

At a large shoot

Git out of here

No/no/no for cryin out loud

And I used to live in those shirts for work

NOT----------B Western CAS

90% of the rules are written for 10% of the perps

I saw that photo but couldn't find it again to use as an example.

He was so proud that he took FIRST PLACE!

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