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owen judice

Is it time for a change at SASS

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CHANGE?? CHANGE???

 

The "change" you get may not be anything like you expected.

 

Bragging that you shoot where SASS numbers are not required is not really a plus for you, as I doubt they started cowboy shooting with no assistance from SASS. You may, "kill the goose that laid the golden egg."

 

A big +1 for Phantom & KK and others that understand everything is NOT about "ME"!!

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I'm not happy about not getting the printed CC but I will probably pay for it.

 

Here is a thought I had regarding Life members gripes about not getting the CC.

 

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

 

7000 life members x $500 = A hearty chunck of money that I would hope is in an account generating interest.

 

Could a percentage of that generated interest be used to fund a printed version for the Lifers?

 

Just a thought. I know not every Lifer paid $500 but its a starting point.

 

If not, I would like to know where the generated interest is being spent?

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I'm not happy about not getting the printed CC but I will probably pay for it.

 

Here is a thought I had regarding Life members gripes about not getting the CC.

 

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

 

7000 life members x $500 = A hearty chunck of money that I would hope is in an account generating interest.

 

Could a percentage of that generated interest be used to fund a printed version for the Lifers?

 

Just a thought. I know not every Lifer paid $500 but its a starting point.

 

If not, I would like to know where the generated interest is being spent?

Ok assuming the money was invested and not used right away, it's not going to be a lot of interest not enough to run the CC and also for your info some early life members didn't pay $500.00 it was less, and new ones pay $750.00, if you do the math Life memberships loose money, they are nomally a short term fix for needed cash flow.

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Well, there are arguments pro and con, and obviously they could go on continuously. I do think any life members are basically being given the shaft when it comes to the printed version of the Chronicle. Whether or not the contract specifically said the benefit was in hard copy, certainly when people signed up they received it in hard copy, and not offering it that way is a change to conditions. It's not illegal, but it's not very upright and straightforward, either. Ditto for those who renewed, and then only after renewal had the change announced. Someone above equated this with bait-and-switch, and its an apt comparison.

 

I'm not going to leave SASS, but I'm disappointed in seeing this organization use these tactics. It's a darn shame.

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Can someone point me to this "contract" with SASS some of you have. I did not get one?

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I'm not happy about not getting the printed CC but I will probably pay for it.

 

Here is a thought I had regarding Life members gripes about not getting the CC.

 

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

 

7000 life members x $500 = A hearty chunck of money that I would hope is in an account generating interest.

 

Could a percentage of that generated interest be used to fund a printed version for the Lifers?

 

Just a thought. I know not every Lifer paid $500 but its a starting point.

 

If not, I would like to know where the generated interest is being spent?

 

Have you noticed what interest rates are? They are a joke. Hardly a revenue builder.

 

CS

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Those Life Members signed up over the last 25 years. So the math is wonky.

 

SASS isn't doing this on a whim. They're doing it because of the rising costs. How about they raise everyones membership dues to cover the cost of the Chronicle including the life members. Man watch the shovel full hit the fan on that one.

IKe

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I joined SASS to shoot.....the CC was just a neat side note. The electronic copy has the same info and takes up less space.

Tex's articles are great for starting fires on cold winter nights.

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I'm not happy about not getting the printed CC but I will probably pay for it.

 

Here is a thought I had regarding Life members gripes about not getting the CC.

 

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

 

7000 life members x $500 = A hearty chunck of money that I would hope is in an account generating interest.

 

Could a percentage of that generated interest be used to fund a printed version for the Lifers?

 

Just a thought. I know not every Lifer paid $500 but its a starting point.

 

If not, I would like to know where the generated interest is being spent?

Yep, just like your contributions to Social Security.

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When the folks who went to EOT a few years ago complained about the VIP ONLY AREAS on the SASS Wire they were using the leverage of "If this is what EOT is about I won't be back". No one told these folks hey you signed up for a shooting match, stop worrying about how SASS treats its VIPS, you know just shut up and shoot. Those folks were right and they were heard and as I remember there was an apology put out. Does any one think for a second that SASS and the WB will ever have VIP AREAS at EOT ever again. For those folks who think it is about 1 person sorry you are wrong. There are lots of folks out there like me, they are just willing to take this change to the product they bought and say nothing. As I see it the only leverage I have is to say make this right or loose me as a customer. If SASS keeps my money and does not ever answer my email fine I will be a SASS member for the next year. If they give my money back fine. If they send me the CC in print from for the next year at no extra cost fine.

Let me tell you about true customer service. I wanted to buy some new cowboy clothes for me and the wife. I found a pretty good deal, yes on line, and the deal was if I buy 100 dollars of clothes they would pay for the shipping and that's what I did. When our order came in it was short 1 item and they had charged me shipping. One item was out of stock, but that's not what my order form on line said when I made the purchase. I sent them an email saying refund the shipping or loose me as a customer. They agreed, their mistake and my money was back in my account in less then 48 hours. That folks is customer service and SASS could learn from these folks.

SASS offered a product and I agreed to buy that product now after taking my money they say that product is no longer available. To those who think digital and the printed are the same or just as good that's your affair with SASS. So why put all this on the WIRE, because it has been 4 full business days and not a word from SASS.

I am no different then the shooters at EOT, I expect to be treated as if they want my business.

 

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oh he$$, it doesn't matter if things need to change to keep SASS viable, let's just shut it down if I don't git my way!!!!! so what if other publications have had to do it, or that newspapers are closing everyday, or going digital. I DEMAND to have what I want, no matter what!!

 

 

is that what you're trying to say OJ?

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Some folks here are just dandy...they must be a true joy to shoot with.

 

:blink:

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oh he$$, it doesn't matter if things need to change to keep SASS viable, let's just shut it down if I don't git my way!!!!! so what if other publications have had to do it, or that newspapers are closing everyday, or going digital. I DEMAND to have what I want, no matter what!!

 

 

is that what you're trying to say OJ?

 

 

EGGzactly!

 

 

RRR

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I'm going to ask yet again how is this different from what happened at EOT? Those folks thought they were treated unfairly, came on the Wire complained and they got SASS's attention with the "I'm never coming back" statement. If I had known ahead of time what I was buying maybe I pony up the 115 bucks for me and the wife to renew and get the CC. Folks believe it or not I am a SASS supporter, I like SASS, kinda hard not to be after this many years in SASS, but this is wrong. Phantom could you treat your customers this way and stay in business?

How many of you give non SASS members a hard time at the local shoots, or are you glad just to have the customer.

Let me give you a another "What if". The wave of the future is not buying a physical product but the right to have unlimited access to view movies and such on-line. But what if you want say a Blueray copy of True Grit with John Wayne. So you find it on-line and buy just that a physical product. Then you get an email saying please go to this website, put in this password and watch True Grit as often as you want. Sorry that is not what you bought, you paid for the physical disk not access to a website. Now I know some may say that the website thing is better and that is your choice, but if you wanted the disk and thought you were buying the disk shouldn't you get the disk or your money back.

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Hostess cupcakes was having problems. They asked their employees to make changes. The employees refused. Hostess went bankrupt and ceased to exist. (The new "Hostess" is not the old one, only the name is the same.) We're on page four and you are still beating the same old drum. If you are that upset, ask for a refund.

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...., its about treating your members with a little respect.

 

 

I think I have earned a little respect here.

Personally, I think you lost that earned respect when you started this thread by whining because, basically, you got your feelings hurt.....

 

And attacking Phantom isn't helping your position.

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Hostess cupcakes was having problems. They asked their employees to make changes. The employees refused. Hostess went bankrupt and ceased to exist. (The new "Hostess" is not the old one, only the name is the same.) We're on page four and you are still beating the same old drum. If you are that upset, ask for a refund.

I did ask for a refund it has been 4 full business days, but I do have the patience.

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I joined in '95 and received the printed Chronicle just like everyone else. I'm not paying extra to get the print copy. I'll still get it by punching a couple of computer keys on one of several devices in the house. I came here to dress cowboy, shoot cowboy guns, and hang out with like-minded people. If I never see another Chronicle I'll still be here shootin'.

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I find it odd that folks who have computers, and obviously spend much of their time on computers, can't make the transition to the CC in PDF form. Big deal - lots of periodicals have gone digital, and the world as we know it has not ended. I suspect SASS will do just fine...... :)

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Sounds like some folks want the baby thrown out with the bath water.

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I did ask for a refund it has been 4 full business days, but I do have the patience.

Then my hat is off to you for making a decision and following through with that decision.

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Seems to me the OP wants to get enough members to force SASS to keep the printing of the Chronicle and mail it to members. I don't see that happening. I've heard we don't need SASS for too long. It gets me when people learn, promote and build something off what others did and then say we don't need them anymore. We got this now. I guess this is called the Cowboy Way.

 

SASS is the glue that holds all the CAS together. When it weakens it will fall apart and be no more. A strong membership is needed now and for the future for this to survive. I hope it will continue but more change will be needed. I think the CEO and WB are doing the best they can. My hat is off to them.

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The disrespect in this thread is shameful. I am a new member, #99627 signed up in January. Why is it so wrong to have different opinions on this topic? Do you guys not know how to respectfully disagree? Am I less of a member since I just joined and am not yet a lifer? Kiowa Kid, i would expect a greater level of grace and respect from a member with the designation "Territorial Governor," I'm glad the posse that I roll with has a higher level of respect for all shooters. It is attitudes like yours that will drive new guys like me away. I know you don't value my membership but with the way this issue is being handled ,on both extremes, I will likely not renew. I am the younger generation you guys said you were seeking in the first CC I received, and with leaders that act like this, even just on the forum, you will not appeal to us. The level of entitlement for those who think they are right on both sides makes me want to steer clear of this origination. I am so glad my local crew doesn't require SASS membership. I am so glad they respect each other.

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The disrespect in this thread is shameful. I am a new member, #99627 signed up in January. Why is it so wrong to have different opinions on this topic? Do you guys not know how to respectfully disagree? Am I less of a member since I just joined and am not yet a lifer? Kiowa Kid, i would expect a greater level of grace and respect from a member with the designation "Territorial Governor," I'm glad the posse that I roll with has a higher level of respect for all shooters. It is attitudes like yours that will drive new guys like me away. I know you don't value my membership but with the way this issue is being handled ,on both extremes, I will likely not renew. I am the younger generation you guys said you were seeking in the first CC I received, and with leaders that act like this, even just on the forum, you will not appeal to us. The level of entitlement for those who think they are right on both sides makes me want to steer clear of this origination. I am so glad my local crew doesn't require SASS membership. I am so glad they respect each other.

This is your first post...you are new to this game...probably limited experience regarding SASS and CAS...yet you make a statement that you "Roll" with better people.

 

Right.

 

The main point is that there are people that shoot in very small areas...not all, but many, that shoot only in a local capacity...don't travel and to them the CC is the main reason that they enjoy the organization SASS. Take away the CC and they see no reason to be a member...for they no longer get the Mag.

 

Then you have others that see SASS as being far more valuable then the CC...then what THEY get outta SASS. I'm in the camp of seeing SASS as a vehicle that keeps what I love (CAS and Western History...etc), alive...and hopefully for long after I'm dead and forgotten.

 

I give my $$$ to organizations that do "Good" in my opinion. A stoopid magazine is nice...but it ain't why I do it.

 

So when someone...ANYONE, gets on here and cries about something that they are not receiving...start talking about suing...or whatever, then I'm gunna call it as I see it. From MY view point, it a selfish...MEMEMEMEME...attitude.

 

SASS is an organization. It's not some little local club. Believe it or not, these two things are vastly different.

 

Phantom

 

PS: Should also say something about a person that purposely posts lies about someone that they have ZERO knowledge about...that's pathetic!

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PS: And if no one other then yourself is singing praises of your "volunteer" work...then perhaps it's because there's nothing to sing about.

 

Cheers!

 

Phantom

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I've been in the game for 12 years, assumptions are dangerous. I think you need to show some respect also Phantom, I don't get out of the east New Mexico / West Texas area but we treat folks better around here. I'm outta here I go where people value others.

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I've been in the game for 12 years, assumptions are dangerous. I think you need to show some respect also Phantom, I don't get out of the east New Mexico / West Texas area but we treat folks better around here. I'm outta here I go where people value others.

Your first post...correct?

 

You're new to SASS...based on your number. Didn't say you were new to shooting "Cowboy".

 

And Bull on the "we value others" stuff...like folks in my "Hood" don't???

 

But thanks for ignoring the rest of the post...guess it carried no value to you.

 

Carry on.

 

Phantom

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I did ask for a refund it has been 4 full business days, but I do have the patience.

I am sure if you posted your name and address, enough of us would donate your refund just to kill your thread, it would be worth your while.

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Hi Folks,

 

It seems that everyone has aired their views and the thread is spiraling into the abyss. As our dear friend Black Harris would write, it is time for tempers to cool on this one.

 

Regards,

 

Allie Mo

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