Anvil Al #59168 Posted December 12, 2013 Share Posted December 12, 2013 Don't know 100% But of the clubs I am a member. I trust them. Most take a vote of the members on how they want them to vote. If I have any questions on it. I will just walk up and ask them HOW DID YOU VOTE ON THIS. I am lucky in that there are some GOOD TG's around here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L Posted December 12, 2013 Share Posted December 12, 2013 You can walk away from a cocked long gun but can't take you hand off a cocked pistol. Not arguing just answering PWB question If you take your hand(s) off a cocked/loaded/action closed long gun, the penalty is the same SDQ for doing so with a revolver. That will be added to the list in the next version of the RO1 "Penalty Overview". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Most Wanted Posted December 12, 2013 Share Posted December 12, 2013 PWB I might not under stand your answer so please bare with me. If a shot empty pistol is left cocked when returned to leather that is a sdq. If a cocked long gun is placed down with action closed on spent round I thought that was a msv and a live round would produce the sdq. Forgive me for not looking this up I am freezing my butt off in a tree stand. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L Posted December 12, 2013 Share Posted December 12, 2013 Please note that I specified "cocked/LOADED/action closed"...i.e. live round chambered under the hammer. This is also mentioned in the OP (#3) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PECOS PETE, SASS#16437 Posted December 12, 2013 Share Posted December 12, 2013 PWB My context is post 71 & 72. If the pistol goes down cocked and empty. Do we have a conflict between the pistol rule and the new rifle rule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Dave Posted December 12, 2013 Share Posted December 12, 2013 Pete, the new rule deals with a rifle whose action was opened but inadvertently gets closed in the process of re-staging. I have never seen a pistol hammer get cocked inadvertently. Furthermore, long guns are restaged with barrels pointed in a safe direction, pistols are generally restaged in the holster often sweeping the shooter as it's being done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiowa Kid, SASS #69870L Posted December 12, 2013 Share Posted December 12, 2013 (Most Wanted quoted) P.S . KK , I am going to assume that you did vote (but not for Obama) and even though it did'nt go your way you have never discussed the outcome in a less than positive way . As matter as fact no, because it's really not productive and a waste of oxygen, but I do voice my opinion prior to the vote, if it goes my way cool, if not I work with it, example we have clubs that don't use all the SASS rules, just for example loading a shotgun on the move, complaining after the vote is like going to that club and complaining knowing darn well what the rules before getting there it's un-productive and a waste of time. KK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiowa Kid, SASS #69870L Posted December 12, 2013 Share Posted December 12, 2013 PWB My context is post 71 & 72. If the pistol goes down cocked and empty. Do we have a conflict between the pistol rule and the new rifle rule. No just different. KK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PECOS PETE, SASS#16437 Posted December 12, 2013 Share Posted December 12, 2013 KK different how. We have 2 cocked guns, both by stipulation in orginial question that are empty. The answers were quoted with a loaded pistol not empty as asked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiowa Kid, SASS #69870L Posted December 12, 2013 Share Posted December 12, 2013 PECOS I have got to ask, looking at your number you have been playing this game much longer than I and this just now is a concern? First a cocked pistol returned to the leather is a SDQ why exactlly I'm sure the ROC can explain. A cocked rifle and I assuming with lever closed and empty has been a MSV why the difference can't tell you both rules were in place before my venture in SASS and I have Never questioned it and I still don't. Two completely different firearms with different rules thats all I can say. KK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACKFOOT SASS #11947 Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 Oops, wrong thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anvil Al #59168 Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 What Blackfoot said. PP, go to the New Rule thread. It is answered there also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PECOS PETE, SASS#16437 Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 Nothing has been answered anywhere. None of this has or ever had anything to do with where whaterver was pointed. Make it simple. Rifle and pistol returned to table- all pointed downrange - both hammer back and action closed on rifle. Why would one be treated differently than the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 Nothing has been answered anywhere. None of this has or ever had anything to do with where whaterver was pointed. Make it simple. Rifle and pistol returned to table- all pointed downrange - both hammer back and action closed on rifle. Why would one be treated differently than the other. That HAS been addressed re: the difference in how to make a cocked long gun safe vs a revolver. If the rifle is found have an unfired round in the chamber upon opening, the penalty is the same SDQ as for a cocked revolver leaving the shooter's hand (ammo status unknown) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anvil Al #59168 Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 Sometimes people just. Don't get it. Don't want to get it. Never going to get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Most Wanted Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 Pecos you should have added that the rifle and the pistol both had spent brass in them . I think I understand what you are getting at and you want someone from the ROC to explain why a rifle sitting on a table , pointed into the berm , cocked with action closed on spent brass is a msv and a pistol in the exact same condition is a sdq . Pecos is that right or am I also missing your point . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 Pecos you should have added that the rifle and the pistol both had spent brass in them . I think I understand what you are getting at and you want someone from the ROC to explain why a rifle sitting on a table , pointed into the berm , cocked with action closed on spent brass is a msv and a pistol in the exact same condition is a sdq . Pecos is that right or am I also missing your point . "...ammo status unknown" and how the firearm must be handled to ascertain that status are the two main reason that revolvers are treated differently than long guns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 Nothing has been answered anywhere. None of this has or ever had anything to do with where whaterver was pointed. Make it simple. Rifle and pistol returned to table- all pointed downrange - both hammer back and action closed on rifle. Why would one be treated differently than the other. Pete, Respectfully, nothing has really changed, except that, upon opening, if the chamber on a long gun is empty, it's a no call. All the same penalties apply if there are fired or unfired rounds in the gun. Reflect on what happened to the shooter prior to this new rule. Shooters have put their guns down with the action closed before this rule went into effect, and penalties were assessed whether the gun was empty or not. I have come back to a closed gun at the end of a stage and paid the price, now there's a chance that it might not add time. CR Edit - Got interrupted and PWB beat me to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PECOS PETE, SASS#16437 Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 Alvin you are exactly right and that's where the frustration comes from. Red Cent uses the term "low badge disease", I think more as high post number disease. I should know better. I surrender. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lone Dog, SASS #20401 Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 My head hurts and my eyes glazed over... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 Alvin you are exactly right and that's where the frustration comes from. Red Cent uses the term "low badge disease", I think more as high post number disease. I should know better. I surrender. Hello Pete, I did a search on "low badge disease," as I thought it sounded negative (disease!). The only post I found with this term was yours. Help! Would you show me the post you are writing about? Thanks, Allie PS I could have "high post number disease..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anvil Al #59168 Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 Hey Plecos. Badge number, or post number don't have anything to do with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace_of_Hearts Posted December 14, 2013 Share Posted December 14, 2013 This also eliminate having to determine if the action is closed or ALMOST closed. As a TO we had to examine the action. If it was ALMOST closed it was a no call. If it was closed it was a MSV. (provided there were no expended rounds in the chamber or on the carrier) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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