Silver Shadow Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 As I mentioned before, my wife has decided to make the move from spectactor to participant. Yesterday she shot in her 1st official monthly, and had a very successful match. She would really like to shoot B Western. My concern is that, yesterday, it was pretty hot and I think wearing her hat on her head all day long on an unseasonably hot day, for us over 6000ft dwellers, is going to cause her some major discomfort. My question is, does wearing her hat, hanging from the stampede string, when not shooting, fulfill the wearing the hat all day requirement? Thanks SS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buck D. Law, SASS #62183 Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 I don't see a "wearing the hat all day requirement" anywhere. I am of the opinion that most, if not all, people will have the common sense to understand that it is intended to insure that people dress appropriately for their category (both on the range and at awards) as opposed to turning costuming into a torture device. I've seen ladies (and sometimes men) in B-Western movies "wear" their hat on a stamped string. I think attempting to make a call on someone (B-Western or Classic Cowboy) for having their hat dangle on a stampede string while not shooting would fall solidly under "being a hardass." Not that you're asking about this, but in my opinion, having it dangle while shooting would be a handicap. I can just see it now: A Classic Cowboy after shooting a stage takes his hat off to wipe his brow and we give him a procedural for shooting out of category. Of course, sometimes Gomer does show up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buck D. Law, SASS #62183 Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Here is the section regarding B-Western from page 15 of The Shooters Handbook. “B” WESTERN • Any main match revolver. • Revolvers may be shot in any SASS–legal shooting style, at the shooters’ discretion. • Rifles: Any SASS–legal rifle of 1880 or later design or a replica thereof (e.g., Burgess, Lightning Rifle, 1892, 1894 Winchester or Marlin). • May use any SASS–legal shotgun. • May use any SASS–legal ammunition. • Leather: Buscadero holster rigs or drop holster rigs. (All of the revolver(s) must be carried below the top of the gun belt.) All belt and holster rigs must be embellished (fancy stitching, conchos, spots, or tooling). All holsters must be of the “Double Strong-Side” type. No crossdraw, shoulder rigs, or butt forward configurations allowed. • Costuming: Shirts must be of the “B” Western style with snap buttons or any of the following: “Smiley Pockets,” embroidery, appliqués, fringe, or different colored yokes. Shield shirts are also allowed if it has piping or embroidery. • Pants must be jeans, ranch pants, or pants with flap over the rear pocket, keystone belt loops, and/or piping or fringe. • Pants must be worn with a belt. Suspenders are not allowed. Felt hats only, no straw hats. Hats must be worn. • Boots are required and must be of traditional design with fancy stitching or multi-color fancy design with non-grip enhancing (i.e. “NO Lug”) soles. Lace up boots and moccasins are not allowed. • Western Spurs with rowels are required for men. Ladies may wear skirts or split riding skirts. • You must choose at least one or more of the following optional items: gloves or gauntlets, scarves with slides or tied around the neck or bolo tie, coat, vest, chaps or cuffs. • All costumes are expected to be fancy and flashy. The “B” Western costuming must be worn during the entire match and awards ceremony with exception of evening formal occasions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Hi Silver, I agree with Buck. I sure wouldn't call someone on it. However, when I first started shooting, I didn't wear a hat. I got the worst sunburned part and decided to wear one after that. I'm happy for you to have your wife join you! Regards, Allie Mo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Slim #43510 LTG-Reg Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 It would be shooting out of costume !! " SLIM " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Uh Oh! Oh PWB! He may not be home yet from the Orygun State match... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack, SASS #20451 Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 It seems clear to me from the rules as written. "Hats must be worn." That means on your head, not hanging from a stampede string. I have no issue with a person removing their hat at times during a match, but the rule requires the shooter to be wearing their hat while on the firing line (penalty is a "P"the first time, then escalates) or they would be "out of costume" as Texas Slim posted. There is no penalty listed for not wearing the hat properly when not actually shooting, but the intent is clear. As for the wind blowing the hat off momentarily, that happens. But at least the hat STARTED on the shooter's head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Hi again, I've been giving this some thought What is a stampede string for? To keep your hat from blowing away. So, if it blew off your head where should it be? Hanging from the stampede string from your neck. That is my case for allowing Silver's wife to wear it that way. Regards, Allie Mo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace_of_Hearts Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 The rules are clear. HATS MUST BE WORN. Or perhaps we should litigate what the word WORN means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheyenne Culpepper 32827 Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Simple, wear it appropriately while on firing line, off the line let it dangle. That's as far as I figure you ought to bend the rules..... pbcc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Not to argue the meaning of "is..." LOL! From dictionary.com Wear: "to carry or have on the body or about the person as a covering, equipment, ornament, or the like: to wear a coat; to wear a saber; to wear a disguise." Seems to me she would be wearing it as an ornament and I think BW is all about the ornamentation. That said, I defer to whatever the ROC says it means in this context. Regards, Allie Mo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calamity Kris Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Would a "B Western" style palm hat work in this instance? They make several styles with embroidery on them and are rather attractive. They also come in "B Western" style creases. Palm hats are much cooler than felt. I happen to have a couple of Sunbody hats and love them. They are durable and comfortable in the 100+ degree heat we get in the high desert. Sunbody Classic Cowboy Hats Sunbody Old West Hats Sunbody New West Hats P.S. I would hope that your club wouldn't give your wife grief for not wearing her hat off the firing line when it's a comfort issue for her. Heat related health issues should be the clubs first and foremost concern, not following the costuming rules to the letter........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Hi Kris, No, the rule states, "Felt hats only, no straw hats." Those are not felt. Regards, AM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anvil Al #59168 Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Would a "B Western" style palm hat work in this instance? They make several styles with embroidery on them and are rather attractive. They also come in "B Western" style creases. Palm hats are much cooler than felt. I happen to have a couple of Sunbody hats and love them. They are durable and comfortable in the 100+ degree heat we get in the high desert. Sunbody Classic Cowboy Hats Sunbody Old West Hats Sunbody New West Hats NO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anvil Al #59168 Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 As I mentioned before, my wife has decided to make the move from spectactor to participant. Yesterday she shot in her 1st official monthly, and had a very successful match. She would really like to shoot B Western. My concern is that, yesterday, it was pretty hot and I think wearing her hat on her head all day long on an unseasonably hot day, for us over 6000ft dwellers, is going to cause her some major discomfort. My question is, does wearing her hat, hanging from the stampede string, when not shooting, fulfill the wearing the hat all day requirement? Thanks SS This came up with a friend of ours. At first I thought. Sure. Why not. But after thinking on it some more. I say no. "Hat must be worn" They was made to be worn ON THE HEAD. Not on the back. So even though I love that person dearly. I would have to say no. BUT. If done like CC said. Wear it on the line and MAYBE kicked back on the string away from the line. I could live with that. But really like to hear what Palewolf says to be sure. And what he says goes for me. Wearing that hat is PART of the category. Just my opinion. Anvil (who's wife shoots BW) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Just a reminder. A shooter can wear almost anything in an age-based, duelist, or GF category. No hat accommodation needed. I'm all for accommodating a shooter who needs it to be able to shoot at all. In BW or CC, "not so much." They can shoot another category. Regards, Allie "who would like to shoot BW if only she could fin some boots she could wear all day or CC if she could shoot duelist" Mo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheyenne Culpepper 32827 Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 anytime an item is listed as worn, it means worn appropriately,,,,, ie, no spurs worn on elbows, yadda yadda yadda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anvil Al #59168 Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Think the string was really made to help keep the hat ON YOUR HEAD in very windy conditions. Pull your hat no. And pull the string up under your chain to help keep the hat ON HEAD. NOT so your hat could be tossed on your back. Like I said. I have changed my position on this in the last month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 ... Like I said. I have changed my position on this in the last month. as I may depending on what PWB posts. Anyway, I hope we all learn something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slick McClade Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 I believe if you choose to shoot a "dress based" category whether its classic cowboy or B-western then you should follow the few basic dress requirements. I personally like to see the shooters in each of these above catagorys dressed to the best of their ability within the described rules. Would I personally make a call / complant on a shooter wearing their felt hat on a stampede string while not shooting "NO". But on the shooting line and at the award ceremony I think "full dress" should be worn every time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace_of_Hearts Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 Unless the lady is planning on suddenly pulling out both revolvers and blazin away gunfighter style, she can wear her B-Western hat any way she wants in a age based category or no hat at all. A lot of shooters forget that they can dress B-Western in any age based category. And if they don't want to wear a hat or spurs or even cowboy boots, they are more than welcome to have at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buck D. Law, SASS #62183 Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 When it's hot as blue blazes and I'm off the line, I slip my shotgun belt up to allow my belly to breathe. What's the call? Kate: "Look, Doll, I saw you belt that other dame, but don't try it with me or I'll take you apart." OMG, there are men with their hats hanging on stampede strings in this one!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yusta B. Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 Buck - that has to be the clunkiest '66 & the worse fights I ever saw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flying W Ramrod Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 The rule is Hats Must Be Worn. The last discussion on this was hanging on the back of the neck by stampede strings is not considered worn. PWB may not be answering for a while. He didn't make it to the Oregon State Match as he was in the hospital. He got out and didn't feel right so checked himself back in. No calls or visitors, he is catching up on email I've heard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anvil Al #59168 Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 But Buck. The RULE is. "Hats must be WORN" Not dangled Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Magill Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 It would be shooting out of costume !! " SLIM " I agree with Slim, keep your hat on your head. Take the hat off to fan your face. But you better put it back on. What happens here is that a shooter gets hot, takes off the hat for a minute or two. Next time they get hot they take off the hat until they are on the stage. After that, because no one has said anything, the hat stays off. Not fair to the rest of us B Western shooters who adhere to the costume rules. I have my wool felt hat on at every shoot, every weekend here in West Texas where the temperatures reach triple digits, and I am no spring chicken. If you don't want to "B" hot, don't shoot "B" Western! Lil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buck D. Law, SASS #62183 Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 I believe if you choose to shoot a "dress based" category whether its classic cowboy or B-western then you should follow the few basic dress requirements. I personally like to see the shooters in each of these above catagorys dressed to the best of their ability within the described rules. Would I personally make a call / complant on a shooter wearing their felt hat on a stampede string while not shooting "NO". But on the shooting line and at the award ceremony I think "full dress" should be worn every time. Just an opinion, but I think the large majority of the folks out there would take the same approach. I couldn't agree with you more about remaining in costume. Many seem to forget that although there are only two costume categories, we are are ALL required to be in costume and remain in costume. From page 2 of Shooters Handbook: All shooters must be in costume, and we encourage invited guests and family also to be costumed. Shooters must remain in costume at all match events: dinners, award ceremonies, dances, etcetera. ALL clothing and equipment MUST be worn appropriately, how it was intended and how it would have been worn in the OLD WEST or as seen on B-Western movies and television. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Titus A. Gnatsass, SASS #71705 Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 Not trying to muddy the waters more, but there has also been some confusion regarding "B" Western attire being required for the "formal banquet" when it is combined with the awards ceremony. It's probably been addressed here before, but I don't recall the thread if it was. My exact question would be: Is "B" Western attire REQUIRED if the awards ceremony is part of an evening formal occasion? Sometimes our English language can be a little ambiguous if one is not an English major. I think I know the answer, but would love to see a definitive ruling. From page 15 of the Shooters Handbook All costumes are expected to be fancy and flashy. The “B” Western costuming must be worn during the entire match and awards ceremony with exception of evening formal occasions. PWB, hope all is well! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 Hi Titus, I've been wrong before... but I think "with exception of evening formal occasions" means the BW shooter can substitute formal clothing for BW. Regards, Allie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Titus A. Gnatsass, SASS #71705 Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 I'm of the same opinion, Allie. Have still heard the question posed in the recent past and would love the peace of mind to know it came from the 'source', and we all know who we look to for those answers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 It's possible to wear even a felt hat and deal with heat. A separate thread covered that pretty well. Summary - use a wet bandana or even a small zip lock bag of crushed ice under the crown of the hat to help cool off. It can be done. A light-color hat (like silver belly) is lots cooler than a black one, too. And a tall crown helps. Good luck, GJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anvil Al #59168 Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 Hi Titus, I've been wrong before... but I think "with exception of evening formal occasions" means the BW shooter can substitute formal clothing for BW. Regards, Allie That's my thinking on it also. But never sure. So wife wears her BW stuff all the time just to be sure. As she does not have any of the fancy formal stuff anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rev Lyin Kerrdawg SASS # 57116 Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 Kat has all the clothes for B-Western, But will not wear a hat. I don't know what she wants to do now. She is totally disabled and don't get out much. She would like to shoot this fall some. I guess she will have to go age base. But she said gets a headache on any hat. She has had a couple made for her at the convention. Rev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riverboat Red, SASS #71733 Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 IMNSHO, a hat doesn't have to be full coverage. Here's a link showing none other than Dale Evens sporting a saucy little number. With some additions, her entire outfit could qualify for B-Western. http://www.pettipond.com/laterimages/image_ce/daleevans/index.htm RR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silver Shadow Posted June 10, 2013 Author Share Posted June 10, 2013 Morning all, Thank you for the responses. I'd like to clarify, my wife has no intention of not following all the costume rules to the utmost standard. This question was more for me. She shot the match on Saturday in an age based category because she hadn't finished her costume to her liking. The point being, I observed her through the day and noticed that her hat seemed to be an issue for her, not that she was complaining. I posed the question in hopes that I could suggest to her that it may be appropriate to wear her hat from the string when she wasn't physical shooting a stage (she shoots a '92, no hat... BAD idea ) since I had seen it in many B westerns on both men and women. Personally, I prefer to shoot B-western also, but in the heat of the summer I'm thinking I'll forgo the category in favor of relief. I prefer a black color theme in my costuming and so ... well you can figure it out. Since the ladies have a skirt option, I think she will be fine if she can tolerate the hat in the heat. Obviously she isn't using the "shadow" black theme. I did suggest to her that, since a costume representing a lead character in a B-western was appropriate for the category, that she could copy Raquel Welch's Hannie Caulder promotional pictures costume(I'll leave it up to those who want to Google it) to deal with the heat. ....I should be back on solid foods by the end of the week. Thanks SS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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