Loophole LaRue, SASS #51438 Posted August 18, 2012 Share Posted August 18, 2012 So, I'm sitting around a table with my partners, talking with a consultant about our marketing plans for the next year.... I'm all in on a new, improved website, a new logo, and (gulp) "branding" for the firm... But then talk turns to the "need" for all of us to be Tweeting and Facebooking...and she lost me. I've never cared much for self-promotion...my business comes from solid, creative work on technical cases - it's what I do best. Suddenly, I'm the Luddite in the room; my resistence to this "technology" is evidence of an unwillingness to "support" the growth of the firm...To me, that's insulting BS. Just because I won't stand on an electronic soapbox every 10 minutes and scream aloud my "accomplishments" ("Hey, everybody...I just had a GREAT bowel movement!")is, in the big scheme of things, very minor, in my view. But my mind is regurgitating this issue ever since. Am I resisting just because it's new and different? Do I think of it as a teenager's diversion, and so denigrate it? Am I missing the boat as the world changes? So - if you folks with businesses were hiring a lawyer, would you: A. Be impressed by one who is current with social media, and choose him over one who isn't? B. Think of frequent tweets from your lawyer as silly or bothersome or the greatest thing since pre-loaded ammo? c. Not really care one way or the other? If you use it yourself, has it helped your business? Geez, the stuff that keeps you awake at night..... LL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Mo Hare, SASS #45984 Posted August 18, 2012 Share Posted August 18, 2012 I don't use it at all. I do think a website is essential. I think most of your clients would want privacy and not think you are going to blab their business. As for my lawyer (that reminds me I have to pay his bill) I know he is a Red Sox fanatic but I would not want to track his doings. Me: Did you celebrate when they won the Series? Lawyer: I was there. I was in the background with my shades on for Channel 5's pregame interviews for game 4 in St Louis. My cell started ringing like crazy. I have been programming computers for 48 years, PhD in Computer Science (3rd one from UMASS Amherst). I'm just not a fan of social media Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J-BAR #18287 Posted August 18, 2012 Share Posted August 18, 2012 People who are Facebooking and Tweeting aren't working. I don't Tweet or Facebook. The SASS wire and Irish Whiskey are my only vices. Well, just about. I would not pick a lawyer based on Tweet/Facebook information any more than I would chose a surgeon the same way. It sounds like you need to confiscate all the cellphones and pagers and stuff from those who "work" in your office!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tascosa, SASS# 24838 Posted August 18, 2012 Share Posted August 18, 2012 A few years ago I signed up for face book! What a great pain in the butt!!! I did it to keep up with my kids (way over 21) and my grandkids (just hitting the 21 mark). I started getting friends requests and before I knew what was happening I was being informed what they had for breakfast and how good or not good the coffee was!!!! Then it was dinner time and after that supper time. Like I really care what they eat? Soooooooo I have stopped going to facebook. Life is so much better now. In my not so humble opinion, tweeting ( I have never done that) and facebook are a HUGE waste of my time. ifn its your thing go for it but its not for me. Tascosa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 Posted August 18, 2012 Share Posted August 18, 2012 Hi Loophole, I understand your hesitation. I do like Facebook and have "liked" some businesses or SASS-related Organizations to show support and made friends with folks I don't see often or have not met in person. However, when inundated with posts by them, I get turned off and "unsubscribe." This means I still show as a friend or someone who "liked" them; I no longer see their constant posts. A political comment, joke, or critter photo or two is fine with me. When I see 5-10...or more shared photos, jokes, sayings a day from one person, it becomes clutter that obscures the posts about and photos of events in folks lives. I may unsubscribe or not depending on my enjoyment of their "shares." If your firm is posting frequently about their cases, I would unsubscribe. If you were posting about new case or legislative law in my state, I might keep reading their posts. Regards, Allie Mo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 Posted August 18, 2012 Share Posted August 18, 2012 PS Sorry, I don't own a business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Hanger #3720LR Posted August 18, 2012 Share Posted August 18, 2012 Those times I have needed the services of lawyers, I looked for them on the area they worked in and on recommendations of friends. I would pay little attention to self promotion other than maybe a short profile on their company web site. Lawyers usually work by the hour and this is something I would be looking at as well when hiring their services. If they are spending their time tweeting on Twitter and posting on Facebook are they billing me for this time as well? There are a lot of businesses that might benefit from Twitter and Facebook but I do not think a law firm is one of those. Lawyers with individual profiles an a photo on their company business web site would be informative. Maybe even a company blog on the web site updated weekly. Besides, I would not want my case tweeted or posted as idle chit chat on some lawyer's personal Facebook or Twitter account. So what would your consultant have you posting? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt. James H. Callahan Posted August 18, 2012 Share Posted August 18, 2012 Well, my opinion pretty much mirrors yours, dinosaur that I am. I don't use social media AT ALL. Don't text, don't have a smart phone, my mickey mouse cell phone lives in my truck. When I get to be world dictator I'm gonna blow every cell tower halfway to Mars. Hate the $%^$* things! If I need an attorney I'm not gonna go looking on social media OR the internet for one. Don't care how purty your website is. If I DID use social media and my lawyer was twittering or whateverthehellyacallit I'd likely fire him for pestering me! I'm not saying this is sound business advice for a law firm, but you asked MY opinion. There it is for whatever it may be worth (probably exactly what you paid for it. ) Regards, JHC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted August 18, 2012 Share Posted August 18, 2012 I tried Facebook and the Tweety thing just to see what the buzz was about. They are so common now I assume they will be with us from now on. If a company has a user friendly website I really don't see a need for the other things. Overkill in my opinion. I don't use either FB or Twit for anything. I find them overloaded and distracting, not to mention the security concerns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Woodrow Cahill, SASS # 54363 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 I've found Facebook to be handy tool to maintain contact with old friends and work associates ... the whole 'networking' thing. It's less formal than LinkedIn, and as Allie Mo said there are some companies and organizations worth following. On the other side of the coin is all the gibberish you sometimes have to wade through, like the faux greeting cards, pop psychology 'saying of the day', and other clutter. I just scan past it, and quickly. Twitter - total waste of time. I don't care if someone is standing at the grocery store in the 10 Item or Less line behind someone who rudely has 12 items. I also fail to understand why anyone cares. Most 'tweets' are just people saying things because they can. A well designed website that's easy to navigate that explains your firm's services, some bios on the partners, and contact info will serve you much better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rye Miles #13621 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 My son talked me into using Facebook for my piano tuning/repair business. I thought it would be good advertising for new customers. It's anything but! No business, just friends and some are getting irritating. Post after post about stupid sh&^ ! Like Allie Mo said you just unsubscribe to them and remove the clutter from what you read. I don't think it's a very good business tool but ALL businesses seem to be on there because it is free advertising! Rye Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bama Red Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 Well, my opinion pretty much mirrors yours, dinosaur that I am. I don't use social media AT ALL. Don't text, don't have a smart phone, .......... Regards, JHC Exactly!! My phone has the ability to send and receive texts blocked, as well as having the web browser blocked. I use it to make and receive calls only. But, we do need them as they are our only phones. We can't get landline service because our neighbor refuses to allow the phone company to build a line across his land to our place. Now, Twitter and Facebook - what a monumental waste of time (esp. Twitter). If you see me using them, check for icicles in Hades!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chickasaw Bill SASS #70001 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 IF that is the future , or the present , I am stuck in the PAST and I ain't gonna catch up CB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallaby Jack, SASS #44062 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 Social media is a wonderful thing .... just ask the Young Ladies of the US shooting team (including a Gold medalist) about the mass of hate mail and DEATH THREATS that they have received .... ..... not for me .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Four-Eyed Buck,SASS #14795 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 Wife Facebook's, I don't. No Twitter stuff for me either. text is blocked on my cell as well as the internet. it's a phone, period.have the websites I check in on, and e-mail, that's enough tech for me......maybe too much Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mean Matt McCord, SASS #24683 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 People who are Facebooking and Tweeting aren't working. I don't Tweet or Facebook. The SASS wire and Irish Whiskey are my only vices. Well, just about. I would not pick a lawyer based on Tweet/Facebook information any more than I would chose a surgeon the same way. It sounds like you need to confiscate all the cellphones and pagers and stuff from those who "work" in your office!! What you said! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother King, SASS #69031 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 This is a great thread. Wow, I would never have believed almost 100% agreement CON the use of a media that (like the computer and cell phone themselves) has totally changed the modern basis of communication and marketing. Unfortunately for those 'con' the use of social media; you'd do just as well to spit in the wind or piss into the wave that is the changing tide. My neighbor on hearing my ringing cell phone once proclaimed that if he ever needs to talk to anyone he'll by cracky go home and use the phone. I still have an image of his putting a finger into the rotary dial. Those who used to say, "I don't even know how to turn on a computer." Are now logging into the SASS WAHR to see what their cowboy friends are up to today. Do you imagine that this SASS Forum is anything other than a tightly knitted social media? Maybe I'm just biased because my middle son is now Senior Accounts Exec for the fastest growing mobile advertising company in the world. His territory is from WA to CA. He's 26 y/o and started with internet advertising 3 years ago. That makes him a senior exec with experience in this space! Unreal... and so is his W2. He sells a service that converts a pixel dropped into your cookies that retargets your URL demands across all services and pays by converted clicks.....WHAT? The job didn't even exist 5 years ago, but this year the company will do $40m. Do this.... when you're next driving down the interstate, watch as the cars pass or you pass... everyone that is not driving is looking at their mobile devices (laptop, cell, notebook)- unfortunately sometimes the driver is as well. LL, once you realize that the SASS WAHR is social media then note that your customer base is receiving all manner of targeted info, it might be a grand idea to dig into what they want from you and then give it to them.... isn't that cheaper than wondering XXX is watching your expensively produced commerical? Keep Your Pockets Over Your Spurs, Brother (on his second espresso this gorgeous morning in the Paha Sapa) King Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Sage, SASS #49891 Life Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 Don't do any "social media". If I want to contact a friend or relative....I'll call or email. Oh yes...I don't own a smart phone either. Guess the phone operator is not smart enought to use it!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loophole LaRue, SASS #51438 Posted August 19, 2012 Author Share Posted August 19, 2012 LL, once you realize that the SASS WAHR is social media then note that your customer base is receiving all manner of targeted info, it might be a grand idea to dig into what they want from you and then give it to them.... isn't that cheaper than wondering XXX is watching your expensively produced commerical? Brother King: Ah, there's the rub....identifying what is truly of value, and delivering just that - not a bunch of hype and junk. This is my position...that I don't want to inundate clients/potential clients with my daily doings - even if they might be marginally relevant to their legal needs. I need to deliver more meaningful content - not generic bragging. Just to clarify; I do not run a general practice, nor am I a "TV Tort" lawyer; my practice primarily involves fires, explosions, and other catastrophic losses; my clients are primarily utilities, gas companies, insurers and folks who design and manufacture equipment used in these settings. So my communications need to be more specialized, more technical, and more targeted. Hey, thanks to all who pitched in ideas! Like any business tool, finding the right way to use it is more important that just throwing it all in the mix. I still want nothing to do with Twitter or Facebook as purely "social" media....I believe in face-to-face conversation and privacy. LL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Okie Sawbones, SASS #77381 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 LL, you're smart enough to know what you want from the start. You are looking to see if you are a neanderthal, asking a bunch of neanderthals. I have had a computer since they came out, and I have tried to stay current with the evolving technologies over the years. I have a desktop, laptop, netbook, and smart phone. I went back to college to learn how to build web sites with Dreamweaver. I built and run two cowboy club web sites. In today's world it is a must to have a web site for any type of business. Facebook has become very pervasive as well, and a lot of younger folks go to it first. Facebook can be very beneficial with a page 'About Us' section. You lay out a mini-biography, stressing your legal training and accomplishments first, then add a personal 'About Me' section, so that people can get a feel for you. People love to know a little bit about your family, hobbies, sports, affiliations, etc. They feel more comfortable with a lawyer if they have something in common. Facebook can help accomplish that. You don't have to blow your own horn -- just the basics. I find Twitter to be a nuisance, more designed for politicians who WANT to blow their own horn. I personally don't see it for a law firm. So - if you folks with businesses were hiring a lawyer, would you: A. Be impressed by one who is current with social media, and choose him over one who isn't? Yes. B. Think of frequent tweets from your lawyer as silly or bothersome or the greatest thing since pre-loaded ammo? I'd block you in a heartbeat. c. Not really care one way or the other? Yes, I care. A web page and a Facebook page are essential. If you use it yourself, has it helped your business? It helps my wife, because a lot of women like to see a female gastroenterologist. Several of her patients have searched the web for same, and have driven 200 miles to come and see her. There are not a lot of female gastroenterologists. If I was in need of a lawyer, I would see Contingent Fee McGee, because we have a common bond, plus I know he is at least a competent lawyer, if not an exceptional lawyer. My two cents, LL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hacker, SASS #55963 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 If I were hiring a lawyer based solely up social media. I would already be lost. It seems to me I would really want references rather than social media. Success rates have nothing to do with social media. I want and need a lawyer who can dispense with the opposition with a mere killer look. Someone with a reputation for complete victory. I think that is not a mark of being social. So no, I would NOT care about facebook nor twits. Besides if a lawyer uses facebook and twits he/she is wasting money. For what they get paid I expect more from their time. I want a lawyer that shoots full power loads and hits the center of the legal bull not relying on the golden bb. My 2 cents Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted August 20, 2012 Share Posted August 20, 2012 Social media is here to stay I suspect, like it or not. Now, what it will look like in 5 years is anybody's guess. But in business, you need to keep up with the trends in technology or you'll get left in the dust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The O'Meara Himself Posted August 20, 2012 Share Posted August 20, 2012 Humph! It's all White Man Devil Magic! The O'Meara Himself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace_of_Hearts Posted August 20, 2012 Share Posted August 20, 2012 Social Media of today requires a different mindset than most of us have. (If you are over 40) It is an excellent way to advertise your company/business to the younger generation. Most of us in business have trended away from the yellow pages and have opted to spend our dollars on "The internet". You will find that the resume as it applies to finding a job has all but disappeared from use and social media is used as a research tool to learn about the applicant. All kinds of information can be had from Linkedn, Facebook, and twitter. Many questions that could not be asked during the interview process are there for all to see. You can easily block incoming trivia from friends on both facebook and twitter without "unfriending" them. You can live or die by social media on a personal level today. From a business point of view, it makes sense to take advantage of what it offers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Harley, #14153 Posted August 20, 2012 Share Posted August 20, 2012 A web site is essential. An informative Facebook page can be very helpful for those seeking your service. Paying Facebook to put your advertisement on other people's news feeds has proven to be a bad investment for most advertisers. "Tweeting" is a good way to annoy people and turn them away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Two Spurs Posted August 20, 2012 Share Posted August 20, 2012 Humph! It's all White Man Devil Magic! The O'Meara Himself Like Bob said- it's here to stay but how will it change? GPS in your phone tracks you everywhere. How long before you are approaching an eating establishment and BOOM- an ad pops up on your phone.... Uh oh.... did I screw up by saying that??? If one of our cowboy pards takes that ball and runs with it I want a cut....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whiskey Business Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 Can see the value for some of social media. Don't even have texting capabilities on my phone, only use it to comunicate with friends and family. Not on twitter or facebook. I refuse to be absorbed into the borg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krazy Kajun Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 Ah, there's the rub....identifying what is truly of value, and delivering just that - not a bunch of hype and junk. This is my position...that I don't want to inundate clients/potential clients with my daily doings - even if they might be marginally relevant to their legal needs. I need to deliver more meaningful content - not generic bragging. Just to clarify; I do not run a general practice, nor am I a "TV Tort" lawyer; my practice primarily involves fires, explosions, and other catastrophic losses; my clients are primarily utilities, gas companies, insurers and folks who design and manufacture equipment used in these settings. So my communications need to be more specialized, more technical, and more targeted. I still want nothing to do with Twitter or Facebook as purely "social" media....I believe in face-to-face conversation and privacy. LL LL, I am an electrical engineer and work in the senior level of engineering management at an electric utility and I would be a potential customer of yours. I have built computers from parts on the table since 1986 and consider myself fairly well versed in the technical and social sides of this here "computer revolution." I also engage and work with the attorneys representing our company on various type of technical matters, contract law and litigation. I have a Facebook page, carry and use a smart phone and also maintain a website and do NOT use Twitter. All that said I would never consider looking at an attorney's Facebook page for his qualifications prior to engaging them for work in behalf of my company. In the technical and legal side of the utility business Twitter is a tremendous waste of time. If you are in the marketing and customer service side of the utility business it could be considered an essential tool. I'd want to see the attorney's website, see what companies they have represented and in what type of cases. I'd also want to contact some of their prior clients that have been represented by the attorneys in cases similar to mine. I'd never want to be subjected to the "twitterings" of all the lawyers working on my behalf....don't need to know when they are sitting in the can "studying" and all the while billing me for their "can time." Owning a legal practice doing technical work is a professional environment, not a social media circus. There is a market and place for social media but I don't think a technical legal practice is one. If you were an ambulance chaser then I'd say by all means go all out. If I were in the marketplace looking for an attorney to work with our company and saw that you were using Facebook and Twitter I think I'd move on to the next firm and look at them. Just the view from my saddle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loophole LaRue, SASS #51438 Posted August 21, 2012 Author Share Posted August 21, 2012 LL, I am an electrical engineer and work in the senior level of engineering management at an electric utility and I would be a potential customer of yours. I have built computers from parts on the table since 1986 and consider myself fairly well versed in the technical and social sides of this here "computer revolution." I also engage and work with the attorneys representing our company on various type of technical matters, contract law and litigation. I have a Facebook page, carry and use a smart phone and also maintain a website and do NOT use Twitter. All that said I would never consider looking at an attorney's Facebook page for his qualifications prior to engaging them for work in behalf of my company. In the technical and legal side of the utility business Twitter is a tremendous waste of time. If you are in the marketing and customer service side of the utility business it could be considered an essential tool. I'd want to see the attorney's website, see what companies they have represented and in what type of cases. I'd also want to contact some of their prior clients that have been represented by the attorneys in cases similar to mine. I'd never want to be subjected to the "twitterings" of all the lawyers working on my behalf....don't need to know when they are sitting in the can "studying" and all the while billing me for their "can time." Owning a legal practice doing technical work is a professional environment, not a social media circus. There is a market and place for social media but I don't think a technical legal practice is one. If you were an ambulance chaser then I'd say by all means go all out. If I were in the marketplace looking for an attorney to work with our company and saw that you were using Facebook and Twitter I think I'd move on to the next firm and look at them. Just the view from my saddle. KK: MANY thanks....I couldn't ask for a more informed opinion. LL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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