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Chronicle foto


wordsmith

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Wordsmith probably is a member, under another name, and doesn't want to be called out for pointing out something he thinks is wrong. Just a guess. Not sure if he went about it correctly, but I wouldn't be afraid to call the folks in the picture "wrong". Someone should cntact them and see if they would pose like that again.

Cash

Hi Cash,

 

If that is the case, I have even less respect for him.

 

When I state an opinion, I take the flack if it is unpopular. On occasion I regret my initial position and will say so. If anyone thinks less of me for my admitting a mistake or change of mind or my initial/unchanged opinion, I can do without their friendship. I don't need people who think they are beyond reproach and cannot still respect someone with an opinion that differs from theirs in my life.

 

Regards,

 

Allie Mo

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Wordsmith probably is a member, under another name, and doesn't want to be called out for pointing out something he thinks is wrong. Just a guess. Not sure if he went about it correctly, but I wouldn't be afraid to call the folks in the picture "wrong". Someone should cntact them and see if they would pose like that again.

Cash

 

 

Ya say it is OK to call fire and then run and hide,,,, and peak around the corner to see the action?

 

I respect your simple stated opinion.

 

You think the people in the picture will submit to a few PC folks? Perhaps. If they do, that would be to bad.

 

You probably put someone posing for a picture (for whatever reason) as if they were going to strike someone or take a blow as being PC incorrect too. Well OK, that fits the mold.

 

 

Care on

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When I state an opinion, I take the flack if it is unpopular. On occasion I regret my initial position and will say so.

 

Glad I'm not the only one :lol:

 

GG ~ :FlagAm:

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Dad gum! How did we EVER survive playing cowboys and Indians as kids?!? Geeze! We actually pointed 'supposed' guns at each other and went "BANG!".

 

I refuse to run from everything in life that might, could, under the right circumstances, hurt me.

 

And if children can't tell the difference between real and make believe, the fault lies at home.

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This thread reminds me of a thread a few years back when someone got torn up over my old avatar. Talk about scary. That's real lead looking out the end of those cylinders and yes, my fingers are on the triggers! Eeeeeeek!

 

 

 

Disclaimer: Live ammo was not used, hammers were not cocked, and no animals were harmed. The hair was there, but the white background was not. :D

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I think we really ought to blame the camera operator. Its ALL their fault.

 

Ifn there had been no camera operator, there would not have been a reason to poise for the pix.

 

Second Thought: I think we ought to blame the person(s) who invented the camera or atleast the store owner who sold the camera. Because ifn there had not been an inventor or store owner to sell the camera, there would not have been a camera operator. And without the camera operator, there would not have been a reason to poise for the pix.

 

Third Thought: Its all Gunner Gatlins fault..... :lol::lol::lol:

 

 

..........Widder

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I think we really ought to blame the camera operator. Its ALL their fault.

 

Ifn there had been no camera operator, there would not have been a reason to poise for the pix.

 

Second Thought: I think we ought to blame the person(s) who invented the camera or atleast the store owner who sold the camera. Because ifn there had not been an inventor or store owner to sell the camera, there would not have been a camera operator. And without the camera operator, there would not have been a reason to poise for the pix.

 

Third Thought: Its all Gunner Gatlins fault..... :lol::lol::lol:

 

 

..........Widder

 

 

Could blame the vehicle manuf that built the vehicle that transported the photographer with the camera to the match that took the picture of the two people in the picture... Of course the petroleum or is that the windmill people that provided the energy to propel the vehicle that transported the photograper,,,,, and it keeps going.... What, bottom line is it is the dinasours fault. LOL.

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I am saddened to see there are at least four idiots in Sass: the two who posed for the picture of a shotgun aimed at a participant, the photographer who took the photo and whoever put it on the front page of the Chronicle. So much for the four basic rules of firearm safety.

 

Word Smith

 

After 70 some comments it's time to go back and take a look at number 1. I will grant that calling anyone an idiot was an un-wise thing to do but beyond that, he recognizes that it is a POSED photo and it suggests unsafe gun handling. I am sure that the people at the photo op took every precaution and the photo shoot was safe, that is not the point. The point is that the photo depicts an unsafe act, one that results in a DQ if someone did the same thing at a match. It is akin to saying "do as I say, not as I do."

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After 70 some comments it's time to go back and take a look at number 1. I will grant that calling anyone an idiot was an un-wise thing to do but beyond that, he recognizes that it is a POSED photo and it suggests unsafe gun handling. I am sure that the people at the photo op took every precaution and the photo shoot was safe, that is not the point. The point is that the photo depicts an unsafe act, one that results in a DQ if someone did the same thing at a match. It is akin to saying "do as I say, not as I do."

 

 

OK, this post is just for fun, so stay with me, we are about to make a turn in the road...LOL

 

Since this is a POSED picture, all actors and photographers, people in the back ground are supposed to be on board with safety in mind and all...and we are now in the suggestive, presume mode of thinking..... LOL Who says the person holding his hands up is a Good Guy? Or the Lady holding the gun is a Good Lady?

 

As you suggest the photo depicts what?

 

1)The lady is holding up the guy? OR...

2) The lady is defending herself against an unwanted act? Or...

3) She got to the gun first? OR...

4) Fill in the blank.

 

If you use the photo for a self defense training prop.... you can tear it apart with all the sorts of things.

a) she is to close to the perp

B) the gun is not loaded

c) hands are not in a position to fire the gun

d)fill in the blank.

 

 

It is just a POSED picture, you can read into it whatever you want...but it is a POSED picture. Isn't that what CAS is about? Shooter (Lady....meaning good person)is defending poor little-ol-self against that cross-eyed, bow-legged, buck-toothed no good scoundrel. He has to be since his hands are raised in the surrender position, so he must be.... in our fantacy game. :unsure:

 

Or, he is the Good Guy and got ambushed by that Evil Woman. LOL.

 

When will we get the next.... YOU MAKE THE CALL THREAD?

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After 70 some comments it's time to go back and take a look at number 1. I will grant that calling anyone an idiot was an un-wise thing to do but beyond that, he recognizes that it is a POSED photo and it suggests unsafe gun handling. I am sure that the people at the photo op took every precaution and the photo shoot was safe, that is not the point. The point is that the photo depicts an unsafe act, one that results in a DQ if someone did the same thing at a match. It is akin to saying "do as I say, not as I do."

 

I think the photo depicts two people having fun posing for a photo.

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I think we really ought to blame the camera operator. Its ALL their fault.

 

Ifn there had been no camera operator, there would not have been a reason to poise for the pix.

 

Second Thought: I think we ought to blame the person(s) who invented the camera or atleast the store owner who sold the camera. Because ifn there had not been an inventor or store owner to sell the camera, there would not have been a camera operator. And without the camera operator, there would not have been a reason to poise for the pix.

 

Third Thought: Its all Gunner Gatlins fault..... :lol::lol::lol:

 

 

..........Widder

 

Hey...Wha...it's BUSH'S FAULT!! :P

 

GG ~ :FlagAm:

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Ms. Mo,

I don't mean any offense to you or even the OP, and I do value your opinion. I can see both sides of the story, and I guess I can't keep my mouth shut. (fingers still) If my kids, or someone I was mentoring, asked my opinion about how that picture was staged, I would have to tell them I would have done it differently. I still think if the ones in that picture read this thread, they would agree. If not, I guess I'm way off mark, and I can live with that too.

Cash

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Guest Joe West, SASS#1532 L Regulator

The OP and others have the ability to post with spurious numbers etc.. suppose that means admin hacked or it's admin allowed.

That being said, it's still dumb to put such a picture on the front of the printed representation of our game.

That's a particular issue I can't take to try and recruit SASS members while putting on a firearms safety class. Which is what I normally do.

My whole class would be spent answering questions about the picture, creating justifications, and trying to shout down anyone daring to question the good sense behind printing such a picture like's been going on here for 3 pages..I just don't have that kind of time.

Joe

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If people can not see the difference in real life and make believe, then shame on em. Bet they never watched the old westerns either.

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Just recieved my CC. Are you kidding, obviously a staged photo. Good gun handling, no. Front cover, no. That being said.........do ya think that maybe there is some photo's that you may have taken in the past...........and maybe should not be seen by the general public? Not me, of course. ;):ph34r:

 

Sun

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Just got my CC. Saw the pic.

Shocking! :rolleyes:

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It was a great picture - told a story! I know it was staged and I know that the action was open - however, it breaks the number one safety rule in an organization that rightly prides itself in safe gun handling. Whether we like it or not, perception is everything.

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It was a great picture - told a story! I know it was staged and I know that the action was open - however, it breaks the number one safety rule in an organization that rightly prides itself in safe gun handling. Whether we like it or not, perception is everything.

 

Maybe the Lady wanted to destroy the thing the gun was pointed at? The fictional Bad Guy!!! Then the first rule of gun handling was not broken.

 

If both parties are willling and knowledgeabe partisipants, then they are taking on the risk and who are we to say what they are doing is bad. Rather same thing when some one climbs into another persons weapon (car) and takes a ride down to the corner.

 

The barrel could have been offset a distance sideways from the person and thus, was not pointing at the guy with hands raised.

 

Since most here are presuming, assuming, guessing that it wss, then there is doubt and the others that are presuming, assuming, gussing that it wasn't are equally correct. In the game of make believe world of SASS where real guns are used, we know where the benifit of doubt goes to..... :rolleyes:

 

Everyone that has posted has a right to their opionion .

 

This has been entertaining.

 

Blastmaster

 

Edit::: Does Trap/Skeet sport have a better safety record than SASS? , and look at them sweeping everyone with their gun muzzles.

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Guest Joe West, SASS#1532 L Regulator

Using the glass analogy doesn't fit so well as that refers to optimism/pessimism, but if we must I would say I consider the glass dirty and prefer not to use it for guests.

Trap, Sc, and skeet do not have a better safety record than SASS at our facility even though they certainly should. Part of the problem is the lack of concern about muzzle direction, poor safety training,and believing small size shot can't cause that much damage.

When SASS was originally proposed and demonstrated at the CGC facility a lot of concern was voiced by the members who would be risking their facility and considerable personal investment to add yet another shooting game for mostly visitors to our already busy schedule. The turning point was a safety program for new shooter briefings, strict adherence to safety rules, and even trying to keep the perception of what we were doing , ie: pictures in the paper, web, etc..., from being something careless and dangerous.

For the first 7 years it was my job to make that happen as well as maintain the safe operation of all other shooting there and present our facility to the public as something that deserved to exist.When I started shooting CAS there were less than 500 SASS members and I wasn't one of them. They eventually won me over with a simple rule book that expressed a concern for safety and presented a fun venue.

Joe

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Using the glass analogy doesn't fit so well as that refers to optimism/pessimism, but if we must I would say I consider the glass dirty and prefer not to use it for guests.

Trap, Sc, and skeet do not have a better safety record than SASS at our facility even though they certainly should. Part of the problem is the lack of concern about muzzle direction, poor safety training,and believing small size shot can't cause that much damage.

When SASS was originally proposed and demonstrated at the CGC facility a lot of concern was voiced by the members who would be risking their facility and considerable personal investment to add yet another shooting game for mostly visitors to our already busy schedule. The turning point was a safety program for new shooter briefings, strict adherence to safety rules, and even trying to keep the perception of what we were doing , ie: pictures in the paper, web, etc..., from being something careless and dangerous.

For the first 7 years it was my job to make that happen as well as maintain the safe operation of all other shooting there and present our facility to the public as something that deserved to exist.When I started shooting CAS there were less than 500 SASS members and I wasn't one of them. They eventually won me over with a simple rule book that expressed a concern for safety and presented a fun venue.

 

 

Your bottom line says you like motorcycles.... Now there is a activity that dramitically increase the chance of injury and death. But it is your call.

Joe

 

Ya got one glass, either you use it or not. The thirsty users call.

 

Nice to know that 'your' range has been safe to date. I was referrring to the big picture of # of injuries per 100k shooters or reportables or any of the other standard reporting methods.

 

Little chance of a bullet going over the berm at a SG Trap venue. Has been at SASS shoots. Just had a case last weekend.

 

 

I could use the posed picture in a training session. Ask students what they see right, ask what they see wrong..... I believe the NRA Training material has some posed training pictures showing firearms pointed at others.

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Guest Joe West, SASS#1532 L Regulator

I can only speak to what I have knowledge of, all else is conjecture.

Reportable injuries and incidents and reported injuries and incidents are two different things.

I won't use the current Cowboy Chronical to teach at my club or our Sheriff's range. But I certainly would like the after action from the next NRA class you teach using it.

Joe

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I wonder how many folks commented before they saw the photo? :lol:

 

 

I did, TWICE. Now that I've seen it, I can tell you all EXACTLY what that's a photo of. It's a 100% historically correct re-enactment of the night Sour Kraut proposed to me. :o

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This is soooooo dang stooopid!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

If one can't figure out that it's a photo depicting a western scene...not real...staged...ART...then they really should become a Darwin poster child!!!!!

 

OY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

:wacko:

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Well I just got my copy of the "controvesial" Chronicle and saw the above mentioned photo. I agree that it was most likely a staged shot. But I do agree with Swallowfork, in a game where safety is paramount and we all do our best to follow the rules, perception of what we do and how we play our game should be taken into consideration when posting/publishing pictures. Name calling and snide comments aside, we are all entittled to our opinions and should speak out when something doesn't look or sound correct.

 

With all that being said, we have enough on our plates protecting our game and second ammendment rights, among others, to get too up in arms over a (IMHO) poorly staged photo.

 

CorkscrewTom

S.A.S.S. 68972

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Guest Joe West, SASS#1532 L Regulator

I agree with Tom,

It’s a staged picture, and as such it doesn’t bother me. I’d be happy for anybody to have it on their wall at home. I just can’t stand there and give the “always follow the NRA safety rules and you’ll always be safe” speech in my classes while passing that particular picture around. Someone who thinks that would be a good idea must be better at it than this poor old poster child.

I can’t hang it up at our gun club, the fallout from the members and their friends suspended for unsafe firearm handling would be unpleasant and unnecessary as we wouldn’t let you do that here.

 

Joe

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Word Smith's credentials aside, let me state mine...I am a SASS member, a shooter, RO2 certified, one of the founders of the USPSA National Range Officer Institute, International Range Officer Institute, one of the people who crafted the first Safety Officer training course for IDPA; I helped draft the safety program for the NSSF Media Program, which is considered a benchmark in firearms safety programs; I am an internationally recognized expert on firearms and firearm safety; I have worked in the film community in Hollywood on firearms training issues; I have worked with the top civilian, law enforcement and military firearms trainers, especially on the critical issues of safety in force-on-force/simulation training; I have handled crisis communications for the firearms industry and am considered one the ranking experts on firearms and media bias; I consult with Wall Street on the firearms market and have been featured extensively in the national media commenting on firearms issues, including firearms safety...and in my role of Executive Producer of 4 gun television series, I deal with more firearms safety issues in 13 weeks than most range officers will handle in a lifetime.

 

In my professional opinion, the photo in the Chronicle was inappropriate and irresponsible, regardless of whether it was staged, in good fun or whatever euphemism is used for bad gun-handling. The photo represents a lapse of judgement on the part of the photo subjects, the photographer and the editorial staff of the Cowboy Chronicle. I'm sorry, Tex, brother, but this is a mistake.

 

The practical shooting sports, including SASS, are successful -- and fun -- because we have built a set of safety rules that work, and we have zero tolerance for breaking those rules. SASS may be a "fantasy" game, but the guns are real. We forget or ignore that not only at our own risk, but at the risk to the sports we love,

 

I am sorry to be harsh, but this thread degenerated into attacking the messenger for what I think was a legitimate message...

 

Wolf Bane

SASS13557

 

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