What Would Ya Call

[Texas John Ringo, SASS #10138]

F) At the Unloading Table, competitors shall unload each of their firearms, and the Unloading Officer must visually inspect all chambers to make sure they are empty. Rifles and shotguns are cycled to verify their magazines are empty. All revolvers taken to the firing line must be checked, whether or not they were used, and only two

main match revolvers may be taken to the line.

 

 

 

Maybe it's time for a full review? I'm thinkin' no more classes until you get this down. Need a reader?

[Diamond S Doug]

How about this for the loading table...ROI Page 10 para 9.A) Loading table officeers are responsible to visually check to ensure ALL firearms are loaded with only the correct number of rounds required in a course of fire.

 

Seems like they count 5 in one pistol,5 in the other pistol, usually 10 in the rifle and 0 in the shotgun. Shotgun has to be there to see it is empty.

[Brother King, SASS #69031]

Brother King, now for the rule concerning the LOADING table???? That was the querstion was it not?

Let me slow this down for both you and the next post regarding the UNLOADING table. The rule concerning the LOADING table was already addressed. (See post #96)

 

It's clear that the shooter has a duty to the safety of all shooters to insure that ALL guns are clear both at the start of each stage and at the end of each stage. The only time that a shooter may enter the firing line is with a gun that has been shown clear at the beginning. Therefore, a the rule that if it is NOT clear then it is a SDQ on the stage previous since loading table rules were violated. The only way to determine whether the shooter is allowed to begin loading without having violated THAT rule is to check to see if all guns are clear.

 

Yes, we're often rather lazy about it at some clubs and often allow shooters to begin loading or even (as even I have argued here) allowed shooters in front or behind to check that proper procedures have been followed. That should not be interpreted as in this post that there is no need for a loading table or for all guns to go through the loading table before entering the firing line. IN FACT, the loading table is the beginning of the firing line in SASS, ie. all dropped gun, muzzle direction and 170 rules are from Loading table to Unloading table.

 

This is further underscored by DSD's previous post Page 10 p9 A) and I think his observation is the correct interpretation. So, we have the beginning and the ending of the firing line. Therefore, to me at least, the firing line is a CLOSED but continuous zone from loading table to unloading table.

 

SASS derives much of its tradition of safety from the relative comfort that all shoots are run on a COLD RANGE. This can not be insured if the firing line itself is not a closed zone with procedures and check points on each end.

[Lone Dog, SASS #20401]

Last Saturday we had 6 shooters total. We did not utilize an LTO or ULTO.

 

Even with a big turnout say 3 dozen shooters, we never have LTOs in these parts and no one gets heartburn if the ULTO position is unfilled for vets. New shooter of course gets a "minder" aka mentor all day.

 

Yet somehow we manage to get thru the match intact and have fun. This is not all that hard people, in fact this game is pretty simple.

 

There is no rule against an unloaded sg being handed to the shooter. We do not need one. In 16.5 years I have never seen it attempted, much less done. Shells yes, sg no. Never happens. This thread is a tempest in a teapot.

[Gold Canyon Kid #43974]

How about this for the loading table...ROI Page 10 para 9.A) Loading table officeers are responsible to visually check to ensure ALL firearms are loaded with only the correct number of rounds required in a course of fire.

 

Seems like they count 5 in one pistol,5 in the other pistol, usually 10 in the rifle and 0 in the shotgun. Shotgun has to be there to see it is empty.

So why do some clubs require pistols to be shown as clear and empty before the shooter can load them. Can't the loading table official count to 5 and check for an empty under the hammer without checking gun before loading it at the loading table?

[Diamond S Doug]

So why do some clubs require pistols to be shown as clear and empty before the shooter can load them. Can't the loading table official count to 5 and check for an empty under the hammer without checking gun before loading it at the loading table?

 

 

I don't know. That question would be for that club. But extra precautions is better than none.

[Jacknife]

:wacko: one can only wonder why the rules specifically award a SDQ for showing up at the loading table with empties in the gun? But, you'll show 'em and walk off, right? Good riddance. :rolleyes:

 

May I suggest an ROI or ROII course or in the very least perhaps actually a read of the rules?

 

 

Let me slow this down for both you and the next post regarding the UNLOADING table. The rule concerning the LOADING table was already addressed. (See post #96)

 

 

Brother King, now about that rule concerning showing up at the loading table and it being REQUIRED to show the shotgun, could ya point me to that rule? Thanks. POst 96 that you referenced above doesn't mention the shotgun.

[Brother King, SASS #69031]

Brother King, now about that rule concerning showing up at the loading table and it being REQUIRED to show the shotgun, could ya point me to that rule? Thanks. POst 96 that you referenced above doesn't mention the shotgun.

who said there was a rule? Only said that there is a penalty for having empties in a gun at the loading table. That applies to all guns. But, that's not the point nor is it the argument here.

 

How about you show us where you think that SASS procedures allow guns to come to the firing line without going through the loading and staging procedure?

[Guest Cinch, SASS#29433]

What say ye wire lawyers???????

 

I say that I have read the rule book and it simply doesn't address this specific issue, that is where the lawyers come in... in the OP the gun was cleared at the unload table and could possibly be handed to the shooter who could show clear to the RO before staging the gun. If the 170 was not broken while the hand off took place it could be safe as well as legal as RO's clear guns all the time

 

If all of the marbles are on the line then the shooter might as well take the misses and call it an almost clean match. If only trying to save a clean match then the RO could safely assist the shooter by seeing the gun was clear and running him past the load table, letting him stage the gun, complete the stage and proceed to the unload table. Clean match, incredible time, and everyone happy including the rule mongers.

 

If one wants the option to retrieve another gun then maybe they shouldn't declare it since the thing that generally happens when a gun is declared is that the shooter proceeds to the next gun or the stage ends