Brother King, SASS #69031 Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 Posted without comment: BLM DRAFT POLICY Because really, what would be the point of commenting? Just BTT please.... we need to get some pens out and contact some representatives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremiah Sullivan Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 Posted without comment: BLM DRAFT POLICY Because really, what would be the point of commenting? Just BTT please.... we need to get some pens out and contact some representatives. Seems to me the simple solution to urbanites "freaking out over the sounds of shooting" on public lands is to ban the urbanites from public lands. Presto, no more problem. "Hello, my name is Jeremiah and I am a recovering New Yorker...." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Coles SASS 1188 Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 I think the restrictions are stupid and need to be stopped. Having said that, they do have a point about littering associated with impromptu ranges on BLM lands. I, and I suspect most anyone else who has shot in these informal ranges have seen all kinds of stuff shot up and abandoned: cars, TVs, appliances, computers, propane tanks, you name it. This sort of thing gives shooters a bad name and opens the door for this kind of attack. After all, the BLM is going to go after anything they see as promoting dumping and littering on BLM land. Again, to be crystal clear I don't support BLM's attempts to close lands to shooters. However, a little more effort to keep impromptu shooting locations cleaned up would not go amiss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quick Draw Granpaw #48525 Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 All that can be done will be done if we support the NRA and work on attracting new shooters! Ignorance will always be a problem that we must change! Donations to support the sport of shooting helps with educating folks and increasing the size of our posse so to speak! Lets all do a little more than we do now. Before it's to late. Happy trails QDH/Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Gatlin, SASS 10274L Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 I think the restrictions are stupid and need to be stopped. Having said that, they do have a point about littering associated with impromptu ranges on BLM lands. I, and I suspect most anyone else who has shot in these informal ranges have seen all kinds of stuff shot up and abandoned: cars, TVs, appliances, computers, propane tanks, you name it. This sort of thing gives shooters a bad name and opens the door for this kind of attack. After all, the BLM is going to go after anything they see as promoting dumping and littering on BLM land. Again, to be crystal clear I don't support BLM's attempts to close lands to shooters. However, a little more effort to keep impromptu shooting locations cleaned up would not go amiss. ....not all trash is done via the shooters... http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/a/Arizona-Desert-Trash.htm GG ~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost, SASS #50125 Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 Posted without comment: BLM DRAFT POLICY Because really, what would be the point of commenting? Just BTT please.... we need to get some pens out and contact some representatives. Ghost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Coles SASS 1188 Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 ....not all trash is done via the shooters... http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/a/Arizona-Desert-Trash.htm GG ~ I didn't say it was. But when stuff gets shot up and left, no matter who brought it its easy to see why shooters get the blame. Its the same sad story, when blame gets handed out it rarely goes to the right people. For example, when I lived down in El Centro, all the off-roaders I know would tell me about how they cleaned up after themselves, didn't go into the closed areas and didn't disturb fenced sites on BLM lands. But, there was still plenty of trash, folks still drove in places they shouldn't, fences still got knocked down and the BLM kept getting stricter and stricter. Were my friends lying? No, I don't think so. Its just that a few jerks can screw things up for everybody. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Gatlin, SASS 10274L Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 I didn't say it was. But when stuff gets shot up and left, no matter who brought it its easy to see why shooters get the blame. Its the same sad story, when blame gets handed out it rarely goes to the right people. For example, when I lived down in El Centro, all the off-roaders I know would tell me about how they cleaned up after themselves, didn't go into the closed areas and didn't disturb fenced sites on BLM lands. But, there was still plenty of trash, folks still drove in places they shouldn't, fences still got knocked down and the BLM kept getting stricter and stricter. Were my friends lying? No, I don't think so. Its just that a few jerks can screw things up for everybody. Yup - I know...done alot of campling and off roading myself in SoCali and witnessed trash left by shooters - just was pointing out that it's not just shooters and campers the administration should blame (though they blame everything on everyone else but themselves so it's understandable )...that's all GG ~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger Sgt. Jake McCandless #3368 Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 BTT Adios Sgt.Jake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Montana, SASS #23907 Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 One possible solution would be for the governments to sell the land to private individuals, put the money toward the debt, and lessen the cost and responsibility of the BLM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Seems to me we had a long discussion in The Saloon recently about this. Or am I getting that Deja View again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lone Dog, SASS #20401 Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 One possible solution would be for the governments to sell the land to private individuals, put the money toward the debt, and lessen the cost and responsibility of the BLM. Exactly. There is no reason for the federal government to be holding millions of square miles of dirt. Sell it all off I say and pass a balanced budget amendment and this country would be sitting pretty. Slob hunters and slob shooters spoil it for the rest of us. A pox on their houses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlicLee SASS #16638 Life Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 In what document does it say the federal govt owns all the land in all the states. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klondike SASS Life #29713 Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Exactly. There is no reason for the federal government to be holding millions of square miles of dirt. Sell it all off I say and pass a balanced budget amendment and this country would be sitting pretty. Slob hunters and slob shooters spoil it for the rest of us. A pox on their houses. Don't you know if they sold BLM land, some evil no-gooder might want to drill a hole there and find that gawd awful black stuff that people are crazy for, like Jedd Clampett. That could upset the time warp continueum or some other something similar . Shooters are just an excuse to work on their agenda. Don't you hear those black helicopters hovering!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger Sgt. Jake McCandless #3368 Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 BTT ! Adios Sgt. Jake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Possum Skinner, SASS#60697 Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 In what document does it say the federal govt owns all the land in all the states. If you want to know who owns your land skip paying your property taxes... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Coles SASS 1188 Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Exactly. There is no reason for the federal government to be holding millions of square miles of dirt. Sell it all off I say and pass a balanced budget amendment and this country would be sitting pretty. Selling off federal lands is not the best plan. If you don't think the BLM does a good job of letting folks on their property to shoot and hunt, try getting permission from private property holders. I have lived in the top two states for percentage of federal land ownership (Nevada 84% and Alaska 69% {despite people's comments in this thread, Arizona comes in 6th with about 48%) and I like having big chunks of federally owned land open for public use. It means that there are places where anyone can go to hunt, fish, camp or just explore. Contrast that with Europe where all the land is privately held and you have to pay land owners to hunt and fish. Furthermore, of the federal lands systems (BLM, Forest Service and Park Service), the BLM has the fewest restrictions on land use of them all. The BLM's mandate is to provide for the use of the land for all kinds of activities including mining, oil production,herding, recreation, subsistence (big up here in Alaska). I would much rather deal with the BLM than the folks in the Park Service who just want to protect the view. Try some target shooting in a national park some time and see what happens! Very few projects proposed for BLM land ever get turned down as long as folks follow the rules and go through all the steps. Anyway, don't throw the baby out with the bathwater, federal lands are good for all of us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cascade Charlie, SASS # 48668L Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 I think the restrictions are stupid and need to be stopped. Having said that, they do have a point about littering associated with impromptu ranges on BLM lands. I, and I suspect most anyone else who has shot in these informal ranges have seen all kinds of stuff shot up and abandoned: cars, TVs, appliances, computers, propane tanks, you name it. This sort of thing gives shooters a bad name and opens the door for this kind of attack. After all, the BLM is going to go after anything they see as promoting dumping and littering on BLM land. Again, to be crystal clear I don't support BLM's attempts to close lands to shooters. However, a little more effort to keep impromptu shooting locations cleaned up would not go amiss. +1 Couldn't have (and didn't) said it any better myself. It's eggzactly what I was thinking. Bravo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Harris #154 Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 They have already backed off of the idea Here BH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Gatlin, SASS 10274L Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 They have already backed off of the idea Here BH Good to hear.....thanks for the update. "The new plan would be to provide shooters with a map or guide on where they can go for target practice nearby, said the official." - nothing unreasonable about that - even a good idea I suppose. GG ~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sage Creek Gus SASS #64320 Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 I've heard some comments about how the states gave what is now federal lands to the federal government sometime in the past. I've always understood all the land originally belonged to the federal government and was later transferred in parcels to the states or individuals. The federal government kept some which is now the federal lands. My grandparents homesteaded in north central Montana in 1914 and I know the original deed for that land showed that it was transferred from the federal government to my grandparents. When that homestead act went into effect two sections of each township where deeded to the states as "school" sections. these sections belonged to the state. It was on these lands that the country schools were located and the rest of the land generated income to fund the schools. I'm not in favor of selling federal land to private individuals. We need these public lands such as BLM for all sorts of recreation including hunting and shooting. I did hear the other day on the radio that the proposed ban on target shooting on BLM land, while supposedly for "safety" was really because suburban people were "traumatised" when they heard gunfire. I can believe that. We had a woman move into our area (northwestern Montana) from California a few years ago and she would call law enforcement every time she heard a gunshot which around here is pretty often. It took the law enforcement personnel a long time to convince her it was some guy shooting at a tin can in their back yard. Sage Creek Gus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cascade Charlie, SASS # 48668L Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 I did hear the other day on the radio that the proposed ban on target shooting on BLM land, while supposedly for "safety" was really because suburban people were "traumatised" when they heard gunfire. I can believe that. We had a woman move into our area (northwestern Montana) from California a few years ago and she would call law enforcement every time she heard a gunshot which around here is pretty often. It took the law enforcement personnel a long time to convince her it was some guy shooting at a tin can in their back yard. Sage Creek Gus That poor woman. I hope it wasn't a life altering experience to find out that people actually enjoy the shooting sport. Good lord, give me a break!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SASS# 23321 Canelo Kid Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 "The new plan would be to provide shooters with a map or guide on where they can go for target practice nearby, said the official." Take a good look at a AZ BLM/ State Trust Land map, it's a crazy patchwork quilt. I was out shooting one time and had to prove to the Sheriff Deputy, and then to BLM guy he called, that I was OK to shoot where I was. It took his BLM map, coordinates from two GPS's, and almost an hour of my shooting time for me to show them I was legal. BLM guy left mad and the Sheriff told me he "heard a shot" and didn't know what was going on. I, along with many others, have been shooting out there for almost thirty years. The Deputy had also forgot that he had previously stopped me going out of the area with a truck load of trash left by boonie partiers and slob shooters. I reminded him. Safe trails, CKid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oklahomabound Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Here's link to more on the BLM draft... BLM article Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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