baikal-stoeger

[boom pop]

looking to get a sxs and was wondering which one is better, so i am polling the experience pool, thanks pop.

[John E. Law]

IMHO, Baikal all day long.

 

The Stoeger is junk. I've broken 3, all of them were tuned by the "top, go to" smiths that are always talked about here on the wire. If you run the gun hard stay away from the Stoeger, they just are not made well enough to take the beatiing we put them through.

 

I finally went to the Baikal after a recommendedation from Red River Ray. They're built like tanks. I've been shooting mine for 3 years now, no problems. I bought a identical back-up just in case and it's only been shot in practice a few times because it's just not needed.

 

For an inexpensive shotgun the Baikal is great.

 

Again this is my opinion and you know the saying about opinions...

 

 

JEL

[Lone Dog, SASS #20401]

I started in May 96 with a pre-Stoeger Interarms import. Same gun just different importers. I used that gun last week in a shoot. It is still going strong. Not one thing was ever done to it until a coupla years ago when I changed the firing pins for a pair of the Long Hunter pins and new fp springs. I didn't NEED to, it was more of a preventive maintenance thing. So if ya get a good one they are entirely serviceable for the average cowboy shooter. I have also seen one that the receiver split on the first box of featherlites and Stoeger would not stand behind it. So ya pays yer money and takes yer chances. I also own a coupla more 12 gauge Stoegers and a 20 gauge and they have all been good guns.

 

I have a 26 inch single trigger Baikal that I love a lot. Also box stock and a great gun. If I had it to do over I would not have disabled the ejectors on that gun just to shoot cowboy with it. Shoulda saved it for a bird gun. Those ejectors launched empty shells with authority.

 

Also have 2 TTN hammer guns and I sure do love them too. Especially the CCH one.

 

So if ya get a good one either will do fine. I think the odds are greater of getting a good Baikal than a Stoeger these days.

 

But me all time favorite double is my SKB. Everything I own is for sale if ye get the money right, but it would take way more than I've got in it to get that gun. It will never be for regular sale long as I can hobble to the firing line. Any of the Miroku-made doubles (SKB, Ithaca, Charles Daly 500 etc) will hold up much better and be far better suited to CAS than any of the econo 2 rows but they are pricey. Ye git whutcha pay for.

[Anvil Al #59168]

I have had both. Sold the Stoeger.

Kept the Baikal if that tells ya anything.

 

Unless you are going to jump to a SKB or BBS.

The Baikal double trigger is hard to beat.

I would avoid the single trigger in the Baikal or the Stoeger.

 

 

P.S. Go ahead and buy one all ready tuned.

Save ya in the long run. And you will want it done.

 

Gunslinger is great with the Baikal's. If you want. I will PM you his info.

[Bart Solo]

I have one of each. Every match when I pull the guns out of the safe, the Baikal is the gun I grab. The darn thing is built like a tank and runs like a champ. The only times the Stoeger comes out of the safe is when I am going to a multi day match and need a backup. Both of my guns have been professionally tuned. That is the only way to go with the SxS.

[Texas Jim Henry, SASS #20616]

I own both, and it's another vote for the Baikal for me. I was one of the fortunate few who managed to get a new shotgun from Stoeger after my original one broke (although it took, literally, years and a lot of persistence). The new one has only been shot by a friend from New Zealand I loan it to for End of Trail.

 

Like others, I've discovered the joy of a finely tuned SKB, but I doubt if I'll ever sell the Baikal.

 

Regards, TJH

[Utah Bob #35998]

I guess I got the only good Stoeger ever to come out of the factory. Used it for 10 years and it's never failed.

[Captain Bill Burt]

I love my Stoeger Supreme. I've shot about 25 matches with it so far and no problems. Having said that I just bought a Baikal for my six year old. Once I've had it slicked up we'll see how he likes it.

[Noz]

Baikal.

[Charlie Whiskers]

I had a Stoeger that I used hard for 3 or 4 years.Worked well til this year.Sent it into Stoeger to see about getting it repaired.They judged it to be unrepairable and sent me a new one.Shocked the He77 out of me getting a new one,but I was impressed by the customer service.BUT...isn't there usually a but...took my brand new out of the box shotgun out to give it a try...the right barrel won't cock.Shot the 1st stage using a brand new "single" shot.Good thing I had my 4 yr old Baikal along with me for the rest of the match.

[red coneston 60384]

Pop, The stoeger I shoot is a good one with hard steel pivot lug, But I've had 2 others with soft lugs that gradually bent, luck of the draw? Also have 2 baikals, On the newer one the Barrels started coming apart at the muzzle and I've seen several others do the same. Seems your takin chances with either brand to me. Red

[Rance - SASS # 54090]

I guess I got the only good Stoeger ever to come out of the factory. Used it for 10 years and it's never failed.

 

I'm kinda in this camp...

I started 8 years ago with a Stoeger... shot it for 1 1/2 years.. and my wife took it over.. she's still shootin' it..

She's never had a problem with it.. it's a good shooter..

When she took my original I bought a Stoeger Coach Gun Supreme.. Been using it in every match.. maybe 3 a month during our shooting season... Haven't had any problem...

With all the problems talked about on the wire about how junky a Stoeger is.. I figured I'd better get a spare backup.. so if my wife's original breaks.. I'll already have one..

Well... I bought the backup about a year ago... It's a Stoeger Coach Gun Supreme also..

So far... it's become a safe queen.. I made sure it shot ok.. and did a little polishing to it, like all the others..

 

Rance

Thinkin' I love my Stoeger..

Weird huh?

Probably every manufacturer has made a bad gun and great gun..

[Lone Dog, SASS #20401]

I guess I got the only good Stoeger ever to come out of the factory. Used it for 10 years and it's never failed.

 

Post #3.

 

16+ years and counting.

[Jefro, SASS#69420]

Baikal

 

Jefro

[McCandless]

I've gone through a lot of shotguns. 3 of the Stoegers self-destructed. Two of those, the forward lug sheared off during use... really screws up yer match times! Another one, the buttstock started cracking and flaking apart during a stage, totally disintegrated. It became unshootable, but obviously I had parts from the previous Stoeger to replace it with... but only after the match was over!!

Still have one remaining Stoeger that is a backup for multi-day matches. Three Cut is working on rebuilding one of the ones the lug sheared off of, to see if it can be made to safely hold up under use.

 

There are pards that use the Stoeger as their every-match gun. I've not been able to do that... wish I could've, I love that fat forestock for shootin' BP. But, they just don't like me.

 

McC

[Slowhand Bob, 24229]

The main problem I have had with my Baikal is a sore bird finger and that is my favorite peace sign to! The Baikal is not very slick but it works and I am afraid to get any more of them high end shotgun fixes that disables a good gun! My second Stoeger was purchased new with an action job and it was slicker than snot but started opening after the first the first round was fired and this was at the first match it was used in. Took it to a different smith and was told that it was dangerously over-smithed, so he fixed it. First match after that fix it was much less slick but started needing a second cock to get the second barl to fire. Less than a box of shells through it and it hasnt been out of the safe in two years! When I bury it I will mark the grave stone, doctored to death. Got one of those brand new '97 pumps and an '87 model that all came from various 'MASTER SMITHS' in unworkable order. The best shotgun I have is an old CC hammer double with his custom job.

[Hollifer A. Dollar]

The main problem I have had with my Baikal is a sore bird finger

 

+1 on the injured birdie finger. I just got finished rebluing my baikal trigger guard after rounding off all the sharp edges.

 

I took a chance on a used double found at a gun shop trying to save money...which had no firing pin return springs so they stuck in the primers when shot. I had to break it open over my knee, otherwise it shot well. When shooting the 2nd match with that gun, the stock broke through the pistol grip. The way it was designed, there was no steel rod through the stock into the receiver. Rather than try to fix it, I just bought a baikal.

 

It is definitely built like a tank, but shoots like a champ. The only tuning I have done on it is to put in Papa Dave's modified cocking levers, polish the chambers & the trigger guard edges. The cocking levers do help a lot. They are an easy DIY modification.

[Rooster Ron Wayne]

well every thing comes in threes .

I have the other two Stoegers with out any issues here !

The Stoegers have been rilly good guns to me.

I wish i could do it with Sturm Rugers but what a unnecessary expense that would be.

So the Stoeger has served me well.

GOD BLESS THE USA !!!

[Ghost, SASS #50125]

Boom Pop, are you still shooting Classic Cowboy?

 

Ghost

[Garrison Joe, SASS #60708]

Now that EAA is importing Baikals again, there is almost no reason to not use one.

 

Seriously, though, the lack of imports for a year to two was becoming a little bit of a cause for caution. But, importing has started again. Have had better luck with Baikal than the Stoeger. Stronger gun, easy to slick up.

 

And, as others have stated, there are better hammerless shotguns if you are willing to pay twice as much.

 

Good luck, GJ

[boom pop]

no buddy, i am back in the pits, i just couldnt get along with 1 handed pistol shooting, pop

 

Boom Pop, are you still shooting Classic Cowboy?

 

Ghost

[Six-Shot]

I've got two Baikals (both with double triggers, one with external hammers) and two Stoeger Supremes. I like 'em all but I use the Baikals for blackpowder because I feel that they are more rugged than Stoegers and can take the heavy loads and subsequent recoil. I use the Stoegers with smokeless powder and a lighter load. One of the Baikals sprung the center rib and I had to have it spot welded. One of the Stoegers has opened inadvertently on occasion because the rear lug metal is soft and is wearing down from use so it doesn't stay engaged with the cross bolt lock. Let's face it, cowboy guns take a pounding and these are not expensive hunting/trap guns.

[Nate Kiowa Jones #6765]

Here is an interest tidbit.

Stoeger Coach Gun fails proof test.

I'm not surprised. It has been report here many time that the Stoeger tends to come open when fired even with CAS loads. Some attribute it to the reduced latch spring but I feel the spring should not be the solution. The Stoeger lockup design is poor. The locking bolt to lug angle is too sever.

 

For an entry level priced SXS, now days I steer my customers toqard the Russian made Baikal. For years they were imported by EAA of Florida, then Remington as their Spartan Gunworks line. Now, they are under the USSG banner which is a sub of EAA. EAA is still doing the service and parts for these guns. From a gunsmiths point of view parts is important. The Stoegers have had a history of poor support since Benelli bought them out.

 

As you have read some of these gun are breaking the forend hanger off or pulling the ribs loose from the barrel or even braking the lugs. A word of caution for both the Stoeger and the Baikal. Just changing or modifying the cockers and/or reducing the hammer springs so the gun will open wider can lead to these problems. It has been reported several times on the wire.

What happens when the cockers and/or reducing the hammer springs alone are done is, the lug hook tries to roll off the hinge pin forcing the fore-iron hard into the forearm hanger/lug there on the bottom of the barrel when the gun is slammed open. The heavy hammer springs dampen this effect. To avoid these problems go easy on reducing the springs and cockers. The Stoeger and the Baikal can be made to open wide, stay open without having this problem but it is more involved than just reducing springs or modifying the cockers. The hinge area needs to be retimed so it will open wider but the hammers go to full cock early in the opening. The extra travel will allow the hammer springs to cushion the opening and when it springs back, the gun is still open enough to reload.